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I might file my visa app with co-sponsors just to (hopefully) ensure that it goes through the first time.

One potential co-sponsor is a recent widow and she wants to know if "her" income from the previous year is the same as "their" income, since they always filed joint IRS returns, and she really had "no" income of her very own. But her late husband's past years' income and the assets she has been left with are more than adequate.

I assume that her current assets will hold more weight than the former income of her late husband.

... in response to tax filing status for co-sponsor, posted by Luther on Sep 28, 2004

Hi Luther,
 I really hope I am not out of line here, and you really do seem like a nice and sincere guy.  But, why the rush ?
My understanding is that you have not even met her yet, and that you have never  travelled abroad .
You might want to wait until you have actually met her in person before you become so serious about everything.
Also, if your penpal is truly sincere, she will wait for you, a good woman would understand that the process takes a long time.  
The Philippines and Filipinos can be very different from America.  The culture and beliefs can be very different from ours.
Time is your friend.  I strongly recommend that you visit her in person first, learn as much about her and her culture, and then make your decision from there.  

Best of luck,

Don

... in response to Luther ???, posted by don2222 on Sep 30, 2004

you mentioned that some of your ex wife's friends informed you about some of her negatives(red flags) while you both were lengthy together there in RP. I'm curious to since you were around countless available Filipinas friends, etc looking for a Foreigner husband, not one of those Pinays came forward to warn you that your Mahal was messing around with a Boyfriend while involved with you. You know, maybe you could've gotten hooked up with one of those available Pinays, if only one came forward with the warning. Thats kinda Puzzling..

... in response to Hey Don22222, posted by gregas on Oct 2, 2004

Hi Gregas,
 Only one of her  friends told me that my ex was immature and irresponsible.  That friend was busy trying to hook her Australian  bf, so she really did not pay much attention to me.
My ex's other friends were not attractive to me at all, and we really did not spend that much time with them.
The sister that talked to me lived in a different city, so she probably did not know what was going on.
Also, my ex could be very charming and likeable when she decided to be, she had many other people fooled also.

Anyway, during my time with my ex in the Phils I fell in love with the country and its people. After the divorce I sold everything and moved to the Phils.  I have never been happier.
So it all worked out for the best in the long run....

Don :0)

... in response to Luther ???, posted by don2222 on Sep 30, 2004

Don, I'm glad you raised these questions, because I have been wondering the same thing.

There is a reason that there are financial means tests for those bringing a spouse to the US--- so the rest of us don't wind up supporting them via welfare. The expenses associated with bringing a spouse to the US, getting them settled, employed, etc., will be higher than you expect.

Second, the instant family plan. Unless you plan on a 12 month honeymoon in PI, it is unlikely that your wife to be will become pregnant. It takes the average couple around 12 months to conceive. Women over forty have lower rates of conception, higher rates of spontaneous abortions and birth defects.

Luther, I'm sure you're a good guy with your heart in the right place, but I think you are rushing into something that could have devastating financial and emotional consequences. Don and Greg make a valid point--- take your time!

... in response to Luther ???, posted by don2222 on Sep 30, 2004

Yes, your advice is good.  Jovie pretty much told me the same thing a few minutes ago, take care of biz and plan on a good visit together, plan the wedding a little later.  I don't know how old you are, but I'm 48 and she's 42, so that's part of why I'm in a hurry...the other part is, it's my normal way of doing things, when a woman is in love with me I think in terms of grab fast before I lose the chance.  But we are trying to get to a practical level of planning based on my real financial ability etc.

... in response to Re: Luther ???, posted by Luther on Sep 30, 2004

I haven't followed your posts, but I want you to know that since she's 42..You shouldn't worry about some other Guy trying to Grab her(most Foreigners are interested in younger Ladies). I wouldn't recommend making Promises of having babies, marriage, blab blab etc without meeting in Person, and without spending time with Her. Everything isn't what it seem like in the Philippines. I'm starting over myself at age 50 with a 4 yr old Filipino child, what I have learned is to make no promises, don't rush, don't give her money unless you are involved in a meanful relationship.

... in response to Hi Luther, posted by gregas on Sep 30, 2004

I paid for gregory's mother to return to Hong Kong for employment on Sept 30th. Safer to take gregory to visit Her in HK than the Philippines.  Only cost me a little over $1000 dollars for her to join aboard employment agency. I've supported Her since 1999, thank God that October is my last month giving Her funds. (sigh)

... in response to Update, posted by gregas on Sep 30, 2004

Gregas,

I know that must have been a tough situation for you.  Thankfully it is almost over.  I share joint physical custody with me ex.  Our daughter is 2 1/2.  My ex was also a Filipina.  Her attorney asked the Judge if she could take our daughter to the Philippines for three weeks.  The Judge said no way is this little girl to leave North Carolina.  I personally don't think that my ex would come back from the Philippines if she ever went.  That is always a worry that I have.  

Keith

... in response to Re: Update, posted by Keith NC on Sep 30, 2004

I wanted very much to take our Son to see his Mommie, last time they saw each other was back in June 2001 when he was 7 month old. Our problem is that she is separated from Her husband, only way she can get here is to Annulment Her marriage. I can't get myself to send any Filipino Lawyer thousands of dollars to Annulment her marriage(don't trust those Lawyers). The lesson I've learned is to Run, don't Walk away from any Filipina that say she is Married or Separated, my plan was to get married by 2000, still unmarried becuz of my misfortunate. Yeah, I'm glad that after October she is no longer depending on me as a cash Cow. Whatsoever I did for Her was becuz I love our Son very much. I might visit the Philippines this December, I look forward to the challenge of finding a new Sweetie. :O)

... in response to tax filing status for co-sponsor, posted by Luther on Sep 28, 2004

Luther,

Assuming that you’re talking I-864, you can not file an affidavit for a joint sponsor “just to … ensure that it goes through the first time”. If your own current individual income exceeds the minimum requirement, you are not allowed to use a joint sponsor.

Just for the sake of discussion, if you do use a joint sponsor because your income does not meet the minimum requirements, the joint sponsor must qualify on his/her own merit. In the case you described, the widow would have to qualify on her own individual current income, preferably income from steady employment. For the total income of both spouses to be counted, one would have to file the I-864 and the other would need to file an accompanying I-864A. Since the spouse is no longer living, the widow would have to list her individual income from her most recent tax return using her own W-2 form as evidence of her individual income and the income of the departed spouse would not be counted. Since you stated that she had no income of her own, and assuming that she has no current employment income, then it sounds like a bad choice for a joint sponsor. If she had substantial cash assets, then it is ‘possible’ that she might qualify as a joint sponsor based on her assets alone, but I wouldn’t count on it.

Ray

... in response to Not allowed, posted by Ray on Sep 29, 2004

Just to be sure, I think I read somewhere that if my Immigrant visa is turned down, (1) I won't be able to turn around and file a K-3, and (2) in 2 years I will be able to try again.  Right?

Ray, you're a veteran, isn't it considered honorable among men who are separated from their wives to go ahead and give them the babies they want, and get reunited with the family when it becomes possible?

Not the best way to start a family, but not dishonorable, right?

What do you guys think?  I know what nephew Howard thinks!  It is not always in my nature to know what I think...

It is Jovie's wish to start the family as soon as possible.  As long as I can support them from here I see no problem (except for missing each other, missing out on some of that initial bonding with my kids...)

Has anybody had to deal with this situation or one like it?

Luther

... in response to what if turned down/question for everybo..., posted by Luther on Sep 30, 2004

I understand the urgency both of you feel.  I can't say I'd feel much different if I were in either of your shoes.  But I agree with Don2222, NW Jim and I suspect others in saying your moving way too fast.  My first marriage occurred "way too fast" followed by near 25 years of long, slow suffering for it.  I've seen several guys here think that they made good choices (who BTW took much more time than you in finding a mate without near the starting out problems) only to spend several years suffering and then divorcing and then starting all over again.  

I'm all for you dude, BUT... I say communicate.  If you got a question or concern, ask.  If you think that its wrong to tell your gf about "expectations" you have in marriage then you are lying to yourself and not communicating the bricks that will build a wall to failure.  If your don't know before you marry what her concerns and expectations are and how she'll react to those imminent hard times the hurt will be more than anything you can imagine.  Discuss all issues.  Now!  The easy part will be figthing the governement for immigrations rights or missing your family because they are in another country.  The hard part will be finding out that you can't stand something she does, believes or wants or know that she feels horrible thing(s) about you or even worse - never intended to.  

Don's technique was awesome - I was jealous of his courage in finding a mate.  I thought it was foolproof.  Just to watch that 89 lb filpina kick his ass because she lied to him from the start.  Howard wrote some of the most awesome discriptive loving words trying to communicate how he felt about his spouse just to have his spouse hide from him so he couldn't communicate - couldn't/wouldn't work it out - cause she wasn't the one who wrote him from the beginning.  I was shocked at the many others who can tell you unbelievable stories that just were not expected.  This is more difficult than anything a rocket scientist does.  There is nothing exact about it other than it hurts like hell when you fail.

Besides the fact that you are going to have some serious separation issues from both your wife and child, and of course the governement issues due to earnnings (money is always a family destroyer) you might have serious health concerns to deal with because women over 40 having children is a big concern for both her and the baby.  This is on top of the normal problems that occur on a daily basis added in with the oddities of two very different, yet very similar cultures trying to make one household.  That sure is a lot to talk about.

Do us proud dude and slow down, give yourself some options and make it work the right way.

... in response to This might not be taken well...., posted by Bear on Oct 1, 2004

[This message has been edited by don2222]

What I did was I spent about 8 months in the Phils trying to spend time with my now ex-wife and make sure she was the right one for me before I brought her to America.  I even went with her to the physical and the interview at the embassy in Manila.   At that time I was 37, and had never been married, so I really tried my best to choose the right women for me, and I spent all my money, and as much of my time in the Phils as possible to try to get to know her. By the time we arrived in America I was flat broke, and had to borrow money from my mother, and borrow my grandmothers car. The first 6 months in America were good, but then I endured about one year of a living hell with her in America before I asked for a divorce.
It was only after bringing her to America did the many  lies start to reveal themselves.  Some information  that Bear helped to reveal was that she still had a boyfriend in the Phils that she apparently planned to bring to America   after using me to get her citizenship. After I asked her for a divorce, she then contacted all my friends, family members, business contacts and associates, and even my customers, and started spreading lies and half-truths about me. During all of this I tried to take the high road, and say nothing about her or the relationship. But that backfired on me in that many people took her side of the story and I lost a few friends due to them believing everything she said and not understanding why I was not happy with her.
I still blame myself in that I ignored a few red flags and I chose the wrong woman. Also, at the time we married I still did not know as much about her and her culture as I should have.  We did have many arguements due to my not understanding her country and culture.   But, past is past, and that is basically what happened  to me.

Don

... in response to My "technique", posted by don2222 on Oct 1, 2004

Hi Don,

Sorry if I forget all the story.I'm curious, just how did Bear know she had a boyfriend?

Take Care,
Jay

... in response to Re: My "technique", posted by Jay on Oct 1, 2004

[This message has been edited by Bear]

When I went to Atlanta for training.  My wife and I met up with Don and his "ex" several times.  His "ex" started calling my wife after we came back to Houston to discuss her "marriage" problems and told Honey how she found out that boyfriend back in the R.P. was found to actually her cousin and she was so depressed about it because she couldn't marry him now.  We advised Don.

Bear

... in response to Re: Re: My "technique", posted by Bear on Oct 1, 2004

ROFLMGDAOTNTSAPIMMFD!!!

Sorry Don,

Having been through a divorce, I know it isn't a pleasant experience! But the "payback" in your case was a friggin' classic, all while you maintained the high ground! "What goes around...comes around"...but in this case it "came around like a typhoon!"

Dave H.

... in response to Re: Re: My "technique", posted by Bear on Oct 1, 2004

Hi Bear,

Thanks for enlightening me. Her cousin? Wow, that's weird. What made her decide to break down and tell Honey?

Take Care,
Jay

... in response to Re: Re: Re: My "technique", posted by Jay on Oct 2, 2004

Hi Jay,
 My ex was the stereotypical Filipina that would tell anything and everything to a person she had just met, as long as they were a Filipino also.
Sometimes there is an "us against them" thinking where they think that a fellow Filipino won't tell the Foreigner what has been said.  But, Honey went straight to Bear and told him what she had heard.

Don

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: My "technique", posted by don2222 on Oct 2, 2004

Hi Don,

Wow,I wonder where was I when all this was happening. I don't remember reading about it. Good on Honey for saying something to Bear. Alot of people would have just kept it a secret, thinking it was none of their business. Lucky for you, they had the guts to get involved.

Do you ever see your ex or know whats happened to her? I'm still amazed at her finding out it was a cousin. LOL!

Anyway, Take Care out there,
Jay

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: My "technique&q..., posted by Jay on Oct 3, 2004

[This message has been edited by don2222]

Hi Jay,
 My divorce was two years ago, but this is the first time  I am writing about it.  At the time of the divorce I just want to get it over with and move on with my life, I just focused on work and other things.

I saw my ex while she was visiting the Phils about 2 months ago, she is now married to another American, but she had the sister tell me that the ex still loved me and the ex wanted to meet me in secret.  Yeah right !
Fool me once.......

And yes, I did try to contact the other American and let him know about my ex before he married her, but he did not want to listen to me.

You take care also,

Don :0)

... in response to My "technique", posted by don2222 on Oct 1, 2004

What kind of "red flags" did you fail to notice and why in the end did she end up being the wrong woman for you?  Sorry to ask but I hadn't read about your story before.

... in response to Re: My "technique", posted by Rota20 on Oct 1, 2004

Hi Rota,

 Both my ex's best friend and my ex's sister told me that my ex was not mature or responsible.  At her age of 24 I thought she would be more responsible, but she wasn't.
Also, in going through my ex's childhood pictures she looked angry in every picture.  That turned out to be a big problem. Nothing I did made her happy, she always wanted more.
She is just one of those people that will probably never be happy.

Don :0)

... in response to Red Flags, posted by don2222 on Oct 2, 2004

Hi Don,

I think almost everyone discounts a couple of red flags along the way.  I know I did.  It's only natural to be biased to the optimistic side when making a decision where your feelings are involved.  All we can do is try to take an objective look at the flags, make a logical assesment as to the degree of risk, and then drop the flag or persue it further.  If everyone backed out at their first perception of a red flag, very few of us would end up married.

Jim

... in response to what if turned down/question for everybo..., posted by Luther on Sep 30, 2004

Luther,

If the visa is denied outright, then you could still apply again depending on the reason for the denial and whether or not you fixed the problem that caused the denial. I know of no 2-year waiting period before you can submit another petition. You could try again the next day as far as I know. If you file an I-130 petition in conjunction with an I-129F for a K-3, and the I-130 is disapproved, then the associated K-3 becomes invalid also by default. Sometimes they will deny the visa but hold the file open until you correct some deficiency, which could take anywhere from a month to a year or more depending on what you need to do.

Luther, I understand that your lady wants to have a baby right away after marriage. But how do YOU feel about that? Before you go making babies, make sure that BOTH of you are ready to start a family. There is nothing ‘dishonorable’ about getting your wife pregnant and then leaving for an extended period of time. It happens all the time. When I was in the Navy, my first wife became pregnant just before I left for an extended 9-month deployment overseas. She delivered 6 days before I returned so I missed out on all the pregnancy fun. Like you said, maybe not the ideal way to do it, but certainly honorable.

In your case, if you are both ready for children, and since she is in her 40’s already, there is nothing wrong with getting that bun in the oven right away as far as I’m concerned. How badly does she want children? Just make sure that she fully understands that getting pregnant is never guaranteed, especially at her age. You might suggest that she get a thorough gynecological checkup now. Her gynecologist can order a couple of tests that should tell her whether she is still fertile and can have children. You can also have your doctor order a semen evaluation for yourself to see if those little boogers are still swimming.

Ray

... in response to what if turned down/question for everybo..., posted by Luther on Sep 30, 2004

Hi Luther,

Sorry guy, but you are asking for opinions, and I think it is irresponsible to make babies in that situation.
You have not really had time to form a strong foundation for your relationship.  You have not met her in person, and in the few weeks that you may spend in the Philippines you will not have enough time to learn everything about her and her culture.  If you want to marry a woman that you really do not know, then you are both adults and that is your decision. But to bring a baby into the relationship before you have had time  to build a strong marriage to me is not a responsible thing to do.  My understanding of the Philippines, and I have spent several years living in the Phils, is that it is almost impossible for a woman over 40 to find a husband.  Maybe you are worried about her finding another man ?  Is that why you are so hasty in your decisions ? You are afraid she will find someone else ?  
Sure her biological clock is ticking, but when you talk about making such hasty decisions, you are not only affecting yours and her life, you are now bringing a third person, the baby, into what could be a decision made out of desperation.

Luther, I really hope it all works out for you.  But, you asked for opinions, and this is mine.  I am only sharing with you my thoughts, and I hope it all turns out for the best for you.  Time is your friend, and that is really what I am trying to say.  I am just suggesting that you slow down, and concentrate on your relationship with your penpal and your possible future wife.

Take care, and good luck,

Don

... in response to Not allowed, posted by Ray on Sep 29, 2004

As always, it is a pleasure to do business with you.  If the bureaucracy was as easy to get answers out of as you...well, that's a fantasy!

Assuming that your info is correct (and you sound like you know what you're talking about), I will inform my potential co-sponsors that they can forget the affidavit.  Since my current income is OK we'll leave it at that, and if I don't get the visa because of past years' inadequacies, who knows, maybe I'd rather live in the Philippines anyway.

Luther

... in response to Not allowed, posted by Ray on Sep 29, 2004

Ray,

I have learned so much just by reading your posts.  Hopefully I can remember all of it.  I may end up filing  a K-1 visa next year after vistiting the Philippines in January.

Take Care,

Keith

... in response to Wealth of knowledge., posted by Keith NC on Sep 30, 2004

n/t