Planet-Love.com Searchable Archives

I haven't been on this board much lately, and probably won't be going forward.  About the only one I have time for is 2Gringos. But frankly my interest level in this whole deal is going down by the day. But my interest in traveling to Latin America is more for 'sport' now than anything else.  

As most of you know, I met, married and divorced a Colombiana in 16 mos.  I feel I have a pretty good grip on the brutal reality of this process, and it's a process that will overwhelm the average gringo.  

I personally knew 5 other couples that were married within six months of me.  Three of them are getting divorced as I write this.  That is four out of six.  Hey, I'm not gonna argue the merits of our little 'sample', but I think that we represented a decent cross-section of social strata.  While I think it's possible to realize the dream, the odds are not in your favor.  

Anyway, good luck to you guys, you will need it.  And another thing, don't make the mistake of feeling sorry for the girls, nothing but bad things happen.  And if you do proceed with this, take your time.  Slooooow down, there is no rush.

What am I doing now?  Hmmmm, am back to AW, and having a pretty easy go of it.  I have also been dating some latin women who ALREADY LIVE HERE.  What a pleasant difference that is!  Weekends in Monterrey or Guadalajara?  Very possibly.

The End.

JunFan out

www.sparhard.com

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

I was and still am sorry about what happened between you and Beatriz.  Hopefully down the road you will meet someone more compatible for you.  Sounds like you are looking in the domestic market versus offshore..I don't know, most of the guys at work seem to be happy with their American wives so hopefully you will find a good one.

My marriage is still going well.  People ask me how's it going with my marriage and I tell them I cannot imagine being single again.  But, I know where you are coming from with trying to tell guys that this not that simple. Anyone who does not think that there are significant challenges is not thinking right.  But the benefits are tremendous also..I am married to a beautiful woman 16 years younger than me and we have a traditional marriage where her focus is on me and our home.  And this makes her and me happy.  Of course, she is also still real focused on her family in Colombia, but I think this is a good thing.  But with not really having much face time to spend getting to know one another before we got married, we are still really becoming accustomed to one another. I cannot imagine my life without her so I guess you could say we are "really in love".

Wayne has given some of the best advice I have come across as far as being real patient and not trying to rush the acclimation process.  Also it does no good to raise your voice, at least with my wife.  She can tell when I am serious about something.

Anyway, you have raised a serious issue that guys need to know that this is no walk in the park.

Take care and good luck.

Edge

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

I've enjoyed your posts, both here and at Two Gringos.

I hope that you continue posting to the Two Gringos board.

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Mike,
Good luck man. I think your post were insightful and truthful. As you can see here, if you don't wear blinders and think all is great about Colombia and the women, you are the second coming of Satan. Mike, some people only want to hear what they want. No one can knock you bro, because you did it, and shared the experience. Plus you just said what others have experieneced also. I never heard you say anything negative other than be careful. Wow, you are a bad person for that! Just facts and you get attacked by a 57 year old kid. I don't blame you for jumping ship. If you feel what you are doing with women is good, go for it, it is your life. Best of luck.

... in response to Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 29, 2002

...because I can't take the heat here.  I speak Spanish, know how to approach Latin women, know how to operate in Latin America.  If I want to go play, I'll go...and have a blast.

I was just kinda saying farewell, as frankly I don't want to waste the time & energy here that I once did.  I will spend it actually meeting women, not writing about it.

Like I've said, I've been through this whole process.  I am not the all-knowing either.  I gave you guys some of my thoughts and experiences, do with them what you will.

Remember, in the end, this is not a 'team-sport'.  After you are married, these guys are irrelevent.  It's mano y mano combat after that.  And you're all alone.

JunFan

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

nt

... in response to It had been a little boring around here ..., posted by Pete E on Jun 29, 2002

nt

... in response to But it was better than a flame war!, posted by Pete E on Jul 1, 2002

What?  Don't like it that I called a spade a spade?  Felt compelled to go on a rant to defend yourself?  Ha.  Proves my point.

And CaliVet is engaged to a 17 year old?  And people here are actually gonna listen to what he says?  GOOD GAWD PEOPLE!  

GROW UP!

... in response to Quite Whining PETE!, posted by JunFan on Jul 2, 2002

nt

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Mike,
I don't fault you for ending the marriage so quickly,sometimes you know it isn't going to get better.
But I think your experience has made you pretty negative on the finding a latina wife process.Thats understandable.But of the people I know personally (6 couples)everyone is still together. I guess I'm the old timer at 2 1/2 years so
you could say you need more years for the failure rate to develop.I think your failure presumptions are a little scewed to the negative.
Another very important point.As I recall you are young,like 30 ish,tall and earn middle six figures.You have a chance with american women many of the rest of us do not.I personally had pretty much given up on ever finding the type of woman I found easily in Colombia.The only thing available was compromises I wasn't willing to make.You have a good shot at it,so maybe I'm a little surprised you ever went in the first place.
One of my friends from here went to Colombia,spent the whole time with one girl who he wasn't very interested in and came back saying he wouldn't go again,he would date American women.He joined some dating agency and had alot of dates but they were all horror stories.(wackos)He is talking about Colombia again.
It certainly can be simpler with an american woman so good luck finding one you like.

Pete

... in response to Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by Pete E on Jun 29, 2002

Well, I now know that I didnt have to go down there. But at the time, I think I was living out the fantasy.  Finding a beautiful Latina, unspoiled by American BS, who would be a traditional wife, and raise a family.  Well, the reality I found was different.

And yes, I think the profile of the type of guy who would be successful in this would be:  over 50, good money, alot of time on his hands, one who is very patient, and values companionship above all else.  That's not me right now.

Look, the latins have alot of good qualities.  They have alot of bad ones too.  I came to the conclusion that women from other cultures are actually more alike than they are different.

There are, however,bigger cultural differences than most gringos will ever know.  And if they are lucky enough to learn, it will usually be 'after the fact' when they figure it out.

I have been meeting alot of women on Match.com or Yahoo  personals, and even a lot of Latins.  It's scary to know how many of these young girls are married to gringos and are trying to develop a plan B.  Probably some on this board.

Bottom line, I like Colombianas alot, just would rather play with them down there versus marrying them and bringing them up here.

Pete, and don't take this the wrong way, but I've never figured out why you want to be on this board so much.  I know for a fact they offer you nothing here.  The reason I say this is because I too spent alot of time on the computer when I was married.  Why?  Hmmmm, was it habit?  Was I addicted to the list like you? Maybe.  Was I looking for validation from others that what I had done was right? Was it a way for me to escape her and get some quiet time?
What I do know, is spending that much time on the computer talking about latin women when you are married to one is not healthy. Had I not, maybe I could have spent that energy on my marriage.  Obviously, you are still married and I'm not, so you are doing something 'right'. But hey, I'm not trying to get you to go on one of your big rants.

and Pete, a word of advice...quit being an enabler to the newbies that don't know how tough this deal really is.  You tend to be on of the guys who adds to the 'hype' of all this.

... in response to Pete & others, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

JJ, I am basically a lurker here but post on subjects which I can relate to or can provide some information based on my experiences in LA. I have read your posts here and on LWL, and have always respected and appreciated your openess and willingness to share your story.

However, you have crossed the line with your comment on Pete's posting here. I am very grateful for Pete's posts. He does not go overboard on pushing people to believe as he does. He offers many good tips based on real, and current experience. I find his posts to be dignified, respectful, informative and often encompasses ideas and insite on a wide variety of topics related to the Country of Colombia. His posts are one of the main reasons I come here.

I am sorry for your bad esperience. As they say, "I share your pain", having had a few mis-fires myself. Success in everything will never happpen. Life is a series of highs and lows. It is obvious that you are still "en reposo". I wish you well in your recovery, but picking on someone else will not make it better. I am sure, you will regret your very minor remarks. I wish you well.

As for me, thanks Pete for all that you do to sincerely offer your assistance and advice to all of us.

... in response to Pete & others, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

I'm not sure why Pete is catching so much flak here. He has always seemed honest,candid, and very courteous here. It is true that he proposed marriage on his first visit to Colombia. He has admitted that was not wise and a big mistake. That being said, he has exhibited a huge amount of COMMITMENT to his marriage and his word. His first few months with his wife sounded as bad as anyone's experience on here has been, worst than most. It was downright agonizing to read about his life as he described the problems he and his new wife were having. But he did everything he could to figure out solutions to their problems. This is especially noble in my opinion because he was telling us about the situation knowing he would be bashed here for proposing too soon, which he was. He remained courteous and calm through it all. I will always admire him for the effort and time he has spent to hold his marriage together and make it a good one. I'm sure his wife has done her part in the effort, too. During this tough time, I seem to recall that Pete was not posting here that often, which probably means he was busy trying to save his marriage. I am glad that he posts fairly often here now, his experience and the example of his perserverance is valuable to many. I am not suspicious of the fact that he has been here often in recent days, it really doesn't take that much time each week to check in here and post a few times. Heck, they probably read the board together and laugh, as my wife and I sometimes do.

  As for safety in Colombia, I didn't know that the "MOB" process was about who had the b@lls to walk the streets of Cali vs. who felt safer in familiar surroundings.

  Mi esposita was college educated and fluent in English before we met. She had visited the USA before we met. She has exhibited almost no homesickness at any time during our courtship/marriage. In spite of these advantages, the process has still been a struggle at times. I still feel like a babysitter occasionally. But the positive aspects of it all FAR outweigh the work and difficult times. My wife treats me like a king. Maybe I got "lucky" that my marriage has been good so far. It is true that all of us who take the plunge are in for some difficult times. On top of all of Pete's early problems, add to that the fact that he opened his heart and home to a young child belonging to his wife, one of the most unselfish things any man could ever do.

For you guys who are still looking, it CAN work out to be the best thing you will ever do, but it probably won't be easy at times. Count me among those who are glad they did it and would do it again. Even the best AW I have known never treated me as good as my wife, I can't imagine any of them being as unselfish and dedicated as she is.

Sorry this was long, had to speak up about the fact that this CAN be a great thing, and defend someone who doesn't deserve the bashing.
 

... in response to Re: Pete & others-In defense of Pete..., posted by Red Clay on Jun 29, 2002

I enjoy reading his Posts, He's very helpful. greg

... in response to Pete & others, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

Mike,
I guess this board is kind of a hobby to me.Its something that I'm interested in because it changed my life alot.I guess its just one of those computer things that is so easy to spend time on,check out the site,see what is going on.
I was spending alot more time and energy following my stocks untill they got killed and I had to get out of the market.That freed up alot of time.Being self employerd its easy to drift from work things to play things.I have said that is one disadvantage of being self employed,you waste your own time.
Also my wife watches alot of spanish television.I don't think that is so good but haven't tried to get her to limit it.Its like we go our own seperate ways alot.
Yes I guess I am a cheerleader for going to Colombia.To me it was an incredible change from what I was experiencing here,so I tell guys to just go.It is easy to find someone but not without risks and problems.Yes there is a big cultural difference.It doesn't have to be a big problem but it can be.The guys I know are happy with the outcome.
You had a different experience,which has given you a totally different point of view than people who are happy with the outcome.
For me it seemed the choices were accept what I could get here,which I just couldn't do.To me a woman has to be attractive or why bother.Or continue to be alone,which I spent many years doing.I wasn't lonely but I was missing something.Or go to Colombia (or somewhere else) where the choices were better.
But I do think its good to have different points of view.Its not all success and happy ever after,so its good to get that perspective.I guees if guys read the different experiences they get a more balenced perspective.
Good luck with the girls you are now pursuing.

Pete

... in response to Pete & others, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

but I was just thinking back.  I mean, S^t Pete!, you are not one to give advice about Cali or Colombia.  Last time you visited for a month, you were too scared to leave the house.  I remember you saying something about Avenida Sexta "I hear it's fun".  Remember, how you sat in your novia's parents house the entire time?  Bored out of your skull cuz you couldn't speak Spanish?  Hated the food.

Funny memories. You were the prototype guy who went down and never left the agency.

LOL.

Give 'em He// Pete....ha!

... in response to Re: Pete & others, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

Mike,
Yes an expert on the town I am not.My wife and her family were bent on keeping me safe,so my adventures in town were limited and yes it got boring staying at Ma Ma's house.
I was never bored staying at latin love.All these girls were coming to meet me plus I could hang out around the pool and compare notes with other guys while I was waiting.So I thought the live in agency thing was great.But if that wasn't available I would have done the hotel thing and probably would have got around town more.
And yes,Colombian food.I was always happy to get home for our choices in food.Even coffee.And service.
One time after coming back I hit a starbucks for a good cup of coffee and a chili's for dinner.There were lots of choices,the food was good and the service was excellent.Those college student type waiters understand tip.They probably make more in one night than that unmotivated  Colombiano waiter makes in a month.
Reminds me off an old Chuck Berry song "I'm so glad I'm livin in the USA".
But I do like Colombia for the choice in women.That I don't find here.And actually its beautifull there,safety fears just limited me too much.

Pete

... in response to Re: Re: Pete & others, posted by Pete E on Jun 29, 2002

it was that bad.

OK, I'm gonna let it rip...
Sounds like you found your wife on your first trip down there.  

Unbelievable.  Here is a guy who flew to Cali, was picked up at the airport and taken to the agency, where he never left, meeting women for how long?  A week?  Two?  Met and married his woman.  You were basically spoon fed a wife.

You married a Colombiana and know nothing of her culture to speak of, let alone set foot in her city (in a true sense), and don't speak a word of Spanish?

And then you get married and spend half your time on the computer?

Sounds like blissful paradise to me.

... in response to Wow...I didn't realize, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

JF, we all are different. I envy Pete for his success, whether it was the wrong way (and who weally knows ??) or just pure luck. The results are all that matter. Based on the results, I would say he succeeded and you failed...bigtime. Now, I wouldn't do it Pete's way, but then I ain't married to a beautiful and sweet latina either ! Perhaps when you are writing another, increasingly venomous post, you should think about this. You are starting to sound a little silly.

... in response to Wow...I didn't realize, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

nt

... in response to Re: Re: Pete & others, posted by Pete E on Jun 29, 2002

Hey if you're going to have safety fears, why even go out of the house, let alone abroad. You are never going to see or experience anything with that attitude.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Pete & others, posted by Ted on Jun 29, 2002

Pete's fears or lack thereof is something of a moot point since he's been happily married for some time now to (I asume) a lovely calena. To be fair let's remember that Cali can be a dangerous place anywhwere anytime (ok not in the upscale shopping centers like Chipichapi). I've met three gringos there who described mugging experiences to me and there was even that time  a few years ago when four were robbed at gunpoint and held for a couple of hours right inside an agency. I don't like to think about it but Colombia is the kidnap capital. I met a guy last time I was there who had hired a cab for his entire stay, said it was way too dangerous to take one off the street. I thought that was far out but everyone has their own risk tolerence and boy is Cali ever the place to test it.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & others &r..., posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

Cali Vet just quit man! Give us a break, Senior Citizen bagering everyone here. If you know it all, why are you alone at almost 60? Get off everyone else and SELF EXAMINE!

... in response to They did not steal Cali Vet's walker!, posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 30, 2002

Well Rubby why is your profile blank? Do you have anything constructive to offer on the theme of a latina bride or just vituperative tongue wagging. It's time for you to put up or shut up.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & others &r..., posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

My 1st trip was a month.

I walked the streets during the day alone.  Sometimes from LE to Chipi Chapi and back.

I shopped in dangerous places for inexpensive toys for kids in the orphanages.  Not alone, but with the girl I was with.

I went out at night many times for dinner and such and took cabs off the street.

Maybe it was dumb some of the things I did, but I just had an attitude that was fatalistic.  Whatever happens, happens.
I looked over my shoulder at times and kept my eyes open, but I never let paranoia ruin my experience.

Yes, I did pray a little while I was there.  It couldn't hurt...

I miss the place some, and we will go back and visit.  I especially miss my favorite restaraunt the Paladar.

Wayne

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & others &a..., posted by Wayne1 on Jun 29, 2002

Where is the Paladar and what do they serve? Comida tipica?

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & other..., posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

Oh my God! You don't know!!! I guess it is Burger King

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & other..., posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

Paladar is around the corner from Margareths place.  It's cafateria style ordering and upstairs is the most comfortable air conditioned room to dine in.  LOL. it is not comida tipica.... it is sort of a french theme but they have everthing from Colombian dishes to chicken parmasan, roast beef and unreal desserts.

It's very expensive for Colombians but the same price as an average rest in the states.

Try it next time because your girlfriend will love it.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & o..., posted by Wayne1 on Jun 30, 2002

Thanks I think I've passed by it. Will go in next time.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Pete & others, posted by Ted on Jun 29, 2002

There were alot of places I could go,but not enough to keep me occupied.I guess I could have wandered around Avenida Sexta a little more.My wife wasn't interested.Went with my brother in law a couple of times.I'm not scared of going to Colombia,but when my wife tells me I shouldn't go to the downtown shopping area with her I listen.You only need to warn me once.They didn't want me walking anywhere by myself.Colombia isn't so dangerous if you don't do anything stupid.Some people think its too gutsy to go at all.Not me,but I am carefull and 0 problems so far.

Pete

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Pete & others, posted by Pete E on Jun 29, 2002

It doesn't take balls to fly to a dangerous country and hole up in a house.

What you have been doing doesn't qualify as "going to Colombia", in my opinion.

... in response to For the record, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

Mike,
Talk about being negative.You are putting a negative spin on everything someone says.Take off those brown tinted glasses they are giving you a sh--y outlook on life.You are showing us here a huge personality problem that is probably a big part of why your marriage didn't work.Put that together with what you said your wife did and you guys were a disaster waiting to happen.And now you think every Colombiana is like her and every relationship is doomed to the same fate.Its INDIVIDUALS that make relationships.All Colombianas are not alike and all guys that seek them are not alike.It takes patience to relate to a person from another culture.If you keep flying off the handle and reacting negastively it will never work.I bet there are some other good stories about  you guys together.
Lucky there wasn't a homicide.

Pete

... in response to Re: For the record, posted by Pete E on Jun 30, 2002

Pete,
KEYBOARD DOWN, WIFE UP. Don't worry about this guy. Buddy, you have to devote energy to her before someone else does.

... in response to For the record, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

JunFan: Lighten up already! You sound like you've got a lot to offer a woman so here's my advice to you: 1. Don't take things so seriously. Be pleasant and smile alot especially when you're with a woman you're attracted to. 2. Don't be so hard on others. Accept others for who they are and DO NOT try to change them. 3. In your personal relationships be kind and gentle and not competitive and demanding. Save the latter for the business world. 4. If you like Latinas, study spanish at a college for 2 semesters. Take Spanish I and learn the basics of reading, writing and conversation. This can be done at a good community college and will bridge the communication gap very substantially. Best of luck to you and remember to smile early and often.

Regards,

Rick

... in response to Re: For the record, posted by Rick Johnson on Jun 29, 2002

I agree with most of what you say.

But I do take exception to the Spanish.  That was one problem I don't have. When your wife never learns English, you become fluent, especially after studying spanish 3 years in HS, and 2 in College.

... in response to Pete & others, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

of Calenas? Whats the difference between their culture and AWs? Good hearing someone speaking his mind, unfraid to share his true feeling. Thanks, greg

... in response to Hi Junfan, What are the good and bad Qua..., posted by greg on Jun 29, 2002

only Barranquilleras.  I'm trying to extricate myself from all this.

I'll give you my opinion.  If you must marry one of these women, stick to those who are educated, and middle to upper middle class.  Preferably one who can speak English.  

Well, I'll give an example about cultural differences.  There is a big difference in the work ethic here and that of Colombia.  There are reasons our nation is the most powerful nation in the world, putting up space-stations & leading the world in virtually every technology....and you still see Colombians hauling bananas in carts driven by donkeys.  Ever wonder why?  The answers will show you cultural differences my friend.  I'll just leave it at that.

Mike

... in response to I don't know first hand about Calenas, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

If their work ethic is so low that explains why most of them will take jobs no American here will take. Like picking the cheap fruit you eat or cleaning up after you when you get sick in the bathroom. Thanks for setting us straight, zenophobe.

It takes all kinds that made this country great. And guess what, most of them are immigrants.

... in response to Re: I don't know first hand about Calena..., posted by Ted on Jun 29, 2002

Ted,
I do not believe that post was about Xenophobia. The truth is that latin america moves at a much slower pace than the USA. When my cousin got married in Puerto Rico, it was hell planning that wedding, the people there just do not have the same mentality there to hustle. My uncle who came here in 1957, told me how he was overwhelmed at first as a kid in NJ, just coming from PR and the difference in lifestyle. I am saying this is bad or anti-immagration, no. Yet in the USA do we do it better than everyone else on this planet, yes. Are we more advanced thaN the rest of the world in all aspects,yes. Is Colombia on the point of collapse, very close. Those terrorist are pissed down there with the election of Uribe and they just had mass resignations of mayors down there (112 mayors), due to death threats from the FARC. I am happy to live here in the USA! With this, 36 years of guerrilla war, being number 3 in displaced persons in the world, and the highest murder rate in the world, it is hard for me to believe  that these women (NOT ALL) are really just looking for thier media naranja or do the just want something else first? My $$$ is on the safety and security of good Ol' Uncle Sam.

... in response to Re: Re: I don't know first hand about Ca..., posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 29, 2002

The US more advanced than the rest of the world?? Obviously you have been to Asia. Some cities over there are at least a 3-5 years ahead of us in technology. If we don't get our act together soon, we'll be a 2nd rate power. True, we'll still have the bomb. But then again countries like Pakistan can say the same!

... in response to Re: Re: Re: I don't know first hand abou..., posted by Ted on Jun 29, 2002

Ted,
I am in the military, work in intel and Pakistan can barley touch India with nukes. I am in Hawaii and TDY to Asia constantly for the past 2 years. They are not even close. If you look at Al-Queda, Technology is not the great divider anymore.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: I don't know first hand ..., posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 30, 2002

What are you talking about. 95% of the Korean pop is on broadband, while here's it's at 21%. The Japanese also have the fastest computers now. The japanese always joke that if they want to go back to the future, they go to the US. I think if pakistan ever decide to touch India with nukes, what the # of dead would be in the millions. I think that qualifies more than a touch.

You said technology isn't the great divider, but didn't you original post say that the US was the most advanced nation?

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Whatever you call yourself,

I've been following your posts, website, etc. etc. etc..

I do not feel sorry for you, no sympathy what so ever. Any decent and reasonable person, whether they are latino or gringo, would have advised you not to have been so quick with marrying your ex wife. So, get the thought that all colombianas are silly girls, or just after the greencard to enter the US. That's not true.

6 months????????!!!!!!!! That is no time; not even long enough to begin to seriously consider marrying an AW, let alone a foreign woman from a different culture who speaks a different language.

I think you knew the risk of "whirlwind" MOB relationships, but you proceeded anyway. If you didn't realize the risks, I'm sure you do now.

During my search in Latin America, which started in December 1998 in Cartagena until now 2002, I have met a wide cross section of women, from younger less wealthier girls to lawyers, jewelers, and doctors all from Colombia. The very women that said they thought getting married within 6 months to 1 year after the initial meeting, I stayed the hell away from (regardless of how good they looked). The women that wanted to take more time, I enjoyed spending time with them the most. We have more in common, and it's clear they weren't desperate. An additional plus, these women spoke English, and I also speak Spanish. Some even had US visas, and lived in the US for a couple of years before.

As for my girlfriend, she doesn't speak a bit of English. But we can still communicate well. She's beautiful, but she doesn't place much importance on her physical appearance. She said that she doesn't like agencies anymore, and that if she hadn't met me, she wouldn't be corresponding with anyone. We both decided that there will be 2 years of a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship prior to marriage. We are enjoying our time just getting to know each other without pressure.

For all the other guys reading this post, I advise you to go for it. Travel and meet as many women you want, and don't be affraid. But, have the right attitude and use common sense.

Aaron

... in response to I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by Aaron on Jun 28, 2002

Aaron, I do not mean to burst your bubble, but there is a big difference between living with a girl and visiting here and there over a two year period in Colombia. There is a huge difference between visiting from time to time and actually living together in your house and sharing your life with that person 24/7. This is what I am doing now, and yes I am happy with her, but it is a huge difference then just meeting the girl on a few vacations over a two year period. Don't feel you are an expert just after one trip to Colombia, you have along step ahead and the road is fun but can be occasionally rocky, but if you stick with it you might pull it off. No one knows JunFan's experiences but him , nor will we ever know until we step in his shoes on a daily basis with him and when he was married.

... in response to I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by Aaron on Jun 28, 2002

I really do not think JunFan wanted you to feel sorry for him. But then you already knew that right??? No body here needs you to attack them when they speak out about their problems with latin girls. Some guys here need to open their eyes and they will not if they think everything is wine & roses. It is not easy to find a good girl down in S.A. but that does not stop a newbie from rushing down there and finding a girl in a two week trip.
If you have so much experince with latin girls then you must have blew right through that smoke that your girl made when she told you that she does not place importance on her physical appearance. I have yet to met a latin that does not worry about her appearance alot.

... in response to I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by Aaron on Jun 28, 2002

Aaron,
How does his life effect yours? You need to get one man. You are like an attack dog here. Hopefully, you'll get lost in the outback. Talk like this to an Aussie, and you be picking up your teeth from the floor. Use your degree to examine your own mind. Your angry post and  posting as a woman show some serious problems. Try prozac, thorazine, lithium, etc. An educated person would listen and offer an opinion, not a rant of rage.

... in response to Re: I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 29, 2002

You need to read his post again and then yours.No question who started the attack,you.You call his post a rant?His was civil,yours is a rant.Read them again.Underline any attacks or insults in his post and then yours.I count 6 in yours,none in his.You can be that biased but you can't be that dense if you look at it carefully.

Pete

... in response to Who's the attack dog?, posted by Pete E on Jun 29, 2002

Pete,
I'm talking about Aaron, mind you business, get off the keyboard and go take care of your wife. Stop worrying about me and pay attention at home man, before you wind up like Junfan.

... in response to I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by Aaron on Jun 28, 2002

Numnuts,
I first wrote her in April of 2000, met her in Sept of 00, and married her in Sept. 01.

... in response to Re: I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

anyway, its still too quick....

... in response to Re: I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

No Balls,

Well why in the hell did you say that "you two met and married within 6 months"? Get your figures right.

Anyway, that's still quick, isn't it Einstein?

Aaron

... in response to Re: Re: I don't feel sorry for you...., posted by Aaron on Jun 28, 2002

Typo...was 16 mos.

How long you figure it's realistic to date these women? Five years?  Ha.  Got some jack?  The fact is the most important time you can spend with them is time here, in this environment, where you will be living day to day.  Unfortunately, the government makes you do it in 90 days, or already be married....

Good luck pal.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: I don't feel sorry for you....., posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Jun-bug,

Now I see why your marriage failed.

Peace.

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

I count among my friends and aquaintences seven Colombo/American couples of which five are happy and content after two to five years of marriage. Two have failed and both of those have in common the fact that the guy spoke little to no Spanish. The worst complaints I've heard from the women of the happy couples is that it's cold up here. Success or failure depends way more on personality characteristics than any other factor.

... in response to Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by Cali vet on Jun 28, 2002

Good for you.  I bet I can come back here in two years and you will still talk the same smack.  I'm just sorry I never met you face to face, so I could knock your f%cking block off.  And boy could I...

... in response to Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Well junefart you will note that I never made a single  dispariging remark in response to your gut spilling admissions of a failed marriage. Anyone who looks over your history of posts can see that you routinely respond to opinions you don't like with empty threats of violence like the one above. You were never cut out for marriage with someone from another culture. Every time you brought up your ex-wife there was a heavy overtone of hardcore jingoism. With the "let me punch you out" response in so many of your posts it's not much of a stretch to guess that maybe you smacked her pretty good when she didn't learn English fast enough or meet one of your other "take it or leave" deadlines. My guess is that there's a dark side to your failed marriage that no one's ever going to hear about at least untill some one meets up with her in Barranquilla.
As to threatening me kiddo...go blow it out your ass!

... in response to Re: Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan%%%, posted by Cali vet on Jun 28, 2002

n/t

... in response to Re: Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan%%%, posted by Cali vet on Jun 28, 2002

the only reason they are empty is because guys like you and Malandro don't have the nuts to face me.  Never have, never will.  

I'll check on you in a few years, you'll still be here.

Take care, old man.

... in response to empty threats?, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Hey Jan, I heard you mention you want to go to Guadalajara, that is where I met my novia. It is a pretty cool place.

... in response to empty threats?, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

So you punch your wife out pretty good or was it knumbchuks? Face me you little faggot and you go home in a box!

... in response to Re: empty threats?, posted by Cali vet on Jun 28, 2002

Well, like Pete said, this has been rather entertaining.  In lieu of further name calling, I think there should be a fight to settle this matter once and for all - just like in the old days when gentlemen dueled over matters of honor.  The fight must be virtual, of course, so if any of you tech-heads know of a virtual reality or Sims-like game that would suffice, please let the board know.  I'm thinking that JunFan, given his age advantage and martial arts skills, will have to be handicapped in some manner.  Maybe tie one arm behind his back and break a couple of toes to even things up a bit.  Whaddya think?

... in response to Re: Re: empty threats?, posted by DavidMN on Jun 29, 2002

Colt made all Men equal...Why should us Old men fight when we got king colt?? Martial arts should be used for only self defense, not to pick fights with anyone. If I knew a Guy was a professional fighter, then I would be at a disadvantage, becuz I do not train to fight. Thats why we got our Colts...It's dangerous for anyone to go around picking a fight, what make You think the Guy's going to fight fair and square? I never worry about how good a Guy can fight...Thank you Mr Colt :o)

... in response to Ever Heard of King Colt???, posted by greg on Jun 30, 2002

nt

... in response to Re: empty threats?, posted by Cali vet on Jun 28, 2002

Oye viejo,
You got to be kidding, but I guess you really are a Calivet! If I am fighting on this board with people at 57 years old, SHOOT ME!

... in response to Re: empty threats?, posted by Cali vet on Jun 28, 2002

feelin' like a tough guy?  Get a few beers in you on this Friday night?  

gonna shoot me with your computer joystick?

Good night, old man.

... in response to yeah yeah yeah, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Watch it Jun, they might fart on you with a dust cloud from thier old butts!

... in response to yeah yeah yeah, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

So tell us, they learn English faster if you rough 'em up a little?

... in response to English lessons, posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

I though they turned the lights off at the nursing home after 10:00 ??

... in response to Re: English lessons, posted by Evan on Jun 29, 2002

Nice try old man.  But in reality I have never hit a woman, nor will I.  But that brings up the temper of the typical Latina.  Alot of these women have terribly violent tempers, that usually aren't revealed during courtship.  My wife actually started to get physical when she would get super angry.  She would usually hit me somewhere other than the face, and it never really hurt.  But still, you don't want to see that.

Anyway, before I was gonna tell her about my intentions to divorce, I had the weapons and all sharp knives removed from my home and put with my parents.  I didn't have alot, just a couple of shotguns for hunting & a 9mm for personal protection.  Well, when I told her about the divorce, she B-Lined it to the gun drawer, sure enough.

And driving back from signing the papers, she gave me a good right-cross to my jaw, while I was driving down I-75 at 70mph.  That was real nice.  But never laid a finger on her.  

Face.

... in response to Roughing her up....The Truth, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

She went for the gun drawer,as in you could be dead if you didn't remove the guns?Thats scary.Punched you in the jaw while you are driving?Just from what you have said in this post you got ahold of one bad latina.If you think that is typical it would sure sour you on latinas.

Pete

... in response to Roughing her up....The Truth, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

U did the right thing getting rid of Her. Any Women that picks fights with a man is Dangerous. I wouldn't want to bring a woman here to abuse and embarrash me. Thank God for Laws to protect Guys that are beaten by Woman, will the Police believe the Guy over his beautiful Calena??? Something is wrong with the marriage if there's slapping and hitting going on. Yeah, get out before someone is seriously hurt..You did the wise thing to send her back.

... in response to Roughing her up....The Truth, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

Yes a left-cross would have been difficult in that position. You've gotta agree the behavior you describe sounds pretty extreme even suicidal considering the seventy-miles-an-hour. Thinking back is there anything you might have done that inspired such behavior? Now I grant you that some latinas are even better than gringas at comming up with imagined offences out of nowhere. So what flipped her out? Maybe there are behaviors that those of us in the pre-nupital stages of a relationship can take special precaution against.

... in response to Re: Roughing her up....The Truth, posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

you got me.  I'm busted.  I admit it now before the board:

I was not the perfect husband, I was not perfect, I made mistakes.  

Whew! Now that I got that off my chest I guess I can go about my life in peace!

Thank you CaliVet for exposing the 'real me'.

... in response to Re: English lessons, posted by Evan on Jun 29, 2002

Be careful, he might stick his shemale buddy Aaron on you.
Calivet, if you are 57, help out JuanFan, what do you got to attck the guy for? You got the life experience. Come on man, grow up! No wonder why you don't have a chic, you are old and crusty!

... in response to Re: Re: English lessons & Calivet, posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 29, 2002

If you read the posts in order you will see that Jun Fan started the attack,no question.Cali Vet didn't say anything I thought warrented the threatening response but then it went down hill from there.
We can have diffenent points of view without threats and negaive attacks.

... in response to Re: Re: English lessons & Calivet, posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 29, 2002

Robby don't waste your time and credability being a sycophant for an off the wall megalomanaiac. No chic? You haven't been paying attention.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: English lessons & Calive..., posted by Cali vet on Jun 29, 2002

That description is of yourself freak. Get your viagra refilled and get a life old man. Yeah those young hot Calenas really want you man. That is disgusting, your crusty, almost 60 year old butt chasing young chics down there. Do you do it with a shirt made of US dolar bills? You attack everyone here and act like you know it all. Go back to Jurrasic Park

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: English lessons & Ca..., posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 29, 2002

.

... in response to Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

What A Lousy Attitude ... Forget about Latinas or AW. Your next mate should be an 800 pound gorilla! I am glad that your ex-wife is safe back in Colombia. I would love to hear her story.

Ciao, JunFan
You Will not be missed!

... in response to Sayonara, Jun Fan The Victim, posted by CaliBound on Jun 28, 2002

n/t

... in response to Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

....CHILD, making physical threats (as you have done often in the past on this board).

Cali-Vet followed your initial post with constructive input that could help you see things differently, being totally civil.

I met Cali-Vet during my last trip, and it was a pleasure for me.

And even if you could "knock-his block off," you still look like a fool.

If you don't like what I say, jump off a cliff.

Aaron

... in response to Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

From reading this post I wonder why he got divorced?

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Although I don't contribute much to the board, I read it just about every day.  I wanted to thank you very much for your insights.  I remember the post after your divorce and it certainly had a profound affect on my thinking.  In fact, I retrieved it from the archive just a few days ago for review.  I, for one, appreciate very much your contributions and would hope that you surface every now and again.

... in response to Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by burbuja2 on Jun 28, 2002

Thanks bud.  I appreciate it.

I don't mean to come across as too angry.  I just don't have much patience for people who ridicule from behind a keyboard, like half the bozos in this room

What do I know?  I'm just a college educated, 250k+ per year wage earner, 33, in shape, blah blah blah...that thought he had thought this through to the point of cover all his bases.  What do I know?  I have come full circle.  I have done the whole deal, start to finish.  I've done what all this guys are trying to speculate about.  Did I make mistakes? He!!  yes I did.  Did I learn enough to make it work next time?  Maybe.  The point is with what I know now, I wouldn't even risk it again.  That's the important point.

There are a few out there who will realize I actually know what I'm talking about. But frankly, I dont care.  The dream will be there, and therefore so will the dreamers.

and so it is...

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

JunFan,

Can you tell everybody a little about the splits you're seeing?  I'm probably most interested in what the ladies are doing.  I think your ex went back to Colombia if I remember correctly, but what about the other three?  Are any of them trying to stay here in the US after the split?

... in response to Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by Patrick on Jun 28, 2002

I'm the lucky one as far as I can tell.  My woman went back to Colombia.  I was very generous with her.  She used the money I gave her to buy an apartment in BQ as an income property.  So, at least she has something to show for it.  If you are a gringo who is married and having problems...a word to the wise, do whatever it takes to get her on a plane if the sh%#t ever hits the fan.  

One of the couples, the woman realized the marriage is over, but is too ashamed to go back I think.  She wants to stay here and 'work'...ha.  So, he's got a problem in terms of her not wanting to get on a plane.  It's probably gonna take a wad of cash and a plane ticket to get rid of her...if he's lucky.

Another one, the woman brought her two kids here and now that looks she was a green card shark.  She is doing everything she can to make the guys life miserable.  I have not heard how the divorce was finalized.  Nice chunk of change on attorney's I'm sure.  

And finally, one of them was kinda a two-way decision, with the woman wanting to stay here for 3 mos so she can make some money before returning.  The gringo is buddies with some INS people and is gonna get her deported for tax evasion.  She was very deceiving...returning back to Cali to visit her family.  She returned with divorce papers, and apparently had bought an apartment in Cali with the gringos money.  She's a typical 24 year old Cali party chick...not marriage material.

None of them entertain the idea of ever doing it again.

Just the facts gentlemen.

Mike

... in response to JunFan here, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002


Do you know if any of the men used a prenup?  Always been curious about that especially from those men who have significant assests...

tjp

... in response to use a prenup?, posted by Onephd on Jun 29, 2002

I had my $$ in a LLP.  The other guys did not have any protection for their asetts.  But as far as I can tell, none of them had any real significant asetts to protect.

For someone who DOES have some serious $, this process is viciously risky.  And I would submit, not worth it.

Hey, I spent $50k on that woman over 14 mos.  About $10k of it was 1/2 of the cash I had saved (in spite of how expensive these women can be), which was 'community property'.  About $2500 in legal, $1200 for last minute ticket for plane ride, etc. But I am free now.  And lovin' it.

... in response to Prenup, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

,,,, whew... that was a huge investment.. ha ha.. I have seen different amounts that some guys say they spend.. wow.. sorry to hear that it didn't work out.. I keep everything you and others say close heart.. luckily I have a good friend (also my legal counsel ha ha) who makes sure I am not jumping the gun and makes sure I consider all angles, outcomes, possibilities..   The only bad thing is I am not at "that" level economically but will be soon.. the catch with me is, I'll would most likely have a wife before then.. so basically all that I will have will be community property. (ouch)

The major question is I guess is do these women seek out financial retribution if the marriage doesn't work? in a vindictive way?

I personally believe that the women is entitled to something since in many cases she will give up a job and such.  I think a cash settlement(correlated with the length of marriage, ie.) is ok to help her get back on her feet in her home country. I don't know.. hate to even think of stuff like this but I have to..

I would like to date a lady for a year and then do a K-1 visa to give her and I a chance to adjust to the difficultities that lie ahead.   I know from talking to several women that most of them do not think about the transition.  I was surprised at my Brazilian friend today whe she said that she knew it was be difficult being so far from her family and such.  No other woman I have chatted with has even acknowledged this.. (thats a scary thought).

Thanks for all your honesty and candidness.  Best of luck in the future.

... in response to final question, posted by Onephd on Jun 29, 2002

"The major question is I guess is do these women seek out financial retribution if the marriage doesn't work? in a vindictive way?"

This is not necesarily a Latina thing here.  Pssssssst, women get pissed when you divorce them.  What they really do is want to kick you in the balls, but they can't legally do that....so they hit you in the next best place, the wallet.

... in response to Re: final question, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

that is a thing with women, not a cultural thing.  How far she wants to take it (in other words how hard she wants to kick you) depends on what type of personality or attitude she has.  The more liberal a society is the more options she has at her disposal.

Junfan, you were very lucky.  In addition I am sure the language barrier played into your favor.  Due to her lackluster efforts to learn English, which prevented her from making friends with Americans, she shot herself in the foot.  If she had an understanding of English, someone would have schooled her on her options.  Women get together and talk about these things.  More and more women are beginning to plan in the event a marriage fails.  Women are exploring all of their options.  That includes getting the maximum amount of assets from you.  That right cross she gave you does not seem so bad.  In some states, such as California, she is entitled to half of what you own.  From what I gather, that is whether you have a prenup or not.  I believe what you come into a marriage with, that is what you should leave with plus half of whatever was accumulated in the marriage.  Either way you look at it, it is scary.  If everything else being equal and you had selected a latina from a higher class with more education and spoke english, you most likely would not have been as fortunate if the marriage failed.

Take care man and be careful.  A shark is a shark.  It does not matter what part of the ocean it comes from.  If you have to deal with them, choose a mild tempered species.

yc

... in response to I second that ..., posted by yc on Jun 30, 2002

I hope nobody EVER takes any information regarding divorce law or prenuptial aggreements that they read here as fact.

You must see a family law attorney IN YOUR STATE to get the facts.  Very few men I've seen post here seem to have a straight story about what a prenup can and can not do for them.  Many are also ignorant of divorce law (as you apparently are).

It cost me nothing to have three initial consultations with family law attornies before I married.  I suggest everyone do the same.  Perhaps then someone can actually have an informed intelligent discussion on the topic of pre-nups here.

... in response to More pre-nup ignorance, posted by Patrick on Jun 30, 2002

Since I am ignorant of divorce law would you care to explain a little as to what a prenup can and/or cannot do for the state you are most familiar.

To make myself more clear, I have never personally gone through a divorce because I have never been married.  I do not have any children either.  I have not planned for a divorce, because to an extent that is planning for failure.  I am planning for a successful marriage.  My view is if you want a good marriage you talk to those that have a good successful marriage(that is definitely not a lawyer).  They(those with successful marriages) can provide advise in how to make a marriage work.  To find out pitfalls to avoid in a marriages, talk with someone who has experienced them.  Is this an absolute... no!  But it is usually true.  Many would deduce that just heeding one or the other would do the trick.  Sounds logical.  But there are lessons to learn from each.  Beside people generally learn more from their mistakes than their successes.

It takes two to make a marriage work.  One person can not do it himself or herself.  Sometimes one spouse must put forth more(sometimes much more) than their share to make it work.  But overall it should balance out.  There is no one specific magic solution that will keep a marriage together except maybe commitment.  If both the man and woman involved are committed to there marriage, the chances are very good that the marriage will last.  Commitment as in love, respect, dedication(faithfulness, loyalty) and communication.  I also might add the willingness to change.  You probably think I have my head in the clouds and out of touch with the reality of what marriage is about... thinking in terms of the chemistry during the dating and at the early stages of married life.  That feeling is wonderful, but it will eventual wearoff.  When it wearoff then what?  The feeling is part of love, but it is not really what love is about.  If the two are not committed the marriage will eventually go south.

You are correct I do not know much about divorce laws.  But that is mostly by choice.  I believe my efforts would be best spent on planning for the success of a marriage instead of the failure of one.  If people would put as much effort into making the marriage work as they do in a divorce proceedings, maybe the number in this country would be different.  Strictly my opinion only, there is too much legalism in marriage.  Something that was suppose to be sacred, a union between two persons, has become nothing more than a business contract.  What is next down the pike, marriages with an expiration date.  Maybe marriages with a warranties just in case of failure.

The comments I made to Junfan was to him only.  I was NOT informing anyone about what action they should take regarding a prenup or divorce.  No where did I stated otherwise.  I am not a lawyer and have no desire to be one.  The point was he was very lucky.  Over the years I have witness many things.  I have seen women take men to court for child support for children that was not theirs.  I have personally known women that deliberately marry or get pregnant just for financial gain... nothing more.  I have seen women actually physically abuse men believe it of not.  But on the flip side of the coin, I have known men that down right mistreated women and never gave it a second thought.  They slept around, lied, whatever.  The sad fact of the matter is that many have actually gotten away with it.  But then again, I am only speaking out of ignorance.

yc

... in response to Re: More pre-nup ignorance, posted by yc on Jun 30, 2002

My last conversation with an attorney regarding divorce and prenuptial agreements was in California (in 1995 I believe).  Nobody should take what I'm going to say as fact, they should consult with their own attorney.

In California, what was your's before the marriage is your's after the marriage.  The women do not get half of everything you own.  They get half of what you accumulated after you marry.  That includes passive accumulation (i.e. appreciation of investments you had before the marriage).

Prenups can not protect you from alimony.  They can not protect you from child support.  They can not protect you from responsibility under the affidavit of support.

Prenups are particularly important for those who wish to insure that all or part of their estate goes to someone other than their wife in the event of their death.  It's also important for business owners.  If you are a partner in a business and you divorce or die, your wife could end up with sufficient control over the business to destroy it.  You wouldn't want an angry ex to have any interest in your business.

About all a prenup could have done for me was something I did not feel was fair-  It could have protected my income and accumulation during the marriage.  In other words, I marry, but I do not share what I make during the marriage.  I had no children to which I wanted to leave my estate to.  All three attornies advised me to simply document my net worth before going into the marriage and keep the pre-marriage investments separate from post-marriage investments.  That's what I did.

When I see guys who know nothing about divorce laws of prenups screaming about how they're going to get ironclad protection, I cringe.  There is no such thing.  Be as sure as you can before you marry.

I too have seen guys literally raked over the coals in divorces (from American women).  Here in California, if a marriage lasts 10 or more years, alimony can be permanent.  I know one guy who was paying $1,600 per month (as of three years ago, it's no doubt gone up since then) for life to an ex-wife who has a law degree and passed the board.  She never worked though (too busy playing tenis and golf).  When she was caught in bed with a foreign exchange student, things ended (the marriage, not the financial support of her husband).  If not for the fact that their son wanted to live with his father rather than the alcoholic mother, he would have had to pay child support also.

Another guy's wife divorced him after he cut her off from their savings accounts (he found that she had withdrawn about $30,000 over time to keep up with the $70,000 in credit card debts she had created without his knowledge).  She didn't want such a controling jerk for a husband.  Her two children from a previous marriage who her husband adopted and their own son now live with the father who pays, you guessed it, permanent alimony (the mother's busy screwing guys she meets in night clubs).

Prenups would have done nothing for these guys living here in California.  They have their uses, but they are far from any kind of meaningful insurance policy to protect responsible men from the skewed legal system and modern women.  I myself had one of the easiest divorces I've ever heard of.  We had a two year marriage and nothing of value.  I simply let my wife have the new card and took the credit card debt.  Many others have not been so lucky. TO be fair, I've seen women screwed in divorces also.  It seems to be the down-to-earth responsible, hard working people who get screwed, whether they be men or women.  Because men are generally the more agressive wage earners, they tend to be the responsible hark-working half of the marriage more often.

I believe that the best way to avoid getting screwed is either never to marry (or live with a woman and risk a common-law marriage).  If someone does wish to marry (as I did) then pick a good woman with morals and strong family values.  That's precisely why I choose to look for a Latin woman.  I got to know quite a few Mexican women through a girlfriend I had who lived in Tijuana and after we broke up, I never went back to American women.  I knew there were better places to look.

I think the real idiots in this whole thing are those who go to Latin America to find the trophy wife.  Unfortunately, that seems to be fairly common.  They go South to get a better looking woman than they could get here.  Looks are the number 1, 2, and 3 priorities.  Unfortunately, I think there's a reverse correlation between looks and character.  Young beautiful women tend to be high maintainence and bad marriage partners IMHO.  But that doesn't seem to stop all the 40 or 50 somthing year-old guys from pursuing women in their twenties.

... in response to Re: Re: More pre-nup ignorance, posted by Patrick on Jun 30, 2002

I was not entirely informed.  But I still believe the efforts used in exploring divorce options would be better spent on making a marriage work; of coarse that only works when both spouses work at it.  Maybe I have to go through a divorce myself to view it differently.  That just my opinion.

I do agree with you that the real idiots in this whole thing are those who go to Latin America to find the trophy wife.  I do not know anyone that fits this description.  But never the less I am sure it is fairly common.  There is not much that can be done about it.  Those guys would make that mistake here as well if the same options were open to them.  Yes, prenups are not magic shields.  I have heard some of the same arguments that prenups are.  But like I said regarding divorces which can be applied to prenups, it is something I have not explored a great deal.  Why marry someone you do not trust to do the right thing regardless.

Looks does play a role.  A guy should choose a lady he is attracted too.  But all to many times it is the top priority for some guys.  Sadly enough the character of the lady comes somewhere at the bottom.  This is a disaster waiting to happen.  More than likely this situation probably accounts for most of the failed LW/AM marriages.

If I may ask, your present wife, how exactly did you two meet?  If you corresponded with her, what was the length of time?  At what point did the two of you started to correspond and/or date exclusively?

Thanks,

yc

... in response to Re: Re: More pre-nup ignorance, posted by Patrick on Jun 30, 2002

Twenties? Ha! abuelas! my fiance is seventeen. Patrick you seem very well informed about marriage, divorce, prenups etc. in the US. Have you run accross any info on how it works with marriage in Colombia and division of property in the case of divorce?

... in response to Re: Re: Re: More pre-nup ignorance, posted by Cali vet on Jun 30, 2002

CALIVET,
Yor are on a real roll here pal. WHAT IN GOD'S NAME WOULD A 17 YEAR OLD WANT WITH A 57 YEAR OLD?

I think the real idiots in this whole thing are those who go to Latin America to find the trophy wife. Unfortunately, that seems to be fairly common. They go South to get a better looking woman than they could get here. Looks are the number 1, 2, and 3 priorities. Unfortunately, I think there's a reverse correlation between looks and character. Young beautiful women tend to be high maintainence and bad marriage partners IMHO. But that doesn't seem to stop all the 40 or 50 somthing year-old guys from pursuing women in their twenties.

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: More pre-nup ignorance, posted by robbysanjuan on Jun 30, 2002

Whatsa matta jealous? The god-less commie couldn't find a latina in his own native country? What about the Peru trip another blank? Guess that's why your profile is all blank.

... in response to Re: final question, posted by JunFan on Jun 29, 2002

I hear you.. ha ha.. I was just wondering if they were a little less aggressive than their American counterparts.. ha ha.. I guess not.. oh well.. it was a nice thought ha ha..

... in response to El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

I think it is normal after a crash and burn to get a little negative.  Maybe alot negative.  After my RW experience, you don't see me flying off to Moscow again.  I'm sure there is at least one good RW over there, but I gave up on them.  So it's not hard to imagine Mike giving up on  Latinas.  It's understandable.

I too went back to American women for a year after my divorce to my RW...  They hadn't changed a bit.

Even though my RW marriage didn't work, she was still better then any American women I ever dated.

So take it easy Mike and never say never.  You may just have become addicted to International dating without knowing it.  You may not want to try Colombia again, but maybe Volgograd, Sidney, or maybe Denmark.

But back to American women....  I'd rather become a monk.

Wayne

... in response to Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by Wayne1 on Jun 28, 2002

Hey bro...
I have by no means given up on Latin women.  I just prefer the ones who are already here, rather than bring another one here.  Frankly, for me the risks outweigh the rewards.  That's all.  

Too negative, nah.  Realist, yep.

... in response to Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by JunFan on Jun 28, 2002

Later dude, and, oh, could you send me Olga's phone number?

... in response to Re: Re: Re: El Fin de JunFan, posted by Wasp on Jun 28, 2002

That still stands as the best rack I have ever seen.