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Hi Guys (and Gals):

The past few weeks (months?) have managed to illuminate some pretty serious problems on the board. So serious, some may argue, that they threaten the fundamental value and worth of this - what has been (arguably) *THE* - most valuable board for discussion of this topic anywhere on the internet.

As I've pondered my part (sadly, a significant one) in the development of these problems - and as I've resolved to improve my behavior on the board - I asked myself what led me here and what I might do to overcome those factors.

The result is - for me - a list of 'assertions' (some call them "affirmations") that I will read periodically to remind myself of my commitment to this board and her participants.

I do not delude myself into believing these are 'right' for everyone, but I thought it might prove worthwhile to post them here for others to see.

For one thing - through public display of my 'commitment' - I also ask for the support of others to keep me 'honest' if I should begin to stray from these principles (I won't).

I welcome your comments and am open to suggestions.

To deflect some of the expected initial reactions, I also offer the following:

1) As I developed the list, I had in my mind some of the assumed/purported incidents that have caused much grief and tension on the board. I don't want anyone thinking that merely because I assert that I will behave in a particular way in the future, means that I have behaved otherwise in the past.
2) There are, indeed, violations of several of these assertions that I am guilty of in the past. Frequent participants will quickly identify those. I am not guilty of them all.
3) The list was primarily developed for my own use, but I did give some thought as to what might constitute a 'generic' list that would be applicable (and useful) for others.

So . . . . with all those disclaimers out of the way, here is the list I've developed.

Suggested Guidelines for Ethical Posting:

* My principal reason for participating on this board is to make a contribution that genuinely helps others [alternative: My principal reason for posting here is to learn something]
* I will remain silent if I am unfamiliar with a topic or unable to make the time necessary to fully respond to a question/issue.
* I will refuse to participate in mud-slinging debates - period!
* Should someone take offense at something I write and become publicly offensive, I will refrain from engaging in a 'war of words' and will calmly re-state my position (hopefully in a manner that is entirely benign).
* I will NEVER engage in tit-for-tat posting tactics. State my 'piece' in as few posts as possible and move on. If the recipient doesn't 'get it' in 3 or 4 posts - then either they are closed-minded or I am unable to provide a suitable perspective. Either way - it is time to move on.
* I will refuse to respond to a troll post, except to merely identify it as a troll post.
* I will give people the benefit of the doubt and will make every effort NOT to 'read between the lines.'
* I will never post as anyone other than my principal board identity.
* I will never profess to be anyone/anything that I am not.
* I will not claim to have experiences/credentials/contacts/whatever that are false.
* If, as a result of the above, I find myself being duped - then I will remember that it is more a reflection of the perpetrator than it is on those whom they have duped.

There you have it. Comments welcome. If it doesn't go far enough - please make suggestions (non-inflammatory ones - - I'm still feeling my way --smile--).

Cheers!

- Dan

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003

NT

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003


Dan , I agree with most of your comments and suggestions posted here regarding discussion board etiquette . Good post , I am glad that someone took it upon themselves to address and discuss this issue .

I have found this board to be a valuable resource for information , getting questions answered , and occaisional entertainment . Plus , it has been a good place for me to hang out while waiting for the Nebraska INS office to get off their butts...( they are currently moving at the speed of molasses in winter , I'm sorry to say...:-( ...  ) . The layout of this board is much more user-friendly and easier to navigate than any other RW discussion board that I've seen yet . And Patrick has been pretty generous in the latitude he's allowed us here ; we enjoy a certain amount of 'freedom of expression' here that I haven't seen elsewhere .  

The topic we discuss here is one that is near and dear to our hearts ; some of us are quite passionate and / or highly opinionated about this . So , some occaisional head-butting is inevitable , I don't think there's any way to avoid that . But I think that your guidelines might help to minimize any detrimental effects such incidents might have on the fundamental value of this board .

Also agree with some of the comments made by others who responded to your post :

Jeff S said that if you're posting second-hand or third-party information , it should be qualified as such . Good idea .

Richard said : Don't feed the trolls . Good idea .

Charles commented on the 'silent majority ' ; and I also agree with what he said . If you look at the number of hits this website gets versus the number of posts here , you can easily conclude that there are a lot more readers and lurkers here than posters . I think that there may be a lot of people out there who sometimes consider posting some comments or trip reports , but change their minds after reading page after page of infighting and negative comments . I think that some say : ".......Nah....Probably more trouble than it's worth...." or "....Nah.....I don't need the agravation or abuse..." . We're not going to get any 'fresh blood' in here if we keep driving people away or discourage people from posting their comments here .

I am not a very prolific or frequent poster here ; but when I do have something to say , I will certainly keep your guidelines in mind .  

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003

Good stuff Dan - and if followed, will certainly boost the usefulness and usability of these boards. I had an idea for an addition also. How about something like... "if posting third party information, identify it as such." For instance: "when my brother spent three weeks in Budapest, he said..." or "I hear from the salesmen at my company that when you land at the Warsaw airport..."

Some of this information could certainly be useful, even if the poster doesn't have direct knowledge. Some of my best traveling insider scoop have come across that way, but it doesn't hold as much creedence as a direct experience of another.

Just a thought.

- Jeff S.

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003

This looks good to  me.  I do have one addition to propose:

Take inflamatory/ mud slinging / offensive threads and / or strong dissagreements off board if you fell the need to discuss them.  I am hoping that the parties to a heated disagreement can reach some sort of agreement, even if only to agree to disagree.  After some discussion, the parties might choose to update the board on the resolution including compromises, mutual understandings and point that they agree to disagree on.  (Some issues my not have one correct position for all people.)

I would also like to comment on the "proper" response to trolls.  I have always maintained that a strict "Don't feed the Trolls" policy is best.  I happen to consider tagging troll posts as troll post to be feeding the trolls because I believe that many of them are because they want people to pay attention to them and by tagging trolls we are giving them what they desire most: attention.  I know from past discussions with other board members that many disagree with my position.  I submit that this is something that we will have to agree to disagree on.  I bring this up so that people who haven't developed a strong opinion, one way or the other, on this issue can develope a strong opinion.

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003

[This message has been edited by yoe]

those  words  should be muttered like a mantra every morning as our eyes open to the new glorious day.
1. negative posts are bad for moral-good for clicks ie. advertising credits (in some cases maybe not here)
2. one man's grief is another man's satisfaction
3. one man's failure is one man's warning
4. one man's success is one man's envy
so what is right and what is wrong..........who knows.
I will bet a dollar to a nickel that the tit tats actually keep people's attention. Like it or not, admit it or not, but most come back to see what kind of action is happening.
We are participating in a self defecating car crash.
But I will make it all simpler!
we are involved in a very emotional affair-life with a Russian woman........it does not get more intense.....
Joe

... in response to all is good in da hood......, posted by yoe on Jan 27, 2003

get out of Compton, now!

You lookin' at me?

You want some?

hahahahaha....

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003

.

... in response to Invitation to Comment - Posting Guidelin..., posted by Dan on Jan 26, 2003

GREAT IDEA, Dan!  I like what I see.  I would suggest adding some rules about how we treat new posters.  Too often someone comes here with what appears to be good intentions and gets hounded off as a troll, real or imagined, and the "silent majority" (remember ol Tricky? LOL) sits silently in front of their computer too afraid to take the abuse or being attacked for their lack of expertise on the various issue.  I think your guidelines are excellent - you might want to take the general goals that you identify (helping others/getting valuable info) and have a rule that a new poster will be treated with additonal consideration and respect.  Otherwise, the silent majority will not learn anything, but will continue to be "entertained" by an online version of an adolescent locker room.  Anyway, that's my initial reaction.  I hope that the rest of the group has an equally positive response to your efforts.