Another one bites the dust...

[Travis]

... in response to You misunderstood...., posted by LP on Oct 5, 2003

LP, I think the abuse numbers in the MOB marriages is a bit skewed, just a personal opinion. How many of the abuse claims are nothing more than an attempt to use the VAWA to obtain a green card? Mine was and I was either fortunate or anal retentive enough to have overwhelming evidence to the contrary. How many men get blindsided and their only defence is his word verses hers. A person is not going to falsly claim abuse unless they have something to gain by it and an automatic green card is too much incentive! Of coarse this depends on the person as I beleive that most women would never make such a claim and only the truly dispicable do...my ex :-)

I wanted to make a point about the legislation being passed and I think most here would agree that it's intent is respectable and needed but the approach won't work. Any background check should be conducted with the filing of the I-129 because there is no way to avoid it. Otherwise, as the current bill is written, all an agency need do is move offshore, and they will.

But even if the bill is re-written to change when the background check is conducted, something has to be done to stop the abuse of the VAWA. I think that an amendment to the INA stating that if a person is found to have used the VAWA in bad faith and made fraudulant claims, that person should do some amount of minimum jail time, deported without the oppurtunity of appeal and permenently denied receiving a US visa. The problem in Congress as I see it is that 1) they evidentally don't know the whole process, therefore are applying the background check at the wrong point in the process and 2) have no intention nor desire of protecting the men (the citizens).

If they were to add these two amendments to the INA and process, I think they would be able to warn these girls of a man's history and at the same time discourage a girl marrying solely for a visa. They won't stop all of them, that I'm sure of, but it may help some.

[KenC]

... in response to You misunderstood...., posted by LP on Oct 5, 2003

that the larger the age difference, the more likely it is that someone will be killed?  LMAO!  OH, and that LP is the only OBJECTIVE poster?  You have such a hard on for anyone involved with a RW that it is you that lacks objectivity my friend.
KenC

[Globetrotter]

... in response to So, am I to understand......., posted by KenC on Oct 5, 2003

Ken,don't be so sensitive.  You already passed several tests.  Your squeeze didn't leave after she arrived, nor after she got her green card, and I think you've hit just past 4 years.  So....so far, so good.  Now, make it past 7 then go for 10, then 15...and more.  You are very lucky in that you broke the "age" rule, and are living many other's fantasies, and are "getting away with it."  Also, I think you are a good catch, in that many age groups would have been happy to have you in their company.  You chose young, and that's OK.  Your avenue takes more work, and has more risk, depending on how you think, how you are, how good of a provider you are, and so many other things.  But, so far it has worked for you.  You are the exception....so "be" the exception.  Make it work, but make it work for you.  I would never think to do what you have done.  By that, I mean that it would be too much work for me to keep up with someone half my age, and I don't want babies at 51.

After 3 years in the game, I sometimes think I'm nuts for starting this venture.  I have always thought like our "piss on the campfire guy...LP" in that girls are girls wherever you meet them.  As hard as I try to "guess" right,
I can still be burned...emotionally, but that's the same chance as I take with a squeeze over here.  I think LP talks most about guys that are true "misfits" looking for love in all the wrong places, for all the wrong reasons.  You, my friend, don't fit that catagory.  Guys who think that bringing a squeeze here, and "showing her the good life" because you have a blue passport with an eagle on it,
are truly "pissing up a rope."  It is they who will learn the hard way!  You, Ken , have much work ahead of you, which I don't envy, but you have a great chance to succeed,
and you probably will....but that is because of you, and how you think, and how you provide.  

Keep the shiny side up man.

PS:  Met her 5 times over 3 years.  Her 9 year old thinks I'm her Dad...well, good pal anyway.  Will see her again somewhere in the Med soon.  3 inches of correspondence are now more like 7......and I'm still thinking maybe, maybe not.  Great Irish saying...."It's a great life if you don't weaken."

[LP]

... in response to Re: So, am I to understand......., posted by Globetrotter on Oct 6, 2003

[This message has been edited by LP]

...You're right, most of what I have to say is directed at the misfits who need it. Some are even married. They had problems no women could solve long before they married and they haven't changed. You're also correct in that I feel Ken is an exception and I wish him well. I know he's aware of this, I've spoken to him a few times off board. It's true he and I feel  different about women in general but that doesn't mean either of us will fail on those merits alone.

As I said, I was a bit angered at the death of this girl because I've dealt with so many of these loser types over the years. Ken may have allowed his bias to enter into his comments and thats understandable given his situation and our differing viewpoints on reality versus romance.
In addition my blunt style of communication may have factored into it.

The bottom line is time will tell. Ken's not quite in this catagory but I continue to be amused at those who define "success" as simply going over and "quickly" marrying someone who has *publicly advertised* her desire to marry a foreigner and leave her country. I find it laughable to state those who don't do so are without "success". Such ease of "success" is *exactly* why MOB is filled with men who can't do it right. Since I have no problems meeting women I can take all the time I need to find one I'd like to marry (if ever). I'm more than happy to be without such an embarressing "success" story.

The time it takes them to do it is directly proportional to how desparate and lonely they were and it's no wonder they cry success the moment they pull off such an amazing feat of confidence. (And it was an amazing feat...for them.) It's also amazing they would boast of such an act. Whats worse, being a loser or telling the world about it? I just wish the lowerest levels of these clowns would quit sludge pumping the board with how successful they think they were. Who're they trying to convince?

[Stan B]

... in response to I also agree...., posted by LP on Oct 6, 2003

[This message has been edited by Stan B]

nevermind, your not worth the effort.

[KenC]

... in response to Re: So, am I to understand......., posted by Globetrotter on Oct 6, 2003

n/t

[LP]

... in response to So, am I to understand......., posted by KenC on Oct 5, 2003

[This message has been edited by LP]

...saying they'll be killed, this from a guy who claims to know logic when he sees it? Sounds more like an emotional response to me. But it's only common sense to know the greater the age difference the more potential for problems. It'll be interesting to see how you handle it if (or when) your time comes. Of the two people involved, it's the older guy who emotionally fairs the poorest when someone steals his candy.

As for having a hard on, I still have a good time when I go over but I avoid MOB girls and treat the rest as the game players most readily admit to being. (Just because I have a warm body here doesn't mean it owns me...thats your situation, not mine.) I'm not on the MOB mission, thats what I meant by my objectivity versus those who are. (Or were)

Sure, it'd be a lot easier to manipulate MOB girls but that'd be wrong so try to avoid it. Don't confuse normal R/W women with MOB R/W women, they're as different as MOB men are here. Not all want to run away from home you know. The *vast* majority of women in the FSU aren't into MOB and their opinion of the women who are is low, as is the general FSU public's. And when the news of this killing gets back to Ukraine (and it will) it'll only lower it further. I do better when there by agreeing with them, thats all. (Along with my dislike of Dubya, always a big hit with them.)

We'll never agree on much because you're a romantic who places women on  pedestals while I view them as little more than the ordinary people they are. I simply don't feel the need to do otherwise, not to mention all the grief it saves me. So you see my friend, I share the same hard on as you...only with a different class of people.

[Dan]

... in response to Thats quite a jump...., posted by LP on Oct 5, 2003

I don't even want to comment on that one.  --smile--

- Dan

[LP]

... in response to "share the same hard on" - Yuc..., posted by Dan on Oct 5, 2003


...the Lone Gunman. Appears you were careful about which is for shootin and which is for fun. -smile-

Yeah, that came out differently than I meant it. I understand Ken's point of view but we'll never agree on much. Too bad, we share some common experiences. I simply feel I've learned more from them. He's also a few things I'd like to be...and a few I'm glad I'm not.

My point is the MOB business smells like nothing else, what with all the gypsies, tramps, and thieves on one side and the wackos on the other. Add in the agencies, apartment sharks and crooked translators and one wonders why anyone would deal with it past a certain point when they could strike out on their own. I just get a little bent when I see the damage it causes on any level, from losing cash to getting ones heart ripped out to a dead 26 year old girl in a car with her throat cut.
So sue me...

Hope all is goin OK for you, the little lady, and the youngin. When you get around to it I'd like to know how the other stuff turned out...

[KenC]

... in response to Well, if it isn't....., posted by LP on Oct 5, 2003

LP,
When you say "what with all the gypsies, tramps, and thieves on one side and the wackos on the other. Add in the agencies, apartment sharks and crooked translators and one wonders why anyone would deal with it past a certain point when they could strike out on their own." I have to agree.  But such is life and like life, there will always be a small percentage that will be smart and the vast majority that live it clueless.
KenC

[Patrick]

... in response to Another one bites the dust..., posted by LP on Oct 3, 2003

That makes three women and one man I've heard about being murdered over the past 8 years in mail-order marriages.  Perhaps there is a higher incidence of domestic violence in these marriages, perhaps not.

Don't kid yourself about the legislation.  Even if they did have criminal backgrounds, this wouldn't help.  All it will do is drive all the business off-shore and since they require the businesses to provide to information (instead of making part of the immigration process) the women married through services run by foreigners will get no information at all.

They should have made the requirement that the lady be informed of her rights and responsibilities regarding immigration part of the documentation delivered in the initial paper work for the visa.  They should make a background check mandatory for anyone wishing to immigrate either a spouce or fiancee as part of the immigration process and paid for by the man or woman.

Instead, they're making this all the agency's responsibility with the intent of levying heavy fines for non-compliance.  Seems pretty clear to me that it's either poorly considered legislation, or simply an attack on the agencies.  It will be ineffective at protecting the women.

[WmGo]

... in response to Re: Another one bites the dust..., posted by Patrick on Oct 3, 2003

is actually very low for an eight year time period. Most
homicides in America involve people who are related by
blood or marriage. Crime statistics reflect *thousands* of such murders *each* year. So, if there has only been a few murders in the "MOB" realm in the past eight years, that would actually be *extremely* low. Therefore, that evidence would tend to prove "MOB" marriages have a strikingly low incidence of domestic violence.

FWIW, and since national legislation is being advocated by
some left Coast feminist group, such analysis is more than just FWIW.

13 kopeks from the South

[Michael B]

... in response to Re: Another one bites the dust..., posted by Patrick on Oct 3, 2003

But Patrick, why should anyone trust YOU? You have a vested interest, you're an AGENCY OWNER. Everybody KNOWS that you and your ilk exploit these poor women for power and profit. Now sit back and let Msssss Hyphen-Name and her sob sisters do what they know is best for everybody in the whole world (except of course people like YOU, who prey on these desperite women's dispair and vunlerability, you, you,...TRAFICER).

Disclaimer: The above post is satire, I don't really think Patrick is a bad man (but if I didn't make that clear, somebody would take it litterly), but it sure is a bad piece of legislation.

[Zoidberg]

... in response to Re: Another one bites the dust..., posted by Patrick on Oct 3, 2003

And of those 3 women being murdered, did any of the men have criminal records that would have been found on one of these checks? Did they already have problems before they murdered? I just watched the one on A&E the other night and I do not remember if they said Indle had any record. Would just marrying and divorcing another Russian come up as a red flag on these checks? Not sure if there were domestic violence charges brought up against him in the first marriage.

I tend to agree this legislation probably won't do much. They do need to put the background checks in as part of the process if they do anything. But even that won't stop it as most demestic violence cases happen without any warning that would show up on these checks.

Z.

[WmGo]

... in response to Another one bites the dust..., posted by LP on Oct 3, 2003

[This message has been edited by WmGo]

58 minus 26 = 32 year age
difference = utterly ridiculous.

Also unwise for man of any age
pursuing relationships with FSUW
that young,i.e., she was only 21
when she arrived in USA = 19-20
when first met = just asking for
trouble.

Good eye Pooch Keeper