A bit unsettled

[Miguel]

... in response to Re: Re: A bit unsettled, posted by Locii on Jan 2, 2004

Your post seems a little contradictory.  First, "I'm not seeking to ban him or start a flame war."  Then later an excerpt from "Discussion Board Rules -- 4. No discussions of prostitution," including the part about immediate expulsion from PL for all offenders.  And previously an explanation of why giving a girlfriend $150/month is the same thing as paying for a prostitute in Calipro's case.

It looks like you're trying to get him banned.  I hope that doesn't happen.  While you and I may have a different idea of what represents a successful relationship, Calipro's posts have been (and hopefully will continue to be) a good source of information and entertainment.

[Dean]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: A bit unsettled, posted by Miguel on Jan 2, 2004

This is an interesting discussion....

I happen to enjoy calipro's posts and admire the way he refutes some challenges...

While not adhering to all his principles I'd have to say he has a fine sense of discerning beauty in colombian women.

He's had some good luck with the ladies and some bad luck with the ladies as do all of us who are involved with this pursuit for any length of time...

at least he has the decency to send some money to the lady of the moment...
This is far more than what many of us are considerate enough to do...

I've watched at least 8 men from America, Spain, England and Switzerland play with the emotions and life of my sister in law over the last few years....

exceptional, successful men that all took advantage of her situation and no one with such a short time of involvement offered to help finacially in any way...

$150 goea a long way to help and is really such a paltry sum if one is interested...it can make a hugh difference in Colombia and its good for dinner here....

[lometogo]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: A bit unsettled, posted by Dean on Jan 2, 2004

Here, here. However Calipro's giving $150/month is viewed or judged, the recipient benefits. Bravo for Calipro.

[Miguel]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: A bit unsettled, posted by Dean on Jan 2, 2004

[This message has been edited by Miguel]

No kidding.  There are people here who will tell you you're a smuck or a "John" if you send a Colombiana $150 a month.  Well, in Colombia that small amount can be the difference between a reasonable existence and living like an animal. I've sent money to women who I have no intention of ever sleeping with or marrying.  And to one who I did sleep with but have no intention of marrying.  Generally it was because of illness in the family.  One of the women lied to me a couple of times, I think.  But given that she had an invalid mother and grandmother and a younger sister to support, I don't regret it for a minute.  So call me an idiot or a whoremonger or whatever. I guess I'm guilty.

And to those who would condemn this, I'd ask what you're doing looking for a wife in a third world country in the first place.  If you want someone who you know isn't interested in your money or your citizenship, someone for whom a few extra dollars aren't going to mean the difference in whether there's food on the table or medicine for a sick child, then you need to be looking in the USA or Europe.

[Ralph]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A bit unsettled, posted by Miguel on Jan 2, 2004

I have sent money to my novia many times. I pay for the rent, the phone, the internet, etc etc etc. The difference is I don't say that she is "kept". I don't say that she has zero chance of ever going to the states. I don't say that I will never marry her. If one brags about getting laid for free, and describes it as an intimate relationship, the it is a P4P relationship.

I don't see anything wrong with that if both parties agree on the terms. He has said that the girl wants to marry him, so I would wager that his idea and her idea of the relationship differs greatly.  

He has talked about how he can string them along indefinitely as well. Another poster said it best. It is not a matter of morals. . . .it's a matter of class. . . .or lack there of.

[Calipro]

... in response to sending money, posted by Ralph on Jan 3, 2004

I didn't meet this girl in a marriage agency so there has never been the persumption that this is what the relationship is about. I'm sure even you Ralph have had girl friends whose company you enjoyed and really didn't have any intentions of marrying them. Maybe you didn't give them any money but this particlar girl was really in a bad situation. The garge that I keep my car in is 100 better than where she was living.

You can slander me all you want but my relationship with this girl is not a P4P relationship. I do have feeling for this girl or I wouldn't be helping her out. But, I seriously doubt if I would ever marry a women with a child.

I have told her she should join a marriage agency and look for a husband. Hell, I even took her to a couple but she wouldn't join. This is what lead me to believe that she wants more from are little relationship than I was willing to give. But, I really don't know if she has a desire to be married or not. We haven't talked about marriage because I don't want to mislead her.

I take that back. I told once that if she met a guy at a marriage agency and got married and went to the states and it didn't work out she could call me and I would send her a ticket to Phoenix. How's that for being thoughtful? I would even help her get a fake green card and a job if I had to. But, you are right I wouldn't marry her. So what does that make me the Devil??

[mudd]

... in response to I don't think so......, posted by Calipro on Jan 3, 2004

Help her get a fake green card?, no, not the devil, but kind of unethical, as if we don’t already have enough illegals running around with fake green cards, drivers licenses and social security cards. I hope you were kidding.

[Ralph]

... in response to I don't think so......, posted by Calipro on Jan 3, 2004

Sure I've had tons of girls that I had no intentions of marrying. They were not considered girlfriends as I reserve that for monogamous relationships. I also didn't post about how she was "kept". Or talk about what a great deal she was for 150 bucks per month.

As another poster said. Sometimes when they get a taste of a "better life" it is hard to go back. Many "hookers" don't wake up one day and say today I will be a hooker. In many cases they feel like they can make a guy love them, or have dreams of a serious relationship.

Many girls that have been "kept" a few times and dissapointed with the end result, feel that if they are trading "intimate relationships" for cash, the monthly plan is not as profitable or consistent as straight P4P. If she took cash by the "date" she would always have enough to get by. If you dump her because she doesn't manage the money properly or you meet someone better, what does she do. . . . . .move back to a place worse than your garage.

It is commendable that you "think" you leave all of your women better off than when you met them. I also think you think soley in terms of how much better they are financially. Not much thought goes into the emotional aspect. My dos centavos.

[beenthere]

... in response to I don't think so......, posted by Calipro on Jan 3, 2004

Everyone knows that Calipro and I haven't seen eye to eye on alot of things, but I feel I need to defend him on this one (anyone surprised?).  Everything he has posted about this girl's situation is true..........A few guys who are mutual friends of ours told me about CP's relationship with the girl, met her a few times.....(CP and I were in Cali at the same time).........seems the girl is in a very tough situation, and needs help.  I met her in person and she is a very beautiful woman.  CP did offer to get her into an agency, but evidently she refused (according to my friends).  I have had problems with CP's theory on "keeping" women, but I feel in this case, he is doing the right thing, whether she is using him (or vise-versa) or not.  
Deep down inside CP is a good guy.........I think he has some very strong feelings for this girl (just my hunch).  He knows alot of beautiful women in Cali that don't have children, but he chose to spend the majority of his time with her..............
As Dallas Steve has posted many times, I think CP likes to portray a persona on this board that is not exactly himself, and he likes to play with alot of you guys.  Don't underestimate any compassion that he might have for this girl.
Happy New Year!!

[mar33]

... in response to Re: I don't think so......, posted by beenthere on Jan 3, 2004

Beenthere,
   I think this girls looks and her poor situation have had many feeling very sorry for her. But as Calipro has been so open to admit( I respect a man who will lay all his cards on the table) she has lied and told her landlord  Calipro did not leave her with any money, in order to get the landlord to lend her 100,000 pesos after she spent all of the money Calipro gave her. He also admits she stole money from him.

   Though this girl may seem sweet and say all of the right things, her true nature is coming through when she is given a chance for a better oppurtunity. Instead of her being careful with her money because she also has a little boy to think about. She spent it carelessly and is willing to put her and her son into a situation where they could be homeless(If she cannot pay her landlord).
 
   Also, we have to remember $150 US dollars is a lot of money down there. More than the monthly minimum wage. So she can be motivated by the money. Once money comes into the equation, it can destroy the best of intent.

 I have learned in life that a woman's personality will come to light she is given a better oppurtunity. She either is grateful and wise,and appreciative. Or is ungrateful and feels entitled to more. Also a woman will tell you almost anything to keep the man who is suppying the goods around.We all know that.

    I think Calipro would be smart to take anything she says with a grain of salt.I admire him fortruly understanding she is not marriage material.

[Dean]

... in response to Re: I don't think so......, posted by beenthere on Jan 3, 2004

Nice post beenthere

[surfscum]

... in response to Re: I don't think so......, posted by beenthere on Jan 3, 2004

It's reassuring to read your post, especially since you and he have your share of differences. Whether he is posing when he writes about what he can get for $150/month I don't know, but such a statement does make it appear that he thinks about relationships in terms of what he can get and to see how little he has to put in to get it.

What CP has the opportunity to do is to make a long-term change in this woman's life, even if things don't work out. It's so easy for us gringos to blow in and out of the lives of these women, but they wake up to the same reality day after day. If things don't work out and this woman returns to her former situation, her desperation will be greater and she might turn to more desperate means of making money. Supporting a mother and child is NOT a short-term commitment, nor should it be taken lightly.

The act of giving up part of ourselves to put into another persons life, to give from our abundance to meet the basic needs of another is an opportunity, not a burden. It can also bring out the best in us. I'd like to see CP stop posing and show us the best in him.

[Ralph]

... in response to a hostile witness, posted by surfscum on Jan 3, 2004

Great post. I have helped out girls that a buddy of mine has dated. I have bought cell phones or clothes for women I dated.
I think that is different than saying she is "kept" and posting about what one could get for $150 per month. CP was the one that drew that correlation, he brought up the "intimate relationship", and how wortyh it the 150 bucks was.

I have no problem with it, just find it a bit tacky and lacking class. YMMV

[Calipro]

... in response to Re: a hostile witness, posted by Ralph on Jan 3, 2004

[This message has been edited by Calipro]

Ralph

I could say that I met this girl and that we shared some special moments together and I really have feelings for her eventhough we just met. I feel obligated to help her out and help her change the direction of her life.

Then I am a sucker being taken for a ride.

Or I could say that she is a kept women and well worth the $150 dollars I send her a month.

Then I am a user and abuser.

You know the both statements are not mutually exclusive. They could both be true.

I could be a sucker and a user. HeHeHe!!

NO I mean I could still have sincere feelings for this women and also think she is a bargain at $150 a month.

Anyway you can never win around here no matter what you say.

[Ralph]

... in response to judge and jury, posted by Calipro on Jan 3, 2004

You repeatedly "brag" abouyt how you are not such a nice guy. No need to do that. . . . it's redundant.