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Well my wife came home from the hospital today.  She was in for seven days.  She still has some infection and some abnormalities with her liver, but she is doing much better than last week.  It was quite bad for a couple days and there were concerns they might have to do radical surgery which would have left her deformed.  But fortunately they finally got things under control however it took a heavy physical and emotional toll on her.

The hospital bill was $25,000 as of yesterday.  The bill doesn’t include doctors or any outside lab work she might have had.  She saw 5 or 6 doctors that I know of, 2 who performed surgery, so I am thinking a ballpark figure for the doctors’ bill will be roughly equivalent to the hospital.  So I think I am looking at $50,000.  My wife applied for emergency Medicaid but I don’t know how that will go considering my income.  The amount is now too large for me to pay at once, so I won’t be able to take advantage of the 30% discount for paying at once.  I am considering filing for bankruptcy.  Up till this time I had sterling credit.

This whole episode has caused huge changes in our relationship.   There is no affection from her now either physical or emotional.  She really just wants to go home to Colombia, to something that is familiar.  She misses her family and friends and suddenly all the new friends she made here don’t seem to matter to her.  She hates the United States now because the first doctor made such a bad diagnosis.  She thinks it wouldn’t have happened in Colombia.

I frankly don’t know if our marriage will survive this.  I guess you could make the argument that if something like this could happen then I guess it is best to find out early, but frankly I am emotionally spent and won’t try again with anyone else.

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

Bruce (I hope that's your correct name):

I am very sorry to read about your story.  It is my worst nightmare.  I doubt that I would be as supportive as you have been.  

As far as the financial side, I would probably consider bankruptcy, too.  The way the system is designed I wouldn't feel guilty about it.  Many people don't pay the hospital, so the bill you are seeing isn't just the cost of your services.  They are charging you a large cut of services that other people never pay, largely poor people.  In other words, you're being charged for someone elses surgery, too.

You might also talk to the lawyers again.  Now at $50,000 they might talk to you about suing the first doctor.

My wife got sick several weeks ago (no insurance yet) and when she didn't get better I took her to the hospital.  I would've "toughed it out" if it was me, but women....  Anyway they gave her some pills but all the tests were negative.  She's feeling better now, but I'm not.  

I got the bills Saturday and they are charging $1700 for a few tests.  I'm going to research what the customary charges are, if I can.  I think this bill has been inflated.  I had a similar problem at a hospital two years ago with my ex and the bills were less than $1000.  

If they had told me $1700 up front I probably would've gone somewhere else.  That's what seems patently unfair about the system.  They don't tell you what the price will be before hand.  So what keeps them from putting down any number they want.  

In the end, if they want to collect they have to sue you.

And Aaron's question was in very bad taste.  He should be ashamed and he should publicly apologize if he has any class.

Steve

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

how things are going. I personally would encourage you to try to keep your wife here for a time until she has stabilized medically and your relationship has stabilized.  I may be off the mark here but if it was my wife and marriage was this young I would want to be with her and not separated.

Hang in there and take it day by day.

... in response to Bruce, I am not sure, posted by Edge on Jun 29, 2003

Yes, things are still rocky.  She got pneumonia, (this infection spread remarkably fast through her body) and even though her lungs are clear now, she is very weak.  She talks about going to Colombia, but she doesn't want to go until she has regained her strength so I hope by that time she will have more of a balanced view of things.  She and I are both reacting to all the surprises and we need some stable time before we can figure out how we really feel about things.

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

[This message has been edited by bogota vet1]

You can always earn back the money, you can never get back time.

PS-
Just as a point of discussion, I wonder if she would heal faster emotionally if she temporarly return home for a few weeks?
The family could shower 24/7 with attention, you could get a plan with your finmance going.

Also, the root cause of this infection should be researched, because
saltwater is actually a theraputic environment, I do not see how she got infected in Florida saltwater.

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

Bruce,
What a difficult turn of events.
About the medical bills,I would negotiate with them,maybe get in to a payment arrangement.You can always do a bankruptcy later ,but don't rush in to it unless someone is going for judgements and trying to take assets.
About you wifes mental state.This has probably been very tramatic for her.Her first response is I just want to go home.She might even be thinking if I didn't get married this wouldn't have happened.Colombianas are  close to their families, its almost a childlike reaction.They want to retreat to the security and comfort of mommy and Daddy.
Give her some time.Let her go home if she wants.When she thinks of her baby I think she will be willing to get back in to the marriage.Actually she will probably come around here if you give her time.She is just reacting,that crawl back in to the womb escape from events that are overwhelming.
Hang in there.We are all with you.I think it will work out.

Pete

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

On one hand, I'm glad your wife is out of the hospital and that she is recovering... On the other hand, I am sorry that you two are having to go through this turmoil so soon into your marriage...

Your wife is suffering tremendous physical and emotional stress right now... All you can really do is to be there for her, assure her that you love her and do whatever it takes to support her recovery AND your marriage... Don't compound the problems by adding undue stress right now with concerns over finances...

It is normal for your wife to want to be near her parents and familiar surroundings right now... After all, this has been her support structure for her entire life... Your relationship is fairly new and fragile at this point... The best thing may be to let your wife go home to her parents for a while... If you two are meant to be together, she will realize this and return to you when she feels more secure...

I realize that you are hurting too... Medical emergencies like this one can place a tremendous strain on a relationship... Don't let this crisis destroy what you two have begun to build together... Perhaps some crisis counselling may be in order...

Michael B is correct in that if you pay $100 a month toward the hospital bills, they can't really do anything to you... You would be showing "good faith" in paying something toward the balance... Health care organizations generally do not charge interest on accounts...

Buena Suerte...

Mark

... in response to Re: My wife is home from the hospital, posted by wizard on Jun 29, 2003

I would think the hospital could report to your credit, though at this point I wonder if it would be my credit or my wife's since everything is in her name and social security number.  They have never asked for my social security number even when they requested information for the emergency medicaid application.

Also there are the individual doctors.  I would think they would be more likely to report to the credit bureau for non-payment.

Today my wife's attitude is better though she has morning sickness.  My ex-wife had three small children when we married so I know about raising kids but I have never been through a pregnancy with a woman.  If I had known how un-fun a pregnancy can be (on top of her being sick) I would not have decided to have children again so quickly.  I really wanted another family and of course my wife did, but I think I would have waited a year or two before we had the baby as I barely know what normal is with her.

... in response to Re: Re: My wife is home from the hospita..., posted by lswote on Jun 29, 2003

This is why my new wife and I have decided to wait at least one year before having children... Although we love each other deeeply, there is always the question whether things are going to work, or not... I do not have children either and have never been around a pregnant woman either... Right now your wife's emotions are probably all over the place, not to mention the hormone mood swings that come with pregnancy...

Right now, Ms. F is focusing on school, advanced ESL classes and learning to drive... Plus adjusting to life in the US... Although she is adjusting very well, living together day-in and day-out is a learning process for both of us...

I have to admit, things could not be better for us... My office is only 2 miles from home, so I can come home for lunch and check on my wife... She usually cooks lunch for me every day... And I'm not talking just throwing something in the microwave... I mean cooks!!! We are growing closer every day... We do have our differences, but this is normal for a couple... How you handle these differences is what either makes or breaks a relationship...

I know you two will come through this ok... You both have taken the time to build the foundation for a good relationship prior to making the commitment... It's not like either of us were "one trip wonders"...

Good luck Bruce...

Mark

... in response to Re: Re: Re: My wife is home from the hos..., posted by wizard on Jun 29, 2003

Yes, I know the cooking thing.  My wife won't even make hot chocolate unless it is Colombian chocolate on the stovetop (she brought 3 or 4 two pound bricks with her in her luggage when she came).  I am addicted to hot chocolate with Colombian cheese and these little Colombian crackers called Caladitos and when she was in the hospital I started making the hot chocolate with Nestle's Quik in the microwave.  Now that she is home she is not ready to do any cooking yet so I made some hot chocolate with Nestle's Quik last night and she was not happy about it.

My oldest step-daughter from my first marriage got pregnant when she was 17 and had the baby while living with her mother and I.  She was pretty crabby during the pregnancy but she had been copping an attitude for several years so I put it down to that, but after seeing my wife now it makes me wonder about my step-daughter.

I guess we should have waited for the pregnancy, but she wanted a baby and I feel at my age (49) I might as well get started as soon as I can so I can live long enough to be around for the kids to grow up.  My father died when I was young (he was only 33) and I know what it like to only have one parent and I would prefer our kids have two at least till they are out of high school.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: My wife is home from the..., posted by lswote on Jun 29, 2003

Bruce,HANG IN THERE! I remember meeting your wife and you in Bogota.She is a good woman who is going through a VERY rough time.I would recommend that you keep her here until things settle down.Hasty decisions are usually bad ones.The credit agencies will report and since you are married YOU are responsible.I am a Realtor and I see this all the time.
I would also recommend life insurance.If something happens to you(and it will someday as it does all of us) your kid
and wife won't become wards of the state.Keep plugging.

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

Inquiring minds want to know !!!!

... in response to Are you telling us a story about this wh..., posted by Aaron on Jun 29, 2003

Aaron, I don't know if it is just me but you are some piece of work.  Are you sure that you have an education?  I don't see any evidence of it in what you wrote.  You have repeatedly made mention of the fact that you have no time for nonsense.  You are generally involved with some big school project,yet you frequently participate in mindless slighting of others.  Are you making the school thing up, or the story about the woman you met on your last trip to Columbia?  Did you even go to Columbia?  Come on!!! snap out of it, some of us live in the real world with real jobs, real responsibilities and yes real problems.  Don't you have some home work to do?

... in response to Are you telling us a story about this wh..., posted by Aaron on Jun 29, 2003

Aaron,
I won't be hard on you like other guys here.It sounds like you were wondering if this whole thing was made up.If you just followed the last couple of weeks I could understand how you might think that.But Bruce has been around about 10 months now.I  have followed his story from the start and spoken to him on the phone.He is for real I am sure.He has been so honest telling us things a person would not usualy tell.I can't immagine him making it up.

Pete

... in response to Are you telling us a story about this wh..., posted by Aaron on Jun 29, 2003

whats the matter with you??????? Any Guy can be unlucky in their search for Love and Happiness abroad..Can even happen to You!!

... in response to Are you telling us a story about this wh..., posted by Aaron on Jun 29, 2003

What a strange person you are??  You like to kick a brother when he is down??

Iswote has more class than you have in your little finger as well as a ton more credibility.  I think Iswote will pull through this because he has heart.

Grow up or find someone who will mentor you about how to interact with people.

... in response to Are you telling us a story about this wh..., posted by Aaron on Jun 29, 2003

Aaron, if it wasn't for the fact this board has had too many stories told, I would be very offended by your question.  As it is, all I can say is wizard has met me and my wife in person at LAI in Bogota.  pablo has met me at LAI in Bogota.  I have talked to Pete E on the phone.  Of course none of them can vouch for my story, but they can vouch that I do exist and wizard can vouch that I am married to a Colombiana from Bogota.

I wish this story was just a story, but it isn't.  I am sorry I am even posting it, because I know many guys would just as soon not read about it, but the truth is I don't have many friends and I don't have an outlet of anyone to talk to and it is very difficult to make sense of things right now and to know what the right thing to do is.  This board is the closest thing to a group of friends that I have.

... in response to Re: Are you telling us a story about thi..., posted by lswote on Jun 29, 2003

Bruce,

Late last night I read the board and saw your current post.  I was going to reply then because my heart went out to the two of you but didn't because I was so tired.  I had a hard time sleeping brother because of the situation you are going through and worse, what you recently felt.

Wizard and others have responded with good advice but I want to also encourage you to hang in there man!  Keep loving that wife of yours and I know you guys will pull through.  As a result your marriage will be much, much better and stronger.  

You are a good guy and your wife is a sweetheart.  After all you guys have been through it's worth fighting for rather than thinking about throwing in the towel.  Both of you are going through the wringer, so just try to love her and meet her needs.  She will appreciate that immensely and it will pay off later.  Her being homesick now and wanting to go back home isn't a slam on you.  I'd think many of these Latinas get terribly homesick and with your wife now, even more so.  It will pass if you are an encouragement to her.  

I am glad you feel free enough to share your stories with us here on the board.  We are all pulling for you and in time things will work out.

One last thing, no more Nestle's Quick, make the real stuff.

Pablo

... in response to Re: Are you telling us a story about thi..., posted by lswote on Jun 29, 2003

Well, allow me to be very offended for you (and I think others will agree with me). I saw this post and was trying to think of what to say to chastise Aaron without hurting you, and while I was thinking about it, you posted.

Aaron: A man, who has been here long enough that we know he is NOT prone to telling tales nor engaging in flame wars, came here and said that he has a serious problem and that he's hurting. He asked for our help and you responded by calling him a liar? ZERO credibility for you, Mister self proclaimed 'nice guy'.

... in response to Re: Re: Are you telling us a story about..., posted by Michael B on Jun 29, 2003


I had to refrain from responding to Aaron's post earlier this morning myself, as it is up to Bruce to speak for himself... But now that Bruce has replied, I have to say that Aaron, you are a PUTZ for even doubting this thread...

Why would ANYONE put themselves in the spotlight, even here, on such a delicate topic??? In case you failed to realize it, this forum is a form of support for many people in the process... Not just to talk about the hottest babe, or the best agency, or the cheapest airfare... Outsiders to this process have a difficult time relating to some of the issues we deal with in an inter-cultural relationship... Good, bad or otherwise...

As Bruce indicated, I have met both he and his wife in Bogota... I can attest to the fact that yes, they are married... Had you taken the time to look at Bruce's profile, you would have found links to photos of their marriage and honeymoon...

As Michael stated, not the sort of behavior one would expect from a god-fearing, christian, abstinate, "nice guy"...

Oh, that felt good...

... in response to Re: Are you telling us a story about thi..., posted by lswote on Jun 29, 2003

Bruce,

I think everyone here is 100% behind you and your wife. I, for one, appreciate your willingness to post about this because it brings to light potential pitfalls for me and Maria when she finally arrives here. We're here to learn and help each other and I for one don't mind at all your posting about this here. If you like, send me an email and I'll shoot you my phone number. Call anytime.

JR

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003


I'm glad that it seems that your wife is out of the woods, but I'm sorry about the doctor bill.  I know its difficult for both of you to start a relationship this way.  I think you have to remember that its important that you not take her sudden change in attitude personally.  She is hurting emotionally and physically now (as you are too).  Now is the time that you are going to have to be supportive of her and give her what she needs with the understanding that she can't give much in return now.

I can tell you that I don't think her behavior is unique to someone that has just arrived to the US and involved in an inter-cultural marriage.  I know of a man that had the same situation with his American wife.  She was going through bouts with cancer and one day I asked how his wife was doing, and he replied that "she was being very moody/cranky"(that's putting it nicely, he chose other descriptive words at the time), but he was trying to help her as he knew her attitude and behavior was not because of him personally, but because of all the sickness, medical treatments and such she was going through.

My point is that I think perhaps  your wife is frustrated beyond what you can understand.  She has no outlet for her stress other than you.  Thus you are going to feel the anger and resentment now. It doesn't mean she is a bad person or that you deserve such treatment. Its just one of those things that people in relationships must accept when they marry.  Remember the vows- "In sickness and in Health, for richer or for poorer"-  Now is the time that you have to suck it up and be there for her.  Give her time.

Remember you wife is not feeling good physically. Its hard to be affectionate in anyway when you are physically sick. How affectionate are men when we are sick?  Its hard man.

Just give her time.  My friends wife is fine now after her bout with cancer and their marriage was never in trouble.  He realized that he just had to deal with it for a little while until she felt better.  Your marriage is fine as long as you don't give up on it.  I know you got the bills on your mind as well as your wife's health.  But just try to be strong for both of you now.  When she recovers, maybe a trip back to Bogotá will be in order, but I wouldn't stray far from home until the infection is gone completely.   Just keep being the loving husband that you have been.  When she feels better physically, she return back to her old self.  Try not to speak of the money issue with her. You don't want her to feel bad or anything like that.  

Stay strong and best of luck with everything.

... in response to Re: My wife is home from the hospital, posted by Onephd on Jun 29, 2003

Don't be too caught up in your wife's mood swings right now.  None of us are at our most charming when we're sick.  Bruce, if you want to talk to me on the phone, e-mail me at burbuja2@cox.net and I'll send you my phone number too.

... in response to My wife is home from the hospital, posted by lswote on Jun 28, 2003

Bruce, glad she came through. And I know you are emotionaly spent....so is she....and she's most likely still feeling (physicaly and mentaly) really bad. You didn't mention the baby--don't know if I should even ask...but if the worst happened.....well, that's going to make her very depressed....it's nothing you caused and there's nothing you can do about it except comfort her. I think your marriage will survive (I'll give it 98%, how's that?), you just have to realize that right now she might not be able to give any affection....but that just means that you have to give her MORE....especialy more emotional than physical, for the time being.

I don't think medicare will pay the bills (remember the affidavit of support?)...but I wouldn't worry about it, worst they can do is sue you, but they seldom if ever do, I still owe a hospital $28,000 from a similar emergency 3 years ago (where I was the patient), they haven't even reported it to the credit reporting agencies. If you pay them something, anything, like $100 a month, they won't bother you.