Need help Juggling Women

[elcolombiano]

Since my novia turned out to be a bad apple I have to move forward with my life. I met a women at Latin Best in Dec. 2002. She if very beatiful but on the shy and quiet side. We went out on about eight dates. She even bought me a Parker pen as a gift woth my name ingraved on it and she also invited me to the bull fights. I met her on one date in March 2003 and we had dinner, went dancing and had a great time. We recently started emailing and talking on the phone several times a week. I want to go back to Cali in June to get to know her better. If all goes well I want to start the fiancee paper work. I am very worried that I should not put all my eggs in one basket and should date other women while I am in Cali for 10 days. On the other hand if she knows I am dating other women she will think I am not serious and lose intrest. I just don't want to waste a whole trip on something that may not work out. Also how do I know that this woman does not have a boyfreind in Cali. An attractive you woman is not going to stay home Saturday nights. When we dated she was always available after work to spend time with me.

[denvermike]

... in response to Need help Juggling Women, posted by elcolombiano on May 9, 2003

A classic problem facing guys going to Colombia.  Once again a handful of dates does not make a relationship, it is only a good start. If she came out of an agency she is not likely to be talking, emailing, etc to just you.

You have a limited time in Cali but she is there all the time, she could have several guys on the hook doing the same thing to each. Unless you have local contacts, you will never know. Smarter guys than us have been burned by some sweet smiling face.

One time I went to Cali to see only one lady.  Same kind of deal as you. One day I went to the internet cafe with her, and she showed me her email.  I was a bit stunned when I saw at least 30 or 40 new emails from guys all over the USA and Europe.  Now mostly they are guys playing the internet romance game, not really serious.

By making trips to Cali, you are showing her that you are serious about a relationship that should make an impression on her. Go to Cali with an open, optimistic mind but be realistic if red flags start to show up (like she cancels a date or two), or she doesn't quite seem like the person like she was before, have a backup plan just in case.  

good luck,
mike

[Pete E]

... in response to Re: Need help Juggling Women, posted by denvermike on May 9, 2003

Untill the relationship has gotten to the point of commitment on the part of both persons,neither one should be offended if the other person is keeping their options open and seeing other people,particularly for a guy who is only going to be in town for a short period of time.
Yes,she might get offended you are seeing others.You might get offended she is also.Some guys meet a girl,e-mail and talk on the phone and think she should be waiting for them.
Well she is in Cali full time,but a  guy who may be a serious possibility does not come along all the time and she should not be missing a possibility there over what is still a maybe relationship.
So it works both ways.Both persons should be mature enough
to understand it.But it does get misunderstood,particularly when the famous Colmbiana jealousy factor kicks in.
But,if she thinks you are coming to just see her,at least you should see her first.If the mutual commitment does happen neither  one of you need look further,unless it it changes gain.And,then you need to follow up.You can't just leave her again for months.There needs to be a follow up plan.
My follow up plan was just marry her,you can split if it doesn't work.That way we could be together  right away.Not the best idea.Better to know her better first.Its not so easy or simple to change later, emotionally and entanglement wise as it seems.It is now working for me,but its been a long road.

Pete

[Patrick]

... in response to Re: Need help Juggling Women, posted by denvermike on May 9, 2003

I agree.  Go to see only her, but have a backup plan in case things don't go well.  Rather than trying to set up meetings with the other women ahead of time, wait until you know things aren't working out well and then implement the backup plan by going into an agency to meet others.  If you start meeting other women while you still think things might work out with her, it's possible she can find out and this itself might be a reason that things don't work out.

[markxport]

... in response to Re: Need help Juggling Women, posted by denvermike on May 9, 2003

I think Mike is giving you good solid advice, especially the last paragraph!  Go down, spend time with her.  Try to take your relationship to the next level.  If it doesn't work, I'm sure you can walk into a couple agencies and have dates scheduled within hours.  Good luck!

Take care,

Mark

[Big Wally]

... in response to Need help Juggling Women, posted by elcolombiano on May 9, 2003

This is probably the age-old dilema we have all faced at one time or another..."Is she the one?"

Is there a difinitive answer? Probably not. You probably thought the previous lady was "Miss Right", right? But as you found out, it wasn't meant to be. I don't know your age but if you're under 60 I would say you have plenty of time to find out if this one is indeed "the one".

As far as 'wasting a whole trip on something that may not work out' how will you know until you spend the time? A relationship is like putting money in the stock market. You can't gain anything unless you invest in it. You are probably correct that she will not be pleased to find you running around on her. You really want to make sure she's the right one and if she is it will be worth the effort.

The pen she bought for you makes a big statement. If she is like most girls in Cali she doens't have the money to spend on such extravagant gifts unless she's at least somewhat serious. It also means she wanted you to have something that would wyould keep and would always remind you of her.

As for her staying home on a Saturday night. That can actually be a good thing. It shows that she's not a 'party girl'. Many Colombians are very family oriented. They actually like to spend time with their family. Maybe she is selective about who she dates. Maybe she prefers going out with an escort as opposed to alone or with the girls. Maybe she doesn't have the money to go out clubbing at her own expense.

My wife didn't date for 7 months before I met her because she was broken-hearted about her previous relationship that went bad. If your lady had guys all over her she wouldn't have been a part of an agency (most likely) although my wife did tell me that there were some girls who did have boyfriends and were just looking for some fun or a dinner or shopping. But maybe they are also looking for a better deal. Maybe they are open to a better offer. People all over the world play that game. That's why you have to be careful but if you never get off the bench you'll never know how things might work out. Just be cautious.

Since you asked for comments/advice I would say go see her. Spend the entire trip with her. You should know something in the first few days if it's going well or not. I hate to say be suspicious but you difinitely need to step back from time to time and look at the whole picture. Don't be overwhelmed by her beauty or the 'romance'. Remember, this is your future and hers so study it as an outsider from time to time.

If it doesn't look good after a few days you still have the agency as a backup plan. My first trip to Cali lasted only 4 days but I found the woman I've been married to for 3 years. It can happen.

That reminds me, I have a list of questions that a friend devised for his Thai girlfriend before they got married.

You can pick and choose which questions are important to you. Each of you can answer them. It's a great way to really get to know how each other, how each other thinks and what their thoughts about the future are.

It's way too big for this site but if you or anyone else who is interestd emails me at WALLY3333@EARTHLINK.NET I'll send a copy.

Let us know how it goess and Good Luck.

[DallasSteve2]

... in response to Need help Juggling Women, posted by elcolombiano on May 9, 2003

When I was in Cali last year I met another gringo who was staying at All Colombian Girls.  He had a laptop computer with a database to track the women he was meeting and dating and he was receiving a stream of phone calls from the ones he had already met.  The guy had been there for weeks (he was retired) looking for a wife, and enjoying the process quite a bit.  

He was playing a "juggling act" trying to convince each one that he was sincere about them.  I rememeber he said to me "These women have their BS detectors set to High".  What he meant (I think) was that most of the women in the agencies know that the men are seeing more than one woman, they don't like it, and they don't believe what we are telling them until they pass through Immigration in the US.

Hence, they are probably seeing other men, too.  Do you know who hit on the beautiful women we meet in the agencies?  The handsome men that live in Colombia.  Do you thing the women are going to stay home every night waiting for a gringo who may never pull the trigger when they are getting offers from handsome young, Colombian men to go out dancing?  Don't count on it.

Another story I've told here about another gringo in the same agency:  One day I saw him in an interview with a beautiful, young woman.  After only about 10 minutes I saw them say goodbye.  He came over angry.  He told me he just wasted 10 minutes on an interview with a woman who has a boyfriend.  He was angry that a woman with a boyfriend would be in the agency.

He just met an honest woman and he booted her.  Most of those women are dating men.  Most of them won't tell you.  Many of them have a steady guy.  What are we doing in the agencies?  Dating other women.  What makes us special that we can see other women and they can't see other men?  Now if they are married or engaged to another guy, that's different.  And if they are married or engaged to us, that's different.  Then they should be staying home every night, and us, too.

Steve

[papa suave]

... in response to Chasing El Colombiano, posted by DallasSteve2 on May 9, 2003

That's interesting. A calena agency girl admitting she had a boyfriend? She's got guts, you have to hand it to her. I would respect her honesty but at the same time, if she's running around on her current boyfriend, what's to say that she wouldn't do the exact same to me if we ended up together.

off the subject...

Calenas are funny and very hard to figure out. I had a date with a girl through an agency, we had a great time, etc. The next day I showed up at the agency for a date with another girl, no big deal, that's what you do in an agency. Lo and behold, girl #1 was there on her own date, holding hands with the guy, getting very comfortable. Noi big deal, right? I liked her but I wasn't committng myself to her at that point, I should expect the same from her. My date showed up, we did our getting to know each other for a bit, then went out to dinner. It turned out that girl#1 was extremely jealous and pissed at me for having a date with a different girl. I pointed out to her that she was also getting pretty darn cozy with another gringo. That part did not seem to matter. From my experience, latinas are very, very jealous, understandably so if the womanizing Colombian male stories are true. At the same time, if we as men get jealous, you are machista and grosero. It is a really incredible double standard. I haven't fully accepted the double standard yet, which is probably why I'm still single and looking...

[Cali James]

... in response to Chasing El Colombiano, posted by DallasSteve2 on May 9, 2003


"Another story I've told here about another gringo in the same agency: One day I saw him in an interview with a beautiful, young woman. After only about 10 minutes I saw them say goodbye. He came over angry. He told me he just wasted 10 minutes on an interview with a woman who has a boyfriend. He was angry that a woman with a boyfriend would be in the agency.  He just met an honest woman and he booted her."

I have to disagree with you strongly here as the woman from your story, strikes me as anything but honest.  She has a BOYFRIEND yet she's meeting other men on the side for possible marriage!!  How any one could call this woman honest is beyond me.  When she leaves the agency and meets with her Colombian boyfriend, do you think she says "oh by the way honey, I had a cita with a gringo today at Latin Encounters, the marriage agency". Of course not.  The more likely scenario is you have a woman shopping for a better deal as she's not totally happy in her current relationship.  The honest thing to do,  would be to end her current relationship before pursuing new ones. The guy in the agency was smart to boot the gal, she lacks character IMO and is terrible wife material.

Cali James

[DallasSteve2]

... in response to Re: Chasing El Colombiano, posted by Cali James on May 9, 2003

Good point.  

If she didn't have a steady boyfriend but was honest about going out with other men then she would qualify as honest.  I don't think you'll find many beautiful women in the agencies that stay at home every night waiting for someone to call from the agency.  But some men seem to believe that fantasy.

Steve

[HeyNow]

... in response to Re: Re: Chasing El Colombiano, posted by DallasSteve2 on May 9, 2003

I agree with CaliJames.  If the woman was truly interested in the gringo, do you think she would have mentioned she had a boyfriend?  Nope.  By mentioning she had a boyfriend was just a nice way of saying "I not interested in you".  What was she doing in the agency?  I agree she was looking for something better (unfortunately it wasn't him).

[Onephd]

... in response to Need help Juggling Women, posted by elcolombiano on May 9, 2003


If she is working during the days and you are not sure how things will turn out, why don't you just arrange to meet 2-3 ladies a day during the day.  If you find someone that you like better or if things don't turn out well with the other lady, you can move forward relatively easy with one of the new ladies.  If things do work out well with you and this lady, then you can still move forward.  After all you aren't obligated to go out on dates with the women you meet in the introductions.  

Take your time and get to know her.  I think if she is as mature as she sounds, then she will understand that you have to take your time and get to know her.

[jim c]

... in response to Re: Need help Juggling Women, posted by Onephd on May 9, 2003

I agree. The first time you are there, you should meet as many ladies as you can.  Although I have an advantage by not staying at an agency where I can be located or watched by the secretarys.  There are mixed loyalties in the agencies. Remember you are a gringo that paid money and will leave next week, while many of the girls consider each other friends. Believe me a secretary will rat you out.    
Have the patience or should I say self control, not to fall in love immediately. and commit yourself with the first one that appears to like you. You have a right to meet and date who you wish to but don't commit yourself right away. Be vague. In direct terms KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT. Have lots of lunch dates. Most of the girls are aware of our reputations for professing love ,trying to get laid and never coming back. I think that a Colombiana will not have confidence in  you until you leave and come back for her only. It stands to reason, that when you return you usually only date the one you came to see. One poster said she will not believe in you till she steps off the plane on a K1. Meeting other women after you have dated for a while is unacceptable and understand that Latinas are very jealous. So be careful if you want to keep the one you have. If not,leave her alone and move on. Remember that most of the gringos think they are serious, want to meet the family and friends and then dump her for someeone prettier or younger. A lot of Latinas have been embarrassed by our behavior in Colombia. jim c

[HeyNow]

... in response to Re: Need help Juggling Women, posted by Onephd on May 9, 2003

Sounds like there is a possibility you are not convinced. If you are NOT convinced then forget this woman and move on.  If you ARE convinced then forget the other women and start the visa process.

[cancunhound]

... in response to Re: Re: Need help Juggling Women, posted by HeyNow on May 9, 2003

Absolutely.  If you are concerned about the boyfriend thing - just ask her.  There would be a way to verify that if you were so inclined.  It doesn't sound like ya'll have made any mutual commitment so why would you expect her not to be looking just as you are?  It does sound like you're serious and have already spent substantial time with her - so on your next visit try to arrange for her to take most of those days off work.  I'd recommend that you try to take a "mini-vacation" with her for several nights - that's where you'll really learn about eachother.  See http://www.suntravel.com.co/index.htm for ideas (tip- don't limit your options to the typical "San Andres").