Mail-Order Misery

[Heat]

... in response to Re: Submissive and obedient women are no..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005

The Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it. Many of the men who disagree should have their nose in the Bible instead of looking at womens photos on websites and lusting after the flesh. If the man has his nose in the Bible, 99% of the time he will be right and the woman will follow his lead. ""

Wow!  You are a fanatic.  I would say brainwashed idot.

[Neil]

... in response to Re: Re: Submissive and obedient women ar..., posted by Heat on Feb 1, 2005

"You are a fanatic...brainwashed idot"

Thank you for your thoughts.  The correct spelling is "idiot".

[Ray]

... in response to Learn to spell, Heat., posted by Neil on Feb 3, 2005

This ought to be fun!

[Hoda]

... in response to Re: Submissive and obedient women are no..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005


Neil, best of luck in your search for what you want & need in a life-mate. Any number of guys here may feel the need to challenge your perception of what a woman's role, in life, love & marriage should be defined as. Spiritual awareness/acceptance will vary here on PL, as much as the men on the quest to find & be found by love.

Good luck Neil....

p.s. I'm hoping that this thread will stay civil, otherwise...

[Jamie]

... in response to Re: Submissive and obedient women are no..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005

“problem was caused by their own wrongdoing and emotional overreacting when they should have listened to the husband and obeyed him in the first place!”

I doubt most women reach this conclusion after being battered and I doubt most women provoked the man prior to being hit. Those prone to violence are easily motivated to do so. I never said you were such a man but you appear to overly generalize about women by repeating a story told to you by another man as if to concur with his opinion. Women have the same intellectual capabilities as men so why would an intelligent adult being not want equal say in the determination of their future? By saying “Women just need to learn to obey their men” you are assuming men are always right and that is not the case.

Engage the Exotic - Latin Women
http://International-Introductions.com

[Jeff S]

... in response to Re: Mail-Order Misery, posted by Neil on Jan 31, 2005

Domestic violence isn't a product of the feminist era. It's not caused by strong willed women not following their husband's lead. It has been going on since cave man days. It isn't on the increase lately - at least not in the US, it's just more out in the open. There was a time when women didn't say anything if they were being used as a punching bag. Today, women have more effective support networks, police have been trained to deal with violent situations more effectively, and the general awareness of the problem is greater.

Truth is, according to studies, incidences of violence by women against men is slightly higher than of men against women - so nowadays it's the men who aren't reporting it. What kind of self respecting make would call the police whining that his wife beat him up?

Check this out: http://www.csulb.edu/~mfiebert/assault.htm

- Jeff

[Neil]

... in response to Hate to disagree but...., posted by Jeff S on Jan 31, 2005

Archer, J. (2002).  Sex differences in physically aggressive acts between heterosexual partners: ...Men were more likely than women to strangle, choke, or beat up their partners.

when I used the word "bam"  this was what I meant, strangle, choke or beat up.  

You include "incidences of violence" to be minor aggravating actions like throwing a pillow, tapping with a finger, etc.

This study is consistent with what I was saying.   The women will continue to annoy with provocation, words, and minor aggravations until the man lowers the boom AND REALLY PUNCHES THE WOMAN!  Then the man gets arrested because: 1) he is capable of doing more harm 2) someone has to go.

Men don't whine because the women are just like mosquito bite, they annoy but do not cause severe bodily injury.  Most people have a threshold over which another's harm must past before summoning the police.  Women are just more emotional, less rational and call police because they are angry.  Then later when the women cool down they want to drop charges because they realize, correctly or not, that the problem was caused by their own wrongdoing and emotional overreacting when they should have listened to the husband and obeyed him in the first place!

[Jeff S]

... in response to you define violence differently than mos..., posted by Neil on Jan 31, 2005

Violence is violence. Tapping a finger or throwing a pillow, as you say, aren't - the studies often speak of "pushing, slapping and punching" and those are violence. Agreed that the degree of violence is usually more severe by the man against the woman, but that's to be expected. I'm 6'4" and weigh 275, my wife is 5'3 and weighs 120. But if a woman slaps a man and the man slaps her back, then she punches him in the face and he punches back, who goes to jail and is assumed to be at fault?

I'm also not saying you're wrong that much of this behavious originates by the women badgering the man until he cracks, The several couples I know who verbally fight a lot are almost universally started by the wife nagging, carrying on, and verbally pushing and badgering with lies and insults until the husband finally snaps back - then all hell breaks loose. I do agree with the guys below, there is no excuse by either side to escalate to physical violence, the appropriate response is to walk away, but as those studies show, more often than not the actual violence is initiated by the woman.

Thats one of the nice things about being married to an Asian wife, when you snap back verbally, their natural reaction is to clam up and not talk, rather than escalate the conflict. It defuses the emotion of the situation pretty quickly. The few times we fight, it lasts about 30 seconds and within a half an hour we're all lovey dovey again,m having worked out the differences. She's Japanese, but the guys with Filipino wives report similar behaviour. You have more of a handfull with a pissed off Latina on your hands. At any given time over the past 12 years, I have between 30 and 75 Latinas working for me, so I do experience their conflict resoluton skills on occasion.

- Jeff

[kented]

... in response to Re: you define violence differently than..., posted by Jeff S on Feb 1, 2005

If you are 6'4", 275 lbs, and you hit a 5'3" 120 lbs woman for any reason, you are a coward.  

What you have said that you are able to intimidate your wife into submission.  You are indeed insecure if you need fear to insure domestic tranquility.

[Neil]

... in response to Re: you define violence differently than..., posted by Jeff S on Feb 1, 2005

you're a lucky guy Jeff!  Congrats.

[Brandon2253]

... in response to you define violence differently than mos..., posted by Neil on Jan 31, 2005

Im sorry but I must disagree, no words out of a woman should ever justify physical action by a man.  I dont believe a woman should "follow the husband's lead," I believe a successful and rewarding relationship is built upon compromise, by both parties.

[slojas1]

... in response to Re: you define violence differently than..., posted by Brandon2253 on Feb 1, 2005

I dont believe a woman should "follow the husband's lead,"
I agree with you wholeheartedly on getting physical with a woman. That should never happen!! Period. However, you are expected to take the lead, especially with a latina. I talk to my wife about the decisions that I make and she is included in the thought process of most decisions. However, she does follow my lead and does it very willingly. I listen to her when she voices an opinion and very often I comply with her wishes. But make no mistake, she is looking for me to lead 'our family'. Wish you the best but I think you need to understand that taking the lead does not mean dominating the woman in your life.

[Hoda]

... in response to Re: you define violence differently than..., posted by Brandon2253 on Feb 1, 2005


Once you put your hands on them (in anger)....your ass, is toast! BTW....that "obey" mindset, is also dead & stinking! Both parties in loving relationship, must be willing to compromise in order for love to grow!

[Neil]

... in response to Ditto.....Just walk away!, posted by Hoda on Feb 1, 2005

Both parties in a loving relationship WANT the best for the other person and will place the other persons best above their own.  This is the ultimate abundant marriage.

Any less is not worth having.  BE CAREFUL IN YOUR SEARCHES FOR WOMEN, BROTHERS.  This is what we must look for.  And if we don't feel like sacrificing for the other person, if we are doing it only to feed our ego or pride, it will not last.

ONce you put your hands on her in anger, it is over.  Unless you were extremely stressed out about something else and had displaced anger.  She would have to understand and forgive you for the relationship to have a chance.  

I have a degree in psychology and have studied personalities and counseling psychology.  The Bible has the plan for an abundant life!

[Looking4Wife]

... in response to Now you are closer to getting it right., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005


Neil writes...

"Once you put your hands on her in anger, it is over. Unless you were extremely stressed out about something else and had displaced anger."

Looking4Wife responds...

Perhaps it is not your intention (giving you the benefit of the doubt)... But with your word choice, you seem, once again, to be making excuses for a man's WEAKNESS to commit domestic violence.

The next logical progression in what you're saying is... "I don't know what happened, I just snapped officer, I never meant to knock her unconscious... its just that I've been under a lot of stress lately, and she just wouldn't shut up..."

Whether you are stressed out at the lady, or as you say if "you were extremely stressed out about something else", the INEXCUSABLE result you keep referring to is hitting the woman.  She will hurt the same no matter what your "mental" anger was directed at, because the "physical" result was directed at her.  She could end up at the same emergency room, and the same cops would be called, irrespective of where your "mental" anger was directed.  

Neil writes...

"She would have to understand and forgive you for the relationship to have a chance."

Looking4Wife responds...

How about giving the relationship a BETTER chance by NOT hitting women in the first place?  By being MAN ENOUGH to either exit the situation, exit the relationship, or deal with the real issue, "anger-managment" in the first place?  Now THAT goes a long way toward abundant life...

You seem to be BIG on forgiveness for the "anger-challenged" man, but LOW on tolerance for a woman that doesn't "obey" per your definition.

This philosophy is PRECISELY the kind of thing that the overkill proposed legislation concerning the Foreign Bride industry is trying to address.  To prevent women from becoming punching bags or slaves.

Again, since you mentioned the Bible, I don't remember Jesus striking out at ANYONE in any scenes in the Passion of the Christ... in fact in the opening scene, when Peter cut the man's ear off who was there to take Christ off to his eventual crucifixion, Jesus restored the ear on the spot... surely if anyone was justified in retaliation, it was Jesus...