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Gentlemen of this board,

I want to say a couple of things to hopefully clear the air, and make my position clear.  When I joined this board about 1 1/2 years ago, I joined to specifically learn, or attempt to learn more about the latinas and their language and culture.  I admitted then, as I admit now that I have a long way to go.  What I don't need is for someone to try to play psychologist and put me on a "virtual coach".  I can do better watching reruns of Frasier!!  Having said that, we all have flaws, and I certainly have mine.  What I am asking for is some help, from time to time, on certain points as it relates to helping me reach my goal of someday meeting and marrying the right lady for me.   Since this format is open to many people from many areas of the country and many backgrounds, etc., then I think it would be nice for all of us to help the other guy as much as we can; but without "throwing stones".  Frankly, for the most part, I have enjoyed the exchange of ideas that has gone on over the past few days.  But, this board sometimes has a tendency to go overboard, and criticize someone, just because they don't either see eye to eye, or have different experience levels.  Just because someone has made 10 or more trips to Colombia, or anywhere in Latin America, does not make them God's gift to humanity!!  So, even though I was asking for help in certain areas; that does not mean that I am requesting any of you to scrutinize my entire life!  I can't speak for any of you, but I value my privacy, and I will not continue on this format, if that is what will continually happen.  I don't need the grief!!  Having said that, Pete was kind enough to write a private email to me, because I stayed at his apartment in May.  He knew the lady in question, and shared with me where I made some mistakes.  I really appreciated that.   So, I just hope that some other men, who have either not posted yet, or some who used to post, but quit, will come back.  But, still the continual hammering by certain people in order to show themselves some kind of expert is useless!  I hope that from now on, we can get back to helping each other, and at the same time, giving each other a little respect.  If that is too much to ask, then I will leave this board!

                                OkieMan

... in response to Concerning my questions, etc, posted by OkieMan on Sep 26, 2005

I can recomend the book "Games People Play" by Eric Berne, M.D.  My version of the book copywright 1964 has at the top of the cover "2 years at the top of the nations bestseller lists."  I was two years old at the time, so I have to take somebody elses word for that......

It is NOT easy to read, but for anyone who takes the time you will see family, friends coworkers, enemies and everybody else exposed doing what the vast majority of us do to fill up (waste) our time between birth and death.  
And you will get insight into what the "games" are really about, the payoffs, for each and every player in the "game" (nobody can play a "game" by themselves).  The motivation for escaping these "games" (social dynamics) is to achieve awareness, spotaniety and intimacy.

from page 48 and page 60 (forgive any typos)

"A GAME is an ongoing series of complementary ulterior transactions progressing to a well-defined, predictable outcome."

"Because there is so little opportunity for intimacy in daily life, and because some forms of intimacy (especially if intense) are psychologically impossible for most people, the bulk of the time in serious social life is taken up with playing games.  Hence games are both necessary and desirable, and the only problem at issue is whether the games played by an individual offer the best yield for him."

(The kicker is the last sentence, we can keep re-reading it until we get it.)

Yes, I have the book, and yes I have found it very helpful, and yes I have achieved moments of awareness, spotaniety and intimacy, but no, I am not anywhere near shedding myself of the games I am inclined to play.

Teo Blas

... in response to Nobody here is perfect, posted by teoblas on Sep 27, 2005

Teo,

It is difficult, and you are right, no one is perfect.  But, I still must strive to be honest and do my best; otherwise I would turn into are real stinker!  So, here I am striving to become the man I want to be.

                      OkieMan

... in response to Nobody here is perfect, posted by teoblas on Sep 27, 2005

"Where do we go from here now that all other children are growin' up
and how do we spend our lives if there's no-one to lend us a hand
I don't wanna live here no more,
i don't wanna stay
ain't gonna spend the rest of my life,
quietly fading away
Games people play,
you take take it or you leave it
things that they say,
honor brite
if i promise you the moon and the stars,
would you believe it
games people play in the middle of the night" - The Alan Parson Project

... in response to Concerning my questions, etc, posted by OkieMan on Sep 26, 2005

Okieman,

I think this board serves its purpose in helping guys in the many areas of getting involved with a Latin American woman. I am going on my third month of marriage to a wonderful woman from Peru and if it wasn't for Planet Love and would not be married to this wonderful lady right now.

In my opinion and with all due respect Okieman.....I really think all of your questions about the entire process have been answered here. The only way your going to learn more is to get back down to South America.

Now....there is nothing wrong with enjoying this board as a social outlet. This place is like a "Virtual Bar" in some respects.....so enjoy Planet Love now for that reason.

But for you to learn more here??

No

All of your questions have already been answered

... in response to Re: Concerning my questions...to Okieman, posted by Chris F on Sep 27, 2005

Chris,

I think you are right.  Now, it is up to me to take it from here. But, I still will enjoy a new and fresh approach, every now and then (ie if any latinas will post on this board, from time to time).  As far as travelling to Colombia or Peru, or wherever; yes, I am working on trying to go there again.  They say that the 3rd time is the charm.  It's an old saying, but I don't know how true it is. But, having said that, I have been to Cali twice, and so whichever city or cities I go to; this next trip will be my 3rd.  So, I am still trying to learn and grow. By the way, best of luck with your marriage.  May you have many years of happiness.  Do you plan to have children?
My oldest son will turn 25 on Friday!  Now, that is a big marker in his life and mine!  Take care.

                              OkieMan

... in response to Concerning my questions, etc, posted by OkieMan on Sep 26, 2005

Hoda hit it right on the head.

Make your next trip to SA a vacation, and you won't feel as disappointed/empty when you return home.  These trips should be about relieving stress, not compounding it.  It's a lesson I also learned after returning from trips to Peru, where I never even set time aside to see places like Machu Pichu.  Check out the travel websites (like Fromers, for instance:  http://www.frommers.com/), and orient your trip around specific sites/places you want to see or visit.    

... in response to Concerning my questions, etc, posted by OkieMan on Sep 26, 2005


and not quest...

My first trip (4 days) was just to get my feet wet. O-Man, it was a lot to take in then....and the same goes for now. You have to remember whether you like it or not. That once you share things on a forum such as this, you are sacrificing some privacy. Pull back a little, regroup & get your ass back down south. Next time back...think VACATION!!!

You described yourself as an "Old Dawg, trying to learn new things", nothing at all wrong with that. Your heart is in the right place, which is more than can be said for some who go south! Just fine tune a few things...

and get yo narra ass back down South, ya hear?!!!

... in response to Make you next trip a vacation...., posted by Hoda on Sep 26, 2005

Hoda,

Thanks for the good comments.  I will learn from my past mistakes.  I also want to further comment about what has happened recently on the board, concerning ladies posting on here.  Sometimes, we need to hear from any latinas
(married or single) who can shed some light on what is important to them. You know, get their prospective.  I am sure it would be much, much different then mine-- and I need to hear and understand that.  Much of my frustration has been that I think like an american man, set my goals like an american man, act like a (nice) american man, and get sadly disappointed-- but don't understand why.  I have asked questions from the men on this board, but boy, would it be really great to hear from the ladies.  Also, I would assume that most, if not all of the potential ladies who might be willing to post would have met many american men, and could give an imformed response.  Now, I say that because based on my somewhat limited experience; I don't think that most of  the latinas we meet in Colombia (or wherever) have any idea of what life is really like in the US. On top of that, there are many regional differences.  For instance, I understand that you live in NYC.  Is that correct?   Well, I am sure you can appreciate that life in NYC is much different than Tulsa, Oklahoma, much less Cali or Medellin or Bogota!  The only info they would probably get would be from movies or TV- and we know how distorted that can be.  So, again, I just second the motion that you Hoda, and others get your wives or girlfriends to post (if you can).  Naturally, any ladies like Carolina in Cali would be great too.  I think it would help the light bulb to come on for some guys (myself included).

                               OkieMan

... in response to Re: Make you next trip a vacation...., posted by OkieMan on Sep 26, 2005

Hey O-Man! I like it! Maybe you could be the O-Dude?

I wrote a big long post and thought I would keep it to myself.
Nope, not ragging on you. It was a long way of saying... Don't go feeling like everyone is running you off.

Rock on O-Man! haha

V-Dude

... in response to Re: Re: Make you next trip a vacation......, posted by valleydude on Sep 26, 2005

Valleydude,

Thanks for the kind remarks.  Take care.

                         OkieMan

... in response to Concerning my questions, etc, posted by OkieMan on Sep 26, 2005

[This message has been edited by stefang]

You seem to have some of the same personality as Pete. Pete is easy going guy like yourself, if he sends you some email it may be better to listen to a guy like him about his past experiences. Other guys like Heat and Jimc are also well known for their experience but they seem to act like the local men maybe they are the smart guys by staying in Colombia and enjoying and tasting:)~ the scenery.

Let Calipro take you under his wing. He'll show you how to take them and trade them every few years to America. Cali how many have you married and divorced hahaha? Is it three? I still think the best way to meet someone is by introduction get to know some of the guys down there and maybe they can help your cause.