A Trip Report- the Last Page

[donb2222]

[This message has been edited by donb2222]

I feel that I learned more this trip than I did my 4 previous trips.
The most important part was learning more about the culture, and I feel as though I understand my ex-wife more now than before.  I still feel as though I chose the wrong person to be my wife, but at least I now have a better understanding of Filipinas.
I am far from being an expert, you probably need to be a Filipina to be that, but I am learning more each day.

Anyway, on a lighter note, here are some of my observations.

I received much more attention from the ladies in Cebu than I did in any other city that I have been to, but, they still seem to be the most reserved as far as any and all affection in public. Cebu is a very large city, with many tourists, but everywhere I went the ladies were looking.

The ladies in Davao and Tagbilaran seemed much more eager to hold my hand or to be close to me in public, but, in general I did not receive much attention at all while walking alone in public.
It was almost like Manila, or the US, I was almost invisible.
Compare that to the very small villages where the locals will run from their homes just to see the first foreigner to visit in years.

Okay, I have visited Manila, Puerto Princessa, Dumaguete, Bohol, Davao, Angeles City, and Cebu.  And I still say that Cebu has the prettiest ladies in the Philippines.

Many of my penpals expressed fear that they would be rejected because they have low-paying jobs.  Apparently Filipino men seek out the women with better paying jobs.  It took me awhile to explain that most
American men are not going to worry about the job of the Filipina.

It was explained to me that Filipinas almost always control the money in a marriage due to them needing to keep their husband away from his vices.  If the husband has no money, then he cannot afford cigarettes, beer, gambling, other women, etc.  

Filipino time is still rampant.  I never could understand why every Filipino has a watch that is advanced by 15-20 minutes, but most are always late.  My two buddies in Cebu had penpals that were always 30 minutes to 2 hours late.

I did visit Angeles City for two days .  For me, it is a pit of a city, with mostly unattractive women.  I know some guys like it, but it seems best suited to ex-military types that like to drink.
No offense, but it just is not a place that I plan to return to.

Davao is a very nice city that reminds me a lot of Cebu.  It is a little cleaner than Cebu, and it is harder to find a taxi with Air-con, but the two cities are very similar based on my limited time in Davao.

I did meet some penpals that either they or their family were very much into marriage with a foreigner, for all the wrong reasons.
For this, I blame the foreigners.  There are way too many guys out there that feel as though they need to buy a young, attractive wife.
Far too many guys are buying houses and cars for their Filipinas family, and far too many guys are sending way too much money to the Philippines.  Guys should realize that the average salary in the PI is about $1200 a year.  Yet, I continue to hear stories of guys sending hundreds,if not a thousand dollars a month to the Philippines.
That's a years salary every month !, and most of the time the family stops working and starts drinking.  
Come on guys!   Find a woman that loves you for who you are, not one that loves you for how much money you can give.   Some guys are sending huge sums of money to Filipina that they have never even met.
This hurts every guy because the Filipinos start viewing us as walking money machines, and the Filipinos want some of that easy money.  Also, many Filipinos will compare what their neighbor is receiving, and they are not going to be happy unless they receive that also.
Anyway, I'm not saying that anyone here is guilty of being so insecure that they will try to buy a wife.  But, the word needs to get out that this kind of attitude hurts all of us.

Don

[SteveG]

... in response to A Trip Report- the Last Page, posted by donb2222 on Nov 11, 2002

Don,
 Though I haven’t commented yet, I have read and enjoyed the reports from your recent trip.   Thanks for taking the time to do this, as it is very valuable for guys trying to meet Filipinas and entertaining for those of us already married.

  One comment/question I have for you concerns the tendency of so many of the women you met to be less than sincere and materialistic or however you want to describe a woman who is less than sincere about finding a lifelong husband!  LOL

  Since you separated from Vilma so recently, I assume you were only able to write/email the girls you met once or twice before this trip, right?   My point is that you basically got their address and made it known you were likely to visit soon, then went there and met them.    Do you think it would have ‘weeded’ out some of them if you had written for a lengthy period of time in order to get a better feel for their personalities?   I personally feel strongly that a long letter writing period (for the sake of argument, 6 months or more) will reveal a lot of somebody’s personality, sense of right and wrong, tendency to be a ‘taker’ or a ‘giver’, etc.  This is especially true if you engage in normal conversation rather than bombarding her with questions that hint at the answers you want to hear.   People may be able to keep up an act for a while, but over time let little pieces of their true selves leak out.   Anyway, this is just my opinion - I would be interested to hear your views on this.  

  I am always surprised to hear guys tell stories like this one since I had such good luck with the women there – it has always been the men who are trying to con me.   But I guess those unscrupulous guys have daughters, don’t they?     LOL
     
                              SteveG

PS - Sorry to hear about you and Vilma.

[donb2222]

... in response to Don, A Question for you, posted by SteveG on Nov 12, 2002

Hi Steve,
 You are absolutely right.  The more time spent with someone , the more likely you are to discover the positives and negatives about that person.  I actually did meet a few penpals that I thought had a lot of potential, but it is too soon for me to start any new relationship.
 I still think that a guy has a better chance of meeting a good Filipina thru introductions thru friends, or thru meeting them in person.  The internet has gotten way to popular for the people with a the wrong intentions.
Unfortunately, I think things have changed a lot since you met your wife.

Don

[SteveG]

... in response to Re: Don, A Question for you, posted by donb2222 on Nov 12, 2002

Don,
 I can't say from experience of course how much if any the character of Filipinas has changed since 1992-1994 when I was still 'looking'.   I can't help but wonder though if most of the apparent change is artificial due to so many women/guys using email now vs letters just a few years back.  

 Somehow emails seems less personal.  They are typically much shorter and easier to write and send and therefore lend themselves to the less serious women AND men getting involved.   From what guys say, also the younger girls who are just playing around in Internet cafes are representing a large part of the E-mail using women.

 Personally, I would still go with writing letters on paper even today in this Internet world because, dog-gone-it, I wouldn't settle for anything less than a woman who WANTED to be with me.  Taking time to sit down and hand write letters on a consistent basis is a pretty fair demonstration that you are a priority to her.    

 Maybe I seem to obsess on this point, but I can't see going to the Philippines, where women are completely different from AW and then acting the same way we have to with AW, where we crawl around begging for their attention and IF they see us as worthy, they maybe step on us with a spike heel and we are supposed to thank the Lord for the attention!  LOL  I was so tired of that message of female superiority that, I made a promise to myself that I was going to see a clear sign that the woman I married wanted me and wasn't afraid to say so.   You spend your time and resources doing what is important to you.   If you are important to you, she will make time for you, if not - move on.  

 In our case, I know of lots of guys who have been surprised at how many letters Melly wrote me. It is a very large bundle.  Two or three a week for over a year after we got going good.  They say they were lucky to get one letter every month or two when they were engaged or married waiting for the VISA.   I am always polite and just laugh but I am thinking to myself, "I wouldn't have married her if I were you!"   And I am dead serious about that.  

 OK, none of this is aimed at you personally, Don.   I just got carried away with myself!  LOL

                               SteveG

[Dave H]

... in response to Re: Re: Don, A Question for you, posted by SteveG on Nov 13, 2002

Hi Steve,

4 emails and 40+ letters and cards from my wife over the course of a year, in spite of the fact that I usually called twice a week.

Dave H.

[donb2222]

... in response to Re: Re: Don, A Question for you, posted by SteveG on Nov 13, 2002

Hi Steve,
 I think you are absolutely right.  The internet has made it too easy for the people that are less than serious.

Don

[Howard]

... in response to A Trip Report- the Last Page, posted by donb2222 on Nov 11, 2002

Don,

I have really enjoyed your trip report(s) and personal observations. I hope that everything is going smoothly for you in this period of transition.  Seems to me like you're on the road to recovery

Isn't it funny how beneficial hindsight is the next time around?  LOL

Keep the Faith!

H

[donb2222]

... in response to Re: A Trip Report- the Last Page, posted by Howard on Nov 12, 2002

Hi Howard,
 Thanks for the kind words.  Yes, it definitely was a learning experience, and I hope I have learned my lesson well ;0)
Things are working out okay, and every day gets a little better.
I would like more updates on how things are going for you.
I'm sure there are many others that would like to hear how things are progessing for you.

Btw, you might want to update your profile :0)

Take Care,

Don

[Howard]

... in response to Re: Re: A Trip Report- the Last Page, posted by donb2222 on Nov 12, 2002

Don,

Gerlie might have never, ever checked my profile if you didn't bring that to my attention!  No harm, no foul

I updated it, thanks for reminding me.

An update on everything else is forthcoming

Keep th Faith

H

[Ray]

... in response to A Trip Report- the Last Page, posted by donb2222 on Nov 11, 2002

Hi Don,

I enjoyed your reading trip report. Thanks!

About your commentary on men sending too much money. I have noticed that a lot of people really resent it when some guy sends “too much” money to his fiancée or wife in the Phils. Some of these guys may be total fools for squandering their money on some young chick, but who are we to complain. It’s their money, isn’t it? I believe that if a guy works hard for his money, then he has every right to do whatever he wants with it simply because it’s his and not anyone else’s. If a guy wants to buy his wife’s family a new house or send a thousand bucks a month, that’s his right, isn’t it? He may be a “fool”, but at least he’s doing what he feels is right and I have no right to berate him for spending “his” money as he sees fit. Anyway, all those dollars do help the Philippine economy so I guess everyone over there benefits in the long run. If a guy marries a poor Filipina and he is taking home $7,000  or $8,000 a month, then why shouldn’t he care enough to make her life a little more comfortable while she is waiting for her visa? If he sends $500 a month for her and her family, who cares? What’s “too much” for you or I may be peanuts to someone else. I think every guy has a right to be a fool with his own money if he chooses to.

I don’t see why we should feel threatened or think that someone else is ruining it for the rest of us. Do you truly think that a guy who sends “too much” money hurts you personally? It doesn’t hurt me a bit. If a prospective wife is comparing what you send to what her neighbor is getting, and then complaining about it, then perhaps you should look for another woman. If she thinks you are “cheap” because you don’t send as much as some other guys, then I think she is a shallow thinker and motivated too much by material things. There are plenty of good women over there who don’t give a rat’s arse what anyone else is getting and those are the ladies that I would be searching out. Let the others wallow in their own petty jealousy and greed.

Just some thoughts,

Ray

[outwest77]

... in response to Some thoughts on sending "too much&..., posted by Ray on Nov 12, 2002

My personal opinion is , if the girl is just your gf i would never send a dime, period, If she was my fiancee i would send enough to pay her incidental expenses related to the visa etc, and of course the plane ticket .

If i was married i may send money to her family to help
with school etc but that could get expensive with all the cousins i have seen . I may send money 100 a month but i would find it hard to justify putting them on "salary" of any amount. Certainly it would be not more than 100 a month.

[Frank2002]

... in response to Sending any Money, posted by outwest77 on Nov 13, 2002

ddd

[donb2222]

... in response to Some thoughts on sending "too much&..., posted by Ray on Nov 12, 2002

Hi Ray,
 You make some valid points. But, what about the newbies that are not as experienced as you and me, and they meet the Filipinas whose families are pushing the girl to marry a foreigner for their own personal gain?
What about Howard?  (sorry Howard to use you as an example)
He did not know all the warning signs, and he married a woman whose family was more into the marriage than she was.
Or, look at all the hell that Bear went thru because the family of Honey expected money because they had seen what other foreigners had given.
Yes, a guy should always look for the good girls with the good intentions.  But many times when a Filipino family sees what foolish foreigners might give, another daughter is pressured into marrying for the wrong reasons.
The good girl with the good intentions is now being pressured to marry for the wrong reasons, and we all know how much many Filipinas want to please their families.
I really do not understand why you think it is okay to expose more Filipinas to American greed.  One of the things that many men like about Filipinas is that they are more traditional and have simpler lives.  The more money that is used to buy young brides, the more Americanized the Filipinas will be for the worse.
From what I remember, you married an older Filipina from a family that lives a little better than most Filipinos.
Maybe you can't compare your experiences to the guys that marry the Filipinas from the poorer families

Don

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Some thoughts on sending "too m..., posted by donb2222 on Nov 12, 2002

Don,

First, I never said that it’s “okay to expose more Filipinas to American greed”. And yes, my first wife was from a dirt-poor family in the provinces of Iloilo. I don’t condone or encourage guys flaunting their wealth to impress some young immature chick, but I don’t lose any sleep over it either. If I always spent my time worrying about what the other guy was doing, I wouldn’t be where I am today. I was simply questioning why some people (not you) take it so personal when some guy they never met blows all his money foolishly.

Yes, we have all read Howard’s story, but how common is it for a young girl to marry a foreigner simply because her family is pressuring her so that they can gain financially? Maybe someone has been hanging out with a different crowd, because I have not met very many Filipino families who would even think of doing that to their daughters no matter how much of a bind they were in. On the contrary, the Filipino parents that I’ve known are very protective of their daughters and are usually reluctant to give their permission to marry unless they are convinced that the future husband will treat her with the utmost respect and kindness. His financial status is never of primary importance. Personally, I would have nothing to do with a family that would trade their daughter for a monthly income. But those are just my experiences and your mileage may vary.

As far as the inexperienced newbies who might get taken in by some gold-digging family, I’m sure it is going to happen to some. But the average new guy who stops in here is probably in his 40’s, a professional,  and has been married before and raised a family. They aren’t helpless little children and I’m sure that they can think for themselves. Most of these guys are intelligent and should have enough common sense to spot a scam if they take their time and use their big heads. We can warn them of some of the dangers, but for the most part they are on their own when it comes to choosing a mate. If their primary motivation is finding a very young attractive girl to be their wife, then you and I aren’t going to be able to save them from themselves. If they are willing to take the risk, then more power to them, but it’s still their decision and their problem as far as I’m concerned.

If you take your time and choose wisely, using your life experiences and your common sense as a guide, then the odds are that you’ll find a good one. I wouldn’t spend too much time worrying about what those other guys are doing.

I wish you luck in your search for happiness.

Ray

[Frank2002]

... in response to Re: Some thoughts on sending "too m..., posted by donb2222 on Nov 12, 2002

I AGREE WITH YOU DON. I think that if some one in the village marries a foreigner and gets a new house out of it, when the next white guy comes along parents of other daughters in the village are allready picking house plans.
As we have discussed on the phone before, giving to much money is not good. Giving a little to help out every once in a while is great. To much and they won't work and it becomes like wellfare. We all know what happens to people on wellfare right?

Frank