not to start trouble...bout sex...

[Frank O]

... in response to Completely agree with what Dan says here..., posted by Oscar on Oct 12, 2002

Interesting you mention the lack of religeon. I assume that has a LOT to do with it in terms of the culture. As for satisfying a mans needs that sounds great. I remember one Mexican lady I was with , while we were getting it on I was putting her needs first before I got off & it was interesting that she told me not to worry she wanted to make sure I got what I NEEDED. That was what got me. It was like she was so determined that I would be satisfied & not her. But in a strange way it seemed like it was a duty for her or something. I don't know how to explain it. I guess it boils down to her not wanting me going elsewhere to get it. Sort of like what you mentioned here. I know with AW the attitude is quite different. But I think that applies to just more than sex in general & most of us agree obviously since we are seeking an alternative to AW.

[KenC]

... in response to Completely agree with what Dan says here..., posted by Oscar on Oct 12, 2002

Oscar,
I have to agree with everything you said in your post, just not the title of it.  (I feel Dan took a cheap shot at a certain poster in his post)  I really like what you said in regard to the difference in attitudes between AW and RW.  Your comment, "I see RW as saying MAKE time or else!" is right on the mark.  I have seen more than a few AW who view sex as an unpleasant responsibility.  Kind of like cleaning the bathroom.  Whereas, RW seem to have great pride in fullfilling their man's needs.  I know my wife has the thought process that men have to have a certain amount of sex and if a wife doesn't fullfill the need, someone else might. Subtle difference?  I think not.
KenC

[Dan]

... in response to good post except, posted by KenC on Oct 12, 2002

I did NOT take a "cheap shot" because I did not associate Frank's questions with Mark and his situation.

I was responding to a generic question about a guy that hopped in the sack with an RW within 20 minutes of their first meeting. If that guy was Mark - it was lost on me as I was writing my reply to Frank.

Just FWIW

- Dan

[Oscar]

... in response to good post except, posted by KenC on Oct 12, 2002

.

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Completely agree with what Dan says here..., posted by Oscar on Oct 12, 2002


I am not sure about where you are heading, but before I went to St Pb last year, I read something on the web that said it was one of the three fastest growing countries for AIDS.

So, as always, use caution

[Dan]

... in response to not to start trouble...bout sex..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

Frank,

I have 'dated' quite a number of ladies from Ukraine, and, of course, am married to a wonderful lady now.

You are correct, sex is a sensitive subject on this board - just as it is in most social settings. The posts here that receive the most flak are those that focus on the salacious and are not balanced.

There are very few absolutes on the topic of sex. RW are like AW and HW (Hispanic Women) in that they are simply people with a huge range of behaviors. I have met ladies in their early 20's that claimed to be virgins (and I believe them) - and I have met, and gotten to know well, several ladies that are 'pros'. The range is pretty broad.

You mentioned the example of a gal that jumped into bed with a guy she never met within 20 minutes of meeting him. Well, women have their standards. The type of woman that would jump into bed so quickly is clearly a rarity - unless, of course, it is their individual custom (job) to do so.

It has been interesting over the years to read about the guys differing experiences. LP claims that RW just don't cut it insofar as sexual creativity goes. He has personal experiences to support his claims. My experience has been different. I've lived in Asia and Europe and can honestly say that the women I've 'known' from Ukraine are among the most passionate and tender lovers I have ever known. There are, of course, exceptions - but it is my general opinion that RW (like many Europeans) grow up in a culture in which sex is dealt with in a more healthy atmosphere than here in America. As a consequence, they take a more healthy view towards it. That does not necessarily drive them to be more, or less, active than women here in America - just a slightly different 'take' on the subject.

Most RW that are serious about marriage will recognize - the same as you expressed in your message - that sex is an important part to any long-term relationship. The only question will be how quickly they wish to enter into that relationship with you - and will it occur during your initial visit there. No-one knows - and no-one can give you quality advice about your individual situation.

As for your friend that's made 3 trips and still has not become intimate with his girl - again, it is entirely situational. Is she a virgin? Have they discussed the topic of sex? Are they (or have they) discussing a marriage together? While I would suggest that under MOST circumstances your friend's situation is unusual, there are too many open questions to know for sure.

Frank - one other thing. I strongly urge you to *TALK* to your girl. If you are serious about this girl being a life-time partner - and she is equally serious - then you may as well start the habit now of open and frank discussions - about anything. Sex is high on the list of things you should feel free to openly discuss.

FWIW

- Dan

[LP]

... in response to 20 Minute RW . . ., posted by Dan on Oct 12, 2002

...a few notes based on my experiences. They aren't meant to be generalizations but they are consistent with some other's. Your mileage may vary.

My comments on the subject were not meant to imply these women were "bad", only that they weren't as experienced as other women I've known. They simply were not as passionate compared to those others. All lacked in technique, a few in personal hygiene. They were willing to please but just didn't have the technical (ease off, thats the only word I could come up with) aspects down, something that can be rectified. (As can the personal hygiene issues.) The bottm line was that not a one of them was exceptional right outta the gate.

I've been fortunate to have had several long relationships with young A/W who were excellent companions in this regard and that could be tainting my view. In additon, the criteria used in judging this kind of stuff is subjective and often personal so I suppose it's all relative. I feel perceived sexual performance often changes with time as each individual learns their partner's likes and dislikes. Many first time encounters are often clumsy and far from what they'll be in the future due to the feelings of apprehension that commonly occur. Besides, the growth of actual love over time can alter these perceptions between partners.

On the other issue, my experience is that these girls can be "won" fairly easily. Not in 20 minutes but normally within a few days of spending lots of time with them. (This even applies to those met without prior correspondence.) Were these girls immoral? I didn't think so. They inculded some very respectable professions and most were in their 30s, divorced with children. (My expeience with FSU girls under 30 is limited so I can't comment.) They all exhibited the usual inhibitions at first but quickly came around after several days. Seemed like normal human beings to me.

My experience suggests these women are certainly not prudes and I do feel they are somewhat "easier" than their American counterparts. Unless you're butt ugly and an ahole, your passport and their hopes (not to mention their own natural curiousity about how A/M perform) make the event fairly common. And as one poster pointed out, attitudes about sex have greatly changed since the collapse of the USSR. The proliferation of pornograhphy there alone demonstrates that.

As Dan states, it's all up to the individuals involved. We're all adults here. (lol, well some of us are) But I'm also leery of any girl who is ready 20 minutes after the first meeting, no matter how long I've "known" her. This knowledge (along with some other observations) only validates a decision I once made to move past such a girl.

Since we're using innuendos today, I'd have to say that what a certain poster knows about these girls would fit into a thimble. First he questions whether another poster is infatuated then offers his belief that people can fall in "love" through letters. For a guy who confesses limited experience he offers prolific advice, most of it reflecting that lack of experience. Although I wish him luck, I believe a day of reckoning will come in his future. After all, "there are none so blind as those who refuse to see." As far as the number of beautiful women seen in UA, I also think he must have been visiting different cities than I.  (lol, maybe my standards just are lower.)

Btw, I disagee with leaving the women out of negative posts. As long as it's not crude I see nothing wrong with mentioning a perceived problem with an individual's choice. If a guy posts lots of information (including his sexual escapades) about her, it's fair game. The perception that any of these girls should be elevated beyond anything but normal human beings strikes me as odd. There are many "right ones" for us all out there, this soulmate stuff is pure nonsense.  After all, you likely feel about this one the same as you did the previous woman you married, at *that* time in your life. And if it goes sour she'll likely invoke the same bad feelings down the road too.  

I'm not against romance but come on, they're just people. Try to excercise some control or you may end up back where you started.

[joe]

... in response to I'll add..., posted by LP on Oct 12, 2002

It pays to hire a professional........

[LP]

... in response to "they weren't as experienced as oth..., posted by joe on Oct 13, 2002

...tight yoey, tight. But some were free, even though they stunk and even though I had to go all the way to southern Ukraine. ;-)

[joe]

... in response to lol..., posted by LP on Oct 15, 2002

nt

[MarkInTx]

... in response to "they weren't as experienced as oth..., posted by joe on Oct 13, 2002

That was funny!

[juio99]

... in response to I'll add..., posted by LP on Oct 12, 2002

Good point on the personal hygiene.  I think it is actually related to 'technique.'  For instance, these FSU women are really big on taking showers.  But they can still come to bed with a smelly 'twa##.'  I actually took the risk of pi$$ing off one lady by instructing her how to wash her twa##.  I said, you can't just stand there with your legs together and wash;  squat down so that everything opens up.  She tried it, much to my relief.  Said she just had never thought about it.

But also, it is true that there is a tremendous diffence in the 'smell factor' from one lady to another, regardless of their care in washing.  Due to body chemistry and related factors, some are going to smell and taste like honey, and some are going to be not so pleasant smelling or tasting.

The trick is trying to match up the honey taste with other desirable factors.  That is where the catch comes in.

JR

[BURKE89]

... in response to Re: I'll add..., posted by juio99 on Oct 13, 2002

Fcuk noblesse oblige.... You're the rabble of ancient times. No more, no less; than the vile smut of '91 France, pontificating from the bowels of their gullets.

Surf's up in H.B.,

Vaughn

[LP]

... in response to Re: I'll add..., posted by juio99 on Oct 13, 2002

....post there JR. Fwiw, I wasn't neccesarily refering to  genital issues and if I was going to be more specific I would have used something less vulgar and more refined. Fwiw, the techniques I was refering to aren't associated with "tw##" washing, as you so gentlemanly put it.

[Oscar]

... in response to I'll add..., posted by LP on Oct 12, 2002

Because I never said anything about "falling in love" through letters... or even "falling in love" period, until the girl has been here for quite a while...