Mail-Order Misery

[OkieMan]

... in response to I don't hit dogs or women, posted by kented on Feb 2, 2005

Kented,
I absolutely do not justify hitting women.  I think that you have me mixed up with someone else, or you misunderstood what I said.  If someone else on this board justifies that, then that is their problem -- and yes, I am a born again Christian.  I would never want to say or do anything to promote violence or abuse of women!  I can say that with a fair amount of certainty since I have two ex-wifes that I never abused.
                               OkieMan

[kented]

... in response to Re: I don't hit dogs or women, posted by OkieMan on Feb 2, 2005

My comments were directed at Neil's comments implying that the Bible justified man ruling his home with an iron hand.  The comment had been made that if a woman didn't obey the command to "shut-up" she was inviting being hit.  

More murder and meyhem has been committed in the name of religion throughout history than for any other reason.  If you use your religion as a reason to be a better person, to respect others and treat them as you would want them to treat you, if you repsect the fact that others hold different beliefs, then you have a right to be proud of your religion.

[Looking4Wife]

... in response to Re: Submissive and obedient women are no..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005


NEIL Writes...

"I heard a guy at the gym tell me that the reason there is spouse abuse is that offensive women do not obey their husbands when he tells her to "be quiet." She continues to provoke his anger and then he says, "shut up." She then continues to ignore him and provoke him some more until he says, "shut the F... up" She continues to scream at him and point her finger in his face until.... blam! she gets hit. Then the husband goes to jail.

Women just need to learn to obey their men. Things have changed for the worse in US society."

"The Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it. Many of the men who disagree should have their nose in the Bible instead of looking at womens photos on websites and lusting after the flesh. If the man has his nose in the Bible, 99% of the time he will be right and the woman will follow his lead. Domestic violence occurs when neither one knows their rolls in society and in the Bible teachings."

LOOKING4WIFE Responds...

First of all it is interesting that your basis of authority went from the primary "I heard a guy at the gym", to the secondary "The Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it."

The (main) problem is it (kind of) sounded like you were using the Bible to justify domestic violence due to "role confusion".

Rather than condone domestic violence against a wife, the Bible commands men to "love their wives as Christ loved the church and gave (sacrificed) Himself for it".  Yes, the Bible instructs men to be leaders, but it is incumbent on the man to display postive leadership qualities.  Hitting a woman for not "being quiet, shutting up, or shutting the **** up", doesn't fall into that category.

Furthermore, whether a man "has his nose in the Bible" or not, doesn't mean he will be right 99% of the time.  Part of being a good leader is knowing how to tap into the potential of your followers.  As Henry Ford said, "I always want to hire people smarter than me".  If you check out the virtuous woman in Proverbs 31, you will notice that she had amazing skills both in the home, and outside the home, including business and financial skills, and she was a key factor in making her husband great, well known, and well respected.

As they say, behind every good man is a great woman...

[Jamie]

... in response to I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by Looking4Wife on Feb 1, 2005

Well said.

[OkieMan]

... in response to I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by Looking4Wife on Feb 1, 2005

Looking4Wife,
Also some good points.  I do not know if Neil was trying to justify domestic abuse, but I will give hime the benefit of the doubt, and say no.  I certainly do not condone it.  But, I also understand what I think he was trying to say.  The problem that we have in this country with role reversals, etc, has made a lot of us a little crazy!  I never thought that I would have been in 1 divorce, but instead I went through 2!  I have done my best to work on improving myself over the last few years.  Now that I am on this "latina" quest, I am excited about finding that special lady who will love me, but not compete with me.  Needless to say, the feminist movement has messed up everything!  At least now I have (we all have) an alternative! But, the Biblical principles that both of you were discussing are a strong part of my life as well.

                          OkieMan

[kented]

... in response to Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by OkieMan on Feb 1, 2005

Neil said that women deserved to be hit if they didn't shut up.  I don't see how the concept of "benefit of the doubt" applies here.  

What were you divorced twice?  Was is really all the fault of radical feminism that told your wives that they didn't need to obey you and were allowed to have opinions of their own?

[Neil]

... in response to Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by kented on Feb 2, 2005

[This message has been edited by Neil]

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by kented on Feb 2, 2005

No, that is not the case.  However, I do not wish to debate with you the feminist issue.  If you want to believe that way, that is your privelege.  I will go back to what one of my college professors told me 30 years ago.  "Eat the chicken and leave the bones alone".  Basically, that means that I can agree with part of what someone says without having to agree totally.  I use part of what I think is right, and the rest I leave alone.  Maybe you should consider that in this case.  Most of us will not agree about everything, but we have found a common interest or goal; and that is why we are on this board.  So, let's look for the positive.  Some of the other posters may have stirred up a "hornet's nest".  I would rather not be a part of that.  One last thing, and this is not directed just at you.  I have noticed that several posters were commenting about the differences or lack of differences between AW and LW.  It would appear from their take on that subject, that the agencies do put out a lot of "bull" out there on the benefits of having a latin wife, etc. -- and yet, there are many men on this board who have commented about finding this very "special" lady in some Latin American country.  In your case, Costa Rica.  So, maybe the real story is a little bit of both, good and not so good.  Anyway, it's interesting.  Best of luck in your marriage.

                         OkieMan

[kented]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by OkieMan on Feb 2, 2005

I would say that, in least in my case, I got young and pretty but I did not get submissive.  

I might actually prefer the "Leave-it-to Beaver" era but that doesn't exist anywhere, in the US or in LA.

[Neil]

... in response to Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by OkieMan on Feb 1, 2005

[This message has been edited by Neil]

right on brother Okieman.  

I am not trying to justify domestic violence, only explain how it happens.  And this feminismic garbage is to blame in changing women for the worse.

I was happy and comfortable in Leave It to Beaver land.  At least we knew that men sang bass and women sang soprano.  Now the women are trying to sing bass and there is no harmony, just violence.

Remember Sigmund Freud?  He called it penis envy.  Women wishing they could be men.  Role Reversal is to blame.  Like going into the men's bathroom at the airport and seeing a changing table!  IN THE MEN'S BATHROOM!  

What is this world coming to???  The Bible says we are in the last times.

[kented]

... in response to Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005

Relationships are difficult and men, as well as women, have to compromise.  In "leave it to beaver land" women earned lots less than men for the same jobs and had fewer job opportunities.  

So when their man dumped them for a younger prettier woman, their economic circumstances went into the toilet.  Insecure men loved "leave it to beaver land."

[surfscum]

... in response to Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005

So you're saying real men don't change diapers? And then you link that to Christ's return? What are you, nuts? Your dim-witted, clumsy attempts at expressing your thoughts do as much damage to your cause as the feminists. Go read 1 Cor 13 for a true image of love.

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005

I hear you Neil, but I am still curious about how your search is going?  It took me a good while to get the "poison" out of my system, concerning american women (ex-wife,etc).  But, for the last couple of years, I have been working as best as I can on searching for that "special" latina.  Since we are all on this board discussing related issues concerning our search; I am curious about how yours is going?  Basically, we can press on with the latinas, and let the other poor slobs deal with the american women! By the way, Looking4Wife is a good guy too.

                           OkieMan

[Neil]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: I simply HAVE to respond..., posted by OkieMan on Feb 1, 2005

[This message has been edited by Neil]

I am not aware how to send a private message.  If anyone knows, please advise.  

I plan on going to Cali Feb 11-16 and interview several girls myself.  A guy is placing a personal ad in the paper for me and I think it will be more personal than trying an agency.  Also I hope to meet girls that would normally not sign up with an agency.  Some of the agency girls book with all of the agencies in Cali and make a career out of being dined and wined by various men.  Some of the agency girls may have alot of experience with foreign guys and be quite jaded.  I hope to meet some fresh, real ladies this way.

[OkieMan]

... in response to visit to Cali next week, posted by Neil on Feb 1, 2005

Neil,
It sounds like you have some ideas.  Are you fluent in spanish?  I am asking that because I am not; and at this point,I could not really accomplish what you are trying to do without the help of translators.  That is the main reason why I am using an agency.  I am a member of Latin-Internet.  The lady that I am interested in is a member there, but she told me that she has never been a member of any agency before now. (She just joined in January).  So, I wish that I could go now, but I can't.  However, I am trying to get down there to see her as soon as possible.  Latin-Internet is like most agencies, in that they run hot and cold.  They are different in that most of the girls they have there are not also listed with all of the other agencies in town. I was told by the owner that they go by referrals, not running ads in the paper. It seems that the vast majority of the girls with ACG and LE and CaliVip are the same girls.  They are beautiful, but way too young for me (I'm 51).  I am looking for a wife, not a play thing.  At any rate, you are right, most of the time, Latin-Internet does not do much in the way of "parties".  But, the way I did it before was to have the staff set appointments, and do interviews with the ladies I was interested in.  I saw several, was interested in a couple of ladies; thought I had something with one, but that went away when I came back to the States.  That was last year. Win some, lose some. This time, I spotted this particular lady (that I am now interested in) on the website, and wrote her. She answered, and for now,there seems to be alot of chemistry.  I guess time will tell.  But, I can tell you this.  There are several especially attractive ladies with that agency right now.  Many of them are new, some of them have been there a while.  Naturally, it all depends on your taste in women.  But, that's my story in a nutshell.  So, with any luck, I will soon be heading down there to see if I can take my relationship with this special lady to the next level.  After all, I can take correspondence just so far.  Best of luck on your trip.
                               OkieMan