Marriage question regarding Visas...

[Chris F]

I am bringing my novia here on a Finance Visa. I prefer this process because I know it is easier and faster .......but I know that she would prefer to marry in Lima Peru....Is it possible to marry her there....but still "make it official" in the United States by marrying her here?

Thanks in Advance for the feedback!!!

[doombug]

... in response to Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Chris F on Jan 8, 2005

If you marry in Peru, it'll already be official in the U.S.  You can't make someone get married AGAIN to prove something.

I got married in San Borja, Lima, and they offered two types of marriage certificates (we purchased both types):  one for her, a resident of Peru; and another for foreigners, for use outside of Peru.

My employer accepts foreign marriage certificates, both for our internal human resource purposes (benefits, and such), and also they are accepted from our clients to establish identity.

All BCIS asks is that you have a certified translation of  your marriage certificate prior to forwarding it with your I-130/I-129F paperwork.

Peace out!

[Ray]

... in response to Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Chris F on Jan 8, 2005

Pick one. You can’t have it both ways.

It is illegal to enter the country on a fiancée visa if she is already married. Even if you have some sort of “fake” wedding ceremony, she may have to lie her way through the visa interview and POE questioning if they ask her if she is married, which happens fairly often.

My advice: Forget about which method is “easier and faster” and do it right. If your bride really wants a wedding in her hometown, then try to make it happen and then file for a spouse visa. It may not take as long as you think. The wedding day is the one day when the bride should have it her way, IMHO.

Ray

[kented]

... in response to Re: Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Ray on Jan 8, 2005

Ray's advise is always on point and helpful.  My wife and I got marries, without fanfare, in a lawyer's office in Heredia, Costa Rica.  It took a year to get her here but my family now has immigrant visas (conditional and automatically permanent with an application after two years of marriage).

[utopiacowboy]

... in response to Re: Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Ray on Jan 8, 2005

n/t

[surfscum]

... in response to Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Chris F on Jan 8, 2005

We're in the same boat: I'm engaged to a Limeña, we have the K1 interview on 2-14 and hope to return to Lima for a second wedding ceremony in June. What I have found out is that if you grease the palm of the local catholic priest you could have a service there without any legal paperwork.  As was posted elsewhere, it is not recognized by the Peruvian govt., so you´re not technically married.  Should the US govt find out about it, it would stop the K1 process and you would be forced to do the K3.

Evangelical churches won´t hear of the idea of a wedding ceremony not being legitimate: you´ll be shown the door quickly if you ask. So what we will do is get married here, go back in June and have a big ceremony in an evangelical church,  since we´ll already be married. If the church still won´t do it, we might look at a ceremony in a catholic church.

BTW, plan to be at her visa interview: several posters on visajourney.com have had visas denied until the american petitioner attends.

Buena suerte!

[kented]

... in response to Re: Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by surfscum on Jan 8, 2005

What you are talking about, technically, is having a marriage CEREMONY without actually getting married.  That would be the same as not getting married and would satisfy your wife's desire to have her family present and not interfere with the K-1 process since you are officially not married.

[utopiacowboy]

... in response to Re: Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by surfscum on Jan 8, 2005

Are you both Catholic? I find this strange. The Catholic Church where we were married in Colombia had more paperwork requirements than anyone.

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by surfscum on Jan 8, 2005

You said: “Should the US govt find out about it, it would stop the K1 process and you would be forced to do the K3.”

Actually, that would be the best case scenario. It is more likely that they would deny her visa and possibly even ban her for life for attempted visa fraud. Is it worth taking that chance?

Ray

[Gary Bala]

... in response to Re: Re: Marriage question regarding Visa..., posted by Ray on Jan 8, 2005

Thanks, Ray.
The path of "getting married" in her home country,
and then attempting the I-129F fiancee visa process,
(or even trying this while the fiancee visa process
is pending) is fraught with dangers.

The reason is that the I-129F process for fiancee visa
is intended for "fiances" (i.e. those "engaged to marry"),
not married couples. Thus, obviously, a "lawful civil
marriage" option in her home country is out.

Even a Catholic or other Church wedding which is not yet
registered with local civil authorities is however usually notated
in the marginal notes of her church Baptism or Birth Certificate,
and this will be caught by Embassy when her final documents
are reviewed before visa issuance, resulting in visa denial
(this has happened before).

The fiancee visa application process at Consulate (and even
sometimes the immigration officer Port of Entry interview)
can and will ask the lady if she is a fiancee or already married.
Thus, she may be forced into a misrepresentation if she
wants to try and continue with the fiancee visa, which triggers
serious penalties for fraud and misrepresentation such as
permanent exclusion from the U.S.

Some couples who want the benefit of materializing their commitment
to each other in front of her Mom and other family with a "ceremony"
have done a simple "engagement party or social". Another possibility for
Catholics is this. Although I am not a Catholic law expert, my
understanding is that in the Catholic regime, a couple can do  
something called a "blessing of the rings" engagement ceremony
which serves the same purpose of ceremonializing their commitment
to each other as an "engaged" couple, without it being an actual Church
marriage or notated as such.

Good luck, gentlemen.

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Marriage question regarding ..., posted by Gary Bala on Jan 9, 2005

Good point Gary!

I don’t think the engagement ceremony is widely used in the Roman Catholic Church. I have never seen one or been invited to one, but I have heard of similar ceremonies overseas. I think it’s another of the regional customs and traditions that you might find in different societies, like the blessing of the animals, house blessings, car blessings, quinceaneras, etc. If there is some local custom or ceremony that will satisfy everyone without actually performing a wedding, then that is certainly one option. I know of several guys married to Vietnamese ladies and a large traditional engagement ceremony was done over there before she came over on a fiancée visa.

Where some folks have gotten into trouble is with the “unregistered” or “non-legal” weddings where there is no official government documentation. If the lady considers herself married, then she may have some major problems during the interview. Some of those consular officers and border/customs inspectors are really shrewd and able to tell if someone is hiding something just by observing their mannerisms or the answers to seemingly innocent questions. I have heard of people getting denied or delayed by a lengthy investigation because they suspected that the lady was married already when applying for or using a fiancée visa. Some typical questions used to try to trip her up during the visa interview or at the Port of Entry are: “Have you met any of your husband’s family?”, “Is your husband here at the airport to meet you?”, “What date were you married?”, or “When is your wedding anniversary?”. Some of the interviewers will look directly in their eyes and ask them if they are already married. Sometimes they will look for a wedding band on her finger or a mark from a ring.

I know a lot of guys have done the “fake wedding” before she came over with the K-1 visa and they didn’t have any problems, but a few have been busted because the lady was not a good liar or acted overly nervous when questioned about her marital status. In Manila, if they even suspect she may be married, they might refer the case to an investigations unit and everything gets put on hold for months. Some have even been turned back by the immigration agents at the airport and sent back home on the next flight.

I just think there is too much emphasis on “which way can I get her here the fastest”. Is it worth it to put the little lady through all that stress and possibly face fraud consequences just to save a few months of waiting? That’s why I recommend choosing the method that is right for both of you and following the rules. There will be a lot less stress involved and waiting a few months longer won’t kill you. With a nice traditional wedding in her hometown, your bride and her family will cherish the memories forever and they will respect you even more for doing what was right and not just what was convenient for yourself.

Ray

[Gary Bala]

... in response to Re: Marriage question, posted by Ray on Jan 9, 2005

[This message has been edited by Gary Bala]

Thanks again, Ray.

Two points come to mind:
1. "Do the right thing." "Better safe than (maybe) sorry."
"Patience is golden." (I myself know firsthand and everyday how
fast people want their visas, and IMHO people's patience is the
most important part of the immigration and visa process.)
2. As you say, the wedding day belongs to the lady bride.
"The bride is in charge of the wedding, and the groom
is in charge of the honeymoon."  

Best regards.

[utopiacowboy]

... in response to Re: Marriage question, posted by Ray on Jan 9, 2005

Dang, Ray, you've got a knack for saying exactly what I'd say in the same circumstances. I did what you advised in your last sentence and I have absolutely no regrets. Weddings mean a lot to a woman and it really helps to get things started on the right foot by getting married in her country with all her family and friends present. It seemed like my wife spent the whole time waiting for her K-3 visa showing her wedding photo album to anyone who wanted to see it.

[latinmatt]

... in response to Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Chris F on Jan 8, 2005

Simple answer...Get married in both places.
Get married there but don't tell the governemnt.  You can always have a simple courthouse ceremony in the states to satisfy the government requirements.

[Craig]

... in response to Marriage question regarding Visas..., posted by Chris F on Jan 8, 2005

If get married there you will not be able to file for a fiance visa. You can get married there and bring her over later or get married here on the fiance visa and get married within 3 months... but you cannot get married in Peru and then file a 129F.