AW's greed delays marriage

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: AW's greed delays marriage, posted by RW on Jun 3, 2002

Please read Paul Krugman's Op-Ed piece " Greed is Bad" in today's June, NY times. (www.nytimes.com)

[Jeff S]

... in response to Re: Re: AW's greed delays marriage, posted by wilmc on Jun 4, 2002

http://www.capitalismmagazine.com/2001/january/ww_virtue_greed.htm

[wilmc]

... in response to Please read Walter Williams oped "T..., posted by Jeff S on Jun 4, 2002

JeffS:  

I enjoy your participation in the discussion.

Appreciate the reference.  It helps if you say where it is published. Thanks to Google I found it.  

I do not think Mr. Williams addresses the unethical, unscrupulous and dishonest practices that have allowed the top 1% of the US population to accumulate 35.1% of the US's total household net worth, Forbes, 1 July 1999.  Or the fact that US CEO's pay themselves 475 times the average manufacturing workers pay, The Economist 30 September 2000. These excesses are, I believe a serious threat to our capitalist systems.  Beware the excesses of greed.

[RW]

... in response to Re: Re: AW's greed delays marriage, posted by wilmc on Jun 4, 2002


My personal suggestion would be Napoleon Hill's "Think and Grow Rich"

RW

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: AW's greed delays marriage, posted by RW on Jun 3, 2002

I appreciate your reply.  I posted the article to inspire some discussion and to learn.  I would be happy to provide more detail on the sources.  The article was printed in the Financial Times and is available on the web.

Concerning the "age range," do you feel that most RW are delaying their marriages into their 30's to find the most financially attractive spouse?

I am interested in the issues you may have with my conclusions.  Please discuss.

[RW]

... in response to Re: Re: AW's greed delays marriage, posted by wilmc on Jun 4, 2002

well, if you look at ANY country - western or eastern Europe, Russia or Ukraine, people ARE getting married later and postponding to have children because they want to achieve more stable financial position.

I can not agree with your conclusions because:
1. Men in USA are getting married much-much later in life as well
2. Women everywhere in the world are selective in the process based on the partner's current (or potential) financial position - it's same old "provider's" instinct

There is just different demographic and economic situation in Russia/Ukraine, so women can not sit and wait as they do in USA. There are aso different society expectations.

What are you trying to achieve with this discussion?

[WmGo]

... in response to AW's greed delays marriage, posted by wilmc on Jun 3, 2002

No comment on your #2, BUT, strongly disagree with your #1.

Why? Because we should never begrudge anyone for what they have honestly gained or acquired. Take a look at the Tenth Commandment.

Your #1 sounds like Karl Marx.

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: greed, posted by WmGo on Jun 3, 2002

Please read Paul Krugman's Op-Ed piece, "Greed is Bad" in todays, 4 June, NY Times,  (www.nytimes.com).

He says it better than I can.

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: greed, posted by WmGo on Jun 3, 2002

Sorry but your reference to the Tenth Commandment, "..honestly gained or acquired." That really made me laugh.

Where have you been my friend?

The only individual I referred to was Bill Gates.  As anyone in the IT industry or the Justice Department can tell you his wealth is based upon the most monopolizing practices employed since the Standard Oil Trust.  Honestly acquired, indeed!

I also refer to the wealth accumulated by corrupt physicians who run Medicaid mills.  Or those who refuse to treat medicaid patients because the fees are too low.

Stock analysts who recommend stocks that they know are dogs because the bonuses are tied to the lousy stock's success.  Remember all those great Dot Com opportunities.

How about those great corporate leaders at Enron?  Or maybe their peers who continue to reap stock options even though the co.s they run are losing money.  In many cases they even get the "rubber stamp" boards to reprice their options so they will still be valuable after the stock value has cratered.  The stockholders can bear the risk.

And the lawyers who get rich assisting their clients to manipulate the tax system so that the clients and the lawyers can avoid paying their fair share of taxes.  So the rest of us can pay more. Or do you employ such a lawyer yourself.  If so, for shame!

Please show me a CEO who is earning more than, no I won't use even J. P. Morgan,s standard, lets say 100 times the average that the employees in his company are earning.  He or she is going to be tough to find. In 1999 average American CEO total compensation was 475 times average manufacturing employee pay. Ref. - The Economist, September 30. 2000.  I also suggest for your reading pleasure "This Stuff Is Wrong", Fortune June 25, 2001.
neither journal, I hope you will agree, spreaders of communist propaganda
That's enough for now.

[WmGo]

... in response to Re: Re: greed, posted by wilmc on Jun 3, 2002

I don't understand why you would laugh at the commandment against coveting another's property.

You seem to be obsessed with jealously and envy over what other people have.

It's best to focus on one's own house and get the log out of thine own eye first.

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: greed, posted by WmGo on Jun 4, 2002

I have been reminded that this forum is not the place to discuss these issues so I will try to make this quick.

I do not laugh at the commandment.  I laugh at how those who justify greed interpret or exploit the commandment to  comdemn those who oppose the greed of a few who are obssessed with acquiring more and more.  

But I realize that the words of the Bible can be manipulated to justify almost anything today.

[WmGo]

... in response to Re: Re: greed, posted by wilmc on Jun 5, 2002

Wilmc,

I understand. That is why when I referred to the commandment I referred to *honest* gain. And *that* is why I did not understand why you "laughed."

Even if a man has made his gain unscrupulously, it is still wrong to covet.

There is nothing in my response that can be interpreted as attempting to "justify greed." I agreed with you on that subject.

The problem is that your original post made a broad stroke and you came across in a way that I can now see is far different than what you meant. Now I understand where you are coming from - you are not jealous of what others have, you are just critical of the *ways* that *some* have made their acquisitons and I agree with you.

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: critiques, posted by WmGo on Jun 5, 2002

OK, Glad we agree.

Now how about those Russian Honeys!

I have had the good fortune of dating three of them and have been delighted with all three.  I must admit, I feel like a cupid, two of the three have married other fellows.  To my delight though we have remained friends and correspond often.

Number three is very special.  I may chase her until she catches me.

I am divorced, after too many unpleasant years of marriage. Also I am and retired.  I am not in a hurry to get married again. I love to travel and it has been my pleasure to invite Russian ladies to accompany me.  Traveling with them has been cheaper than it was to take my wife along and far more enjoyable.  I try to be as honest as I can about my intentions so as not to deceive the ladies.  I have only dated ladies from Moscow.  I visit there a couple of times each year.

Have you experienced other cities in FSU or Eastern Europe that you would recommend?  I am eager to expand my horizons.  

I appreciated our discussion.  If you care to pursue the topic, as you can guess it is a pet peeve, I would be happy to, ourtside the forum.

[WmGo]

... in response to Re: Re: critiques, posted by wilmc on Jun 5, 2002

I recommend that you explore Ukraine, particularly Kiev and Dnepropetrovsk. Kiev is one of the most beautiful cities in the world and is loaded with eligible women. DNP is not as large or pretty but it is also loaded with sincere ladies and it has a feel to it that is more like the real Ukraine than cosmopolitan Kiev, but is still big enough for the visitor to have many things to discover and explore. I also think that Lviv is a fascinating place and one that is hardly mined by Western men.

If you are looking for real adventure in Eastern Europe go to any city in Russia or Ukraine that has a population of less than 500,000 people - what people there would call a "village". *That* is where you will really experience the "real" Russia or Ukraine! And you will be treated so well by people living in meager circumstances that you will be humbled. You will never view life the same.

Be careful and have fun!

[wilmc]

... in response to Re: greed, posted by WmGo on Jun 3, 2002

Plato told Aristotle no one should make more than five times the pay of the lowest member of society
J. P. Morgan said twenty times as much
Jesus advocated a negative differential -That's why they killed him.

I paraphrase Graef Crystal - Bloomburg Columnist and formerly compenstion consultant for corporate boards until he became disgusted by the magnitude of excesses that unaccountable corporate executives were paying themselves at the expense of the stockholders, taxpayers and customers.

The greatest danger to the free enterprise system or capitalism is not communism but the extreme excesses that those few who unjustly manipulate their positions of unaccountable power.

Just my opinion!