My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Divorce

[JunFan]

I have not posted about it here do to the public nature of this forum while my divorce was pending, for obvious reasons.

I'm sure a large percentage of these marriages do not work out, but most I'm sure do not come back and post about it.  I mainly post on 2G's, but I thought I would post something here since I used to have some good friends here & I was once a frequent poster on this board.

For those who were not around, I went to Cartagena in Sept 2000, after corresponding & talking with a Barranquillera for about 5 months.  I proposed to her on my second trip down there which was about a month after the first trip, and became engaged.  Clearly, this was way too quick, but at the time I rationalized it by saying I had really 'known her' for much longer & better, from phone conversations and daily emails.  She was 23, I was 32.  I didn't think the age difference was unreasonable & I also thought that these girls matured faster than their AW counterparts.  Where I ever got that idea I have no clue.  Looking back my impression is that she thought this whole thing was a fairy tale, or some sort of trip to Disneyland.  She was in love with her dream of marrying a faithful gringo, moving to the US, raising a family (while of course supporting the family in Colombia).  And I guess I lived out a dream too, marrying a Latina bombshell.  But the reality and pain of divorce trumps the euphoria of the hot young babe.

I went back down there two more times before going down to bring her back on the K-1 Visa this past August.  We were married Sept 22. I filed for divorce on Jan 29 and it was finalized a few days ago.  So it lasted a total of 4 months, and she had been here for 6 mos.

I would like to say that my wife had many good qualities, and will likely make someone happy down the road.  She was a very good 'hogarena' (homemaker), keeping the house clean & cooking meals all the time.  And I was most definately not without fault in this either.  We both entered into this thing with the best of intentions.  This is a very high stakes game with very high risks and very brutal consequences.  We threw our hat in the ring, gave it a shot, but came up short.  And the walk back to the locker room is brutal.

I knew that these women are special projects and therefore require alot of patience, time, money, effort, etc.  And I truly feel I gave her a great opportunity up here.  She had ESL classes at the CC, I bought her a car, she got to go home twice to see her family, blah blah blah.  But she basically refused to take root in the culture here, which put her emotional/social needs squarely on me.  And believe me, after awhile, that will wear you down...mentally and physically. And finally, I had to make the call that it was not the way I was gonna be able to live.  Nobody wants to go through a divorce, especially when its with a Latina that we bring to the US, it's very emotional.  But, I was overwhelmed, and my quality of life had deteriorated (and was getting worse) to the point I felt it best to end this thing now, and hopefully avoid more pain and suffering later.  

What went wrong?  Well, I thought I had done my homework.  I obviously didn't it well enough.  I really didn't even have a clue of what I was getting myself into.  I firmly believe that this endeavour will overwhelm a good number of the gringos who decide to follow this path to marriage.  Let's see.  Language is a key issue.  Yes, it is important to speak her language as that will enable you to better make your decisions during the courship.  However, in my opinion, the women's ability to learn English is the cornerstone for success in the adjustment process.  I'm not going to get into alot of details, but my wife did not ever learn English enough to construct basic sentences even after knowing me for 18 mos.  This was one red flag I really missed bad.  It is hard to tell which of these girls are disposed and motivated to learn English and adjust to our culture here.  It is a huge step for them and not all of the Colombianas are cut out for it.  Therefore, I think you must make sure they show you they are progressing in there English before you bring them here.  If they don't progress, no Visa...plain and simple.  Depression, homesickness, etc. will come into play once they become isolated in there little Spanish speaking world.  And in a town like Dallas, she can make it OK without learning English.  But it's just getting by, a person will never truly be able to grow here until they speak our language.

There are some general observations I can make about my situation, which of course is just one data point out there.  I married a woman from the lower class over there.  This is more significant than I had thought.  Hand in hand with that comes educational background.  The lower classes usually don't go to college, and believe me, you want one that is more educated.  

And for those of you who are interested in the mechanics of the divorce, I told her on a Tuesday evening, the divorce agreement was ready on Wed afternoon.  She was on a plane the next morning home to Colombia.  Sounds rough, and it was.  It was better for both of us that she go home.  Thankfully, her intentions were true and she was not looking to stay in the US.  She could have contested it, but I was more than fair with her...and a divorce attorney would not have done anything but rack up fees.  I did not have a prenupt, but would advise everyone to have one, or a LLP put in place.  However, I did keep all my 'seperate property' assets segregated from the 'community property', which is that which is accumulated after the marriage date.  I was completely fair with her, and gave her half of the amount of money I (we) saved after we were married.  It was a good chunk of change, I assure you.  

Anyway, I'm gonna stop here.  There is so much I can say about my experiences it could fill a f#cking book.  Would I ever consider bringing another bride up here?  My inclination is to say no.  The odds are against us in this process from the get go, and the liability cost to the gringo is big time.  I am amazed at how many South Americans live here in US already.  It's just too easy to meet some that are already here, have papers, and living in our society.  One thing I do know is that one red flag is one red flag to many.  

The End,
Mike

www.sparhard.com/colombia.htm

[Edge]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

maybe at some other point in your life you might look south again.  

I remember when you told me awhile back that you were getting a divorce and at first I was a little shocked because I thought things were going well.  I knew that there were some pressures.  But now, I can pretty much understand how it happened.. I felt and still feel bad for you and Beatriz because I think that there was love between you.

Hopefully, you will not be too down on yourself or her and this is one of those hard lessons of life.  You sound pretty good.

I think guys have to look at what they want from a potential latina wife.  What qualities should she have?  An ability to learn English was a priority for you.

Although my wife is learning English, I am not pressing her.  I kind of realized that I cannot have this agenda laid out for her..  We are taking things slowly and working our way through so that we both stay happy in the relationship.  She communicates well with me on the things that bother her so we an address them.  She is not shy about letting me know how she feels, which I appreciate. I still think patience and kindness is the real key in a love relationship.

Anyway, hang in there guy.  Who knows what life holds for you down the road.  I still think that latinas are the best.  I knew after my first relationship with one that I would never look anywhere else.  It was a hard ending with her, the first one..  But I had nothing against her.  So I kept looking and was able to find one that I am really compatible with and we fell in love.  There is a certain amount of luck in all of this because normally, you are not going to have a great amount of time to get to know your potential wife..  That is why you almost have to go a little on what your gut tells you about this other person.

Thanks for posting this Mike because many times people will not discuss what happened and that takes courage..

Good luck..
Edge

[yc]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Hi Mike,

I do not know what to say.  I am very sorry about the outcome your marriage.  It really came as a shock to me.  Since you got married, you have not posted here that often.  I thought things were going great.  I can remember the time right after you married you had to cut a post short... LOL  Remember when she was taking a bath and you was worried she might flood your house... LOL, LOL.  

You, Hounddog and a number of others were here when I first arrived on the scene a little more than a year ago.  You guys posts really helped me to decide on choosing this method.  I took everything to heart.  Thanks for informing us about this unfortunate outcome.  I wish you the best.

This outcome has given me much to think about.  I do not think I am going to turn back now.  I am for the most part turned off by AW.  In addition, I am already corresponding with a Brazilian and a Peruvian females.  Both are showing an intense desire and effort in learning English.  The peruvian female just completed her 3rd month of English classes and understands (reads and writes) it well.  Her pronunciation is not so good.  Hopefully over time that should improve.  The Brazilian female just resently started learning English.  She is showing promise.  I speak neither Portuguese nor Spanish.  I will begin learning both languages very soon.  When I finally meet each ladies we should at least be on the same level.

Mike, for all that it is worth when you decide to get back in the saddle again, I hope you will give it another try in LA... whether it is Colombia or some other LA country.  Like you said, these things probably occur more often than is reported.  If some of the others that have gone through this were more forth coming maybe you could have avoided this outcome altogether.  However it is water under the bridge now.  This can be a learning experience.  I still believe LA is a better hunting ground then here.  Mike all divorces are tragic, but yours is a good one compared to some of the ones I have witnessed.  It was for the most part clean cut.  You have lost none of your assets.   Since the two of you had no children together, no custody battles was involved.  In a sense you were lucky on that end of the spectrum.  The both of you entered into this with good intentions.  The two of you had too many differences.

Take care man,

yc

[Patrick]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Hopefully you can put this behind you and get on with your life soon.  It's sounds like your handling it well.  Best of luck, and thanks for sharing your story with the PL crowd.

[Pete E]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Mike,
Thanks for posting your story.I knew this had happened but didn't know any of the details.We need reports when things don't work as well as when they do to put everything in to perspective.
What really went wrong is a little unclear to me.You mention that she was unwilling to adapt to this culture or learn english and that put a  burden on you to be meet her emotional/social needs.She was too dependent on you?This was difficult to handle?I don't quite understand,but sometimes you can just get a gut feeling that this is never going to work.You seemed to be very sincere going in to this so I will accept that you did what was right for you.
Being a young guy you probably have lots of other choices here.For older guys I still think latinas can be a good option to what we are able to get here.I personally would try it all over again if my marriage did not work.
Guys be warned,most all of these girls will go through a big depression when they come here.Most will learn little english untill they get here.Hopefully they will start a program to learn it here.There are lots of adjustment problems and the relationship better be strong to handle them.I wonder now if my wife hadn't beem able to make some adjustments after the first few months if we would be married.She was pretty unhappy at first untill she found  some latina girl friends.Actually if it had stayed the way it was the first 2 months I'm sure it would have ended within 6 months of so.Thankfully we were able to adapt.
Not only do I love my wife I like her as a person.I just wasn't able to call it off when it was bad.Sometimes things are still difficult.Sometimes I wonder if I made the right decision.
Mike I would just think it wasn't meant to be and move on,which you have.Thats simpler and cleaner when there is not enough mutual desire to keep it together.Sometimes it doesnt work.Sometimes you find the person is too different from what you expected.But the main thing you said that convinced me was that the quality of your life was going downhill fast.Thats not good.It was time to move on.
A couple other general comments.I think a lower class girl will be less inclined to learn english.Many upper class girls,not the ones we usually meet,already know english.Middle class girls may have studied some english.My wife had but didn't really make big progress untill she got here.My 11 year old step son is doing great with it.He talks to himself in english while playing his vidieo games.
Also,unless her family is well to do,you can count on sending money to help them.You kind of marry the whole family.The welfare of her family will be very high on your wifes priorities.
Thanks Mike,and I wish you well.

Pete

[Jeff S]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Were there any difficulties with the divorce proceedings without her here? Did you have her sign papers before she left or?

-- Jeff S.

[JunFan]

... in response to Quick question for you, posted by Jeff S on Apr 6, 2002

I had the agreement drawn up, translated, ready to sign before she was to leave.  That is crucial, you should not let them leave the US without them signing a divorce agreement.  If not, it could drag out for who knows how long, and could create problems that you can't imagine.

Mike

[Hoda]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Hey Mike,

I remember when you shared the news with me sometime ago. You handled one of life's worst situations with class then, & you're handling a bad situation with just as much class now. It's not easy sharing such private & emotional issues with the world to see. Mike you deserve the right woman in your life. Unfortunately, just as there are success, there are failures. Like I told you before, chill for bit, get your bearings back & get back out there.

Peace...Hoda

[Jeff S]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

I, too, have followed your story and was pulling for you. You brought up something that I've been trying to figure out how to post without sounding elitist and snobbish. So many men think they'll find a poor, sweet little country girl and bring her to America to live a life of bliss, only to find out there's far more to it. There are enough adjustments with the cultural and language differences, throw in the transition from lower class, humble third world family and experience to middle class suburban America, and the differences are often enough to overwhelm both parties. Finding an educated person with enough education and worldly awareness to know how to adapt should be of prime importance.

Best of luck to you, Mike. I'm sure you'll  do well at whatever you choose.

- Jeff S.

[JunFan]

... in response to Sorry to hear that Mike, posted by Jeff S on Apr 6, 2002

Everyone that is seriously engaged in this process should read this post over and over.  You really boiled it down into a few sentences.

The facts are is that for all practicle purposes, we can marry just about any type of woman we want down there.  So I think the biggest mistake gringos make is hopping on the first pretty girl that they meet.  I would make sure to take my time, date alot of women, from different social strata, to get an idea of what is 'normal' for these women. No reason why you should not be able to get the total package, looks and brains.

Take your time,
Mike

[DaveyRich1]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Mike
Sorry to hear about your situation I was married on September 2nd in cali I was lucky enough to married to my translator that in my opinion is the most important thing we communicate good which is important she speaks about 65% english She just got a job with Mueller Industries translating their orders from puerto rico and mexico.That is very important she was working at a video store until now she finished 2nd on all the good job interviews.I think the way they progress on learning English will tell you how serious they are about you and about fitting in in the USA
Mike I have one question for you were you married in colombia or USA I have heard bad stories about the expenses of getting a divorce in Colombia? Good luck in whatever you decide to do!
                  My 2 cents,
                          Dave

[Jebster]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

I have followed your story from the beginning, here and on the two G's site. I have seen the highs, the lows and the end.

Thank you for your post which will serve as a sobering dose of reality for all of us about the possible pitfalls of the "latina dream". The truth is many work out and many fail, just like any relationship types between human beings.

Not everyone would have handled this as well as you have. You've shown great class and dignity in telling your story. Thanks for sharing your experience with us and good luck in the future.

[Fingaroll5]

... in response to My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In Div..., posted by JunFan on Apr 5, 2002

Mike I am so sorry to hear about your divorce. You have been a huge help and an inspiration for me.  I have been struggling with my intentions for looking for a Colombian wife. Lets be honest, most of these women just are not going to cut it here in the United States. They will have jobs no better than a cleaning lady. If they are not intelligent and have not shown the aggressiveness it takes to make it in the United States they are just another pretty face. I am strongly rethinking this whole Latin American experience. I think the romance, passion, and having a beautiful woman by your side is great, but at the end of the day when your pockets are empty, and bills are stacking up.....hmmmm she aint so pretty anymore. I will go to Colombia and other Latin American countries for a nice vacation, but the whole bring a wife back thing....I don't know. The majority of the women I have corresponded with have poor families, they want to send money back home. They want to bring family members to the United States. No way will I do that. I do not think they realize what it takes to make it here. Heck that is why the United States is the leader of the free world. We believe in education, hardwork, money, immediate family, and pulling ourselves up by our own bootstraps.  I think the Latinas are too family oriented to where it stunts there growth. They have no experiences to draw on. They have a harder time to adapt. I can not understand for the life of me how a person from a Poor country can come here and not learn the language. That is ridiculous. I believe there work ethic is not up to par. I can understand not knowing how to drive, but eventually you learn. Some of these latinas are just plain DUMB. They don't have a clue and are no better than the airheads here. They get by on looks, and that only works for a little while. No substance. Zilch. Some of these ladies have the personalities of a ROCK. Yeah dancing Salsa is okay, but how many Salsa clubs do we all really go to? NONE. Remember guys we are the ones changing there lives for the better. They must be able to assimilate here. I am not speaking strictly Spanish in my house. Not going to happen. She either learns english or she will never be heard. I think I am off the Find a Latin wife in Colombia kick. I will go to Latin America and have fun, meet some gorgeous babes and that is it. I will date Latinas who already live here in the States. They know exactly how America works, and speak english. Mike I will be talking to you later. Stay strong, and remember plenty of Babes in Texas.....HOWL at the moon. Come on man your single again....TIME TO LET YOUR HAIR DOWN, LET YOUR FANGS SHOW, and GET BACK OUT THERE. Have a great Life.

[Craig]

... in response to Re: My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In..., posted by Fingaroll5 on Apr 6, 2002

Hey buddy do me a favor stay away from Colombia. I can't write my true feeling because my post will never make it on the board due to severe editing from the moderator. Truly stay away. I don't want you screwing up a place I enjoy. It's evident from you post when I read between the lines, you want to get laid in Colombia, and that's it. It's obvious from your writing which is void of any intelligence, why your still single. Try and learn something and contemplate why I think your a dick.

[NW Jim]

... in response to Re: My Marriage To A Colombiana Ended In..., posted by Fingaroll5 on Apr 6, 2002

Fingaroll,
I think you are making generalizations here, however I also think you have raised some important issues that center on differences due economic class. As you state many of the women involved in the MOB scene are lower economic class women. If you were involved with a professional lady from Bogota, you would probably have a different perspective.

As pointed out in a post below, when you're poor an extended family is a form of economic self-help. Without a welfare system these folks have to depend on each other. Also remember you're dealing with a culture in which personal connections are very important. Thus family is very important for survival. If you "make it" you're supposed to help those who helped you.

You and I as middle class Americans also know there is a downside to all this strong family stuff. It chokes off individualism, risk taking, and the push for self improvement. Yet you would also probably admit that too many Americans are blinded by materialism and competition. With the result being high rates of divorce, high rates of drug use and other dysfunctionality.

While many women may be getting by on their looks, let's remember that for poorer women, that is their primary asset. While education is laudable, remember that in countries with high unemployment- Colombia, those with high birth rates-Nicaragua, competition for jobs is fierce.

Even those with education have to use their family connections to get a job. Also remember in these countries there is a strong class consciousness-- you hire for good jobs from your class, not necessarily somebody who is very ambitious and hard working.

While I believe in the importance of education and success, I am attracted to these ladies because I think they bring a balance to the equation. If I wanted a materialistic woman, who thinks raising children is done by daycare, who thinks that success is two BMW's in the garage and annual trips to Europe--I would be looking at Americans or Russian. I want someone who balances me and who places being a wife and mother above career.

I think Mike married a hogarena, when he would have been happier with an educated, more ambitious lady to match his class and lifestyle.

Best of luck to you in your search.