Question about Kherson and Kharkov-

[Buddabelly]

Hi, I'm new here (have been lurking for quite a while) and have a few questions for those who have been to Ukraine a few times.
I have talked to a lot of men about going over to Ukraine but I don't want to go to the Capital Kiev or Odessa. It seems that most men who go to Ukraine go to these two cities from what I can tell. I have heard (whether true or not, I don't know) that Kiev is getting like Moscow and many of the women are becoming very spoiled by foreign guys.
I am wanting to go to a less well travelled ciy. I was thinking about Kherson but then I talked to a guy in my city who had been there and he said it was just a total dump, that the place and all the agencies were completely run by the mafia, the apartments he had stayed in often didn't have power or heat and hot water. He said he would never go back there and couldn't recommend it at all. Kind of discouraging. He said he had never been to Kharkov and that he would suggest trying there.

So- Has anyone here been to Kherson? Do they feel the same way about it as the guy above or different?  If so, could you speak about it and tell me if there are any legitimate agencies there or if you would go back there to look or not?? Can you compare it to any other cities there?

And has anyone here been to Kharkov? Thoughts about it as well...

Thanks
BB

[europete]

... in response to Question about Kherson and Kharkov-, posted by Buddabelly on Oct 31, 2003

I think you would do better if you went to other smaller cities and towns off what is often called "the circuit", i.e., Kiev, Odessa, Dnepropetrovsk, Kherson, Kharkov. The wife hunting activity is well known by many who like to play with foreigners just for fun.
I have heard good words about Krivoy Rog, Mariupol, Donetsk, Vinnitsa, Sumy, and other smaller places as well as Moldava, so if possible maybe those places or others like it might be interesting.
If possible, learn as much of the local language as possible before you go for it will take you a long way and you will not be dependant on someone else for communication with others.
I have lived in Ukraine about 15 months and have different ideas about meeting women there and am not of the opinion that socials with the bigger companies are the way to go. There are some smaller companies that do "social parties", some of them mostly Ukrainian men and all Ukrainian/Russian women. They are different than the bigger companies socials. If I can answer other questions feel free to e-mail me and I will extend what help I am able to.

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Question about Kherson and Kharkov-, posted by Buddabelly on Oct 31, 2003

I agree with what you were told about the women in Kiev (and Odessa, and St. Petersburg and Moscow...)

As for Kherson, it is a dump by our standards... but not too different than many Ukraine cities.

There are several legitimate agencies that operate there.

Drop me a line at my hotmail account of: markjoel60, and I can put you in touch with three agencies I know of that are run by Americans and are the up and up.

Meanwhile, an even better approach is to place a personal ad yourself. Beats buying addresses, and usually results in a much better response.

The organization that I used to place the ad that eventually found my wife (in Kherson, BTW) has changed their URL since I wrote my trip report.

It is now at:

http://www.ukrservice.kiev.ua/

I highly recommend them. Much better than paying some guy $125 to place the ads for you! (Unless you just *like* throwing money away...)

This place charges you $8.00 for an ad with a picture. If you want it with a picture and a border, it will be a whopping $10. (For Kherson). The cost per city varies... but it is really cheap...

Try it.

It worked for me!

[Buddabelly]

... in response to Kherson Agencies, and Personal Ads, posted by MarkInTx on Oct 31, 2003

.

[Jack]

... in response to Question about Kherson and Kharkov-, posted by Buddabelly on Oct 31, 2003

Kherson and Kharkov are both fine cities for bride searching. Each city has it's own beauty, and darkness. Both are a comfortable overnight ($25 first-class) train ride from Kiev.

In Kherson, and Kharkov, as in all Ukraine and Russian cities, you will have frequent power and water outages. While in Kherson, you might want to stay at the Hotel Fregot and you should be fine. Centrally located, cost about $30 a day, you are two minute walk to the river or a five minute walk to Suvarova, the heart of the center. {and it has the cities wildest disco!}  Kherson does have more than it's fair share of scam and suspect agencies. As in anything you do, check each company out, ask for and verify references. Two agencies that I have enjoyed working with and are ok in my book are Kherson Rose and KhersonGirls. Kherson's close location to Nikolaev (1 hour drive) and Odessa (three hours drive) helps make the city, and entire region, a  fairly fertile and productive area.

In Kharkov you will certainly have more ladies to choose from than in Kherson. If staying for 4, 5 days, you may want to stay in one of the hotels in the center. If your stay is closer to week then maybe you want a flat. Good flats in the center will go for $35 to $40 a night. As in Kherson, gossip here is there are a few agencies managed by some local goons, but there are also a handful of good agencies in Kharkov (IDI-Bridge, Bridge to Bride, KharkovGirls). Kharkov has more Universities than any other city in Ukraine. Kharkov has a LOT of young, beautiful girls. For all you guys of 27, 28, 30, you guys will have a field day!!  For old men looking for young girls they will also have a field day!  And yes, there are also a lot of beautiful young ladies from 23 to 35 in Kharkov. Kharkov (and Kherson) has not been hit with the flood of foreigners as has Kiev or Odessa and as such foreign men are still a very interesting, curious item. Kharkov and Kherson are no exception, as in any city, you will have your share of bad girls, women with low morals and scammers.

Buddabelly (what a name!), you can do well by going to either city. Both cities are very affordable. It would not hurt to run a personal ad 6 weeks before your trip and then you could add another 3, 4 ladies to see in each city. Why not go to both cities? There a $25 overnight train ride away.

[Buddabelly]

... in response to Re: Question about Kherson and Kharkov-, posted by Jack on Oct 31, 2003

.

[Jack]

... in response to Thank you for the info and ideas! n/t, posted by Buddabelly on Nov 1, 2003

Nice talking with you and looking forward to working with you Buddabelly.

Do not worry about the negative things Boy Blunder had to say about me in his e-mail to you, he writes the same to many guys. And when these guys show me his comments I simply discuss with them my opinions as to what constitutes a good Russian woman and a bad Russian woman and many of the guys understand why he writes what he does. I am glad you also can see thru his bullschit and feel comfortable with my support and advice. You might also want to correspond with a guy who post here by the name of  LP, he can share some additional information as to what we were discussing.  Boy Blunder and I disagree on many things, especially what constitutes a good Russian woman and a woman with bad, or low morals.  One thing I have started doing Buddabelly is qualifying the type of clients I work with. Any man who does not seek a good Russian woman, any man who is happy with ladies of questionable or low morals is really not the type of client I want. I am glad to hear of the type lady you are seeking, and certainly the type of lady you would never marry, and thus I am comfortable in working with you.

As I mentioned to you it's quite easy to go back into the archives and read where one week Boy Blunder recommends this and the next month he will recommend just the opposite. Can you say psycho?  Most guys who have posted on here for sometime know about his advice, opinions..... and taste.

[MarkInTx]

... in response to (*/*), posted by Jack on Nov 3, 2003

You know Jack,

I don't really care if you decide to showcase your wit and intellect by calling me names like some sort of a fourth grader...

But it would be nice if you would *pretend* to have enough class to leave my wife out of it.

I realize that asking you to behave with class is asking too much... but it would be nice...

[Jack]

... in response to Sometimes, you are such an (*/*), posted by MarkInTx on Nov 4, 2003

Boy Blunder, since receiving the following notice from Patrick,.....

************************************************************
Jack and MarkInTx warning
Post a follow-up Return to Forum FAQ Edit Message
Posted by Patrick on 01/17/2003

The next one of you to reply to the other, or mention the other in any post will be banned for a week.

************************************************************

I have honored Patrick's request and have not replied to you, nor have I mentioned MarkinTex's name since January 16th of this year.

I do have respect for this Russian discussion board and it's owner. Any man involved with the pursuit for a Russian bride today should also be happy, and respectful, of such a fine Russian discussion board as this one when you have many other sites masquerading as Russian discussion boards but are really wolves dressed in sheep's clothing. You have violated Patrick's request at least 30 times before I, and others, stopped counting several months ago. Many guys were happy to see the board move forward by not having to read of yours and mine's vast difference's and opinions of Russian women, the pursuit for Russian women, and each other. I personally have enjoyed knowing that I could read and contribute to the Planet-Love discussion board and knowing I would not be responding to anything you have written to me, or about me. I was hoping that someday you would have stopped mentioning my name in any post as Patrick told us, but your lack of respect of him, and others, you keep right on going, you can't stop. I wish you could elevate me to the level you have with LP and not read any of my post's.

As you have been able to violate Patricks request some 30 plus times, I am going to detour from his request this one time and reply back to you,...

from boy blunder,.....You know Jack,  I don't really care if you decide to showcase your wit and intellect by calling me names like some sort of a fourth grader...

If my referring to you as Boy Blunder looks fourth-gradish, I guess you showcasing your wit to name calling to the extent of,.......

Plausible deniability is definitely his MO.......... I think you got it all wrong. Oscar is not the ventriloquist. He's the dummy. Look for someone else's lips to be moving whenever Oscar (or, apparently yoe) is "talking"......Just because Oscar is paranoid.....Oscar LOL (n) def: predictable response from the board's third most inane poster. Oscar, A Legend in his own mind. Just because Oscar is paranoid it doesn't mean that the board is NOT out to get him....Well, the problem is that there is such a long line of guys on bended knee in front of LP, I would hate to have to wait my turn, you know? The line behind him seems somewhat smaller... just Dan and Oscar there. But -- get this straight -- I wasn't taking a shot at Jack, dear Oscar, I was taking a shot at YOU.......Dan is a wanna be pilot, and as such thinks LP is god....BarryM Dan LP as the old saying goes, "if brains were dynamite the three of them together couldn't blow their nose..." .....Globetrotter, that you are known by the company you keep... so, take a good look at that company. I mean... take a good look, Globetrotter......next Dan... will you want proof that the sun rises in the east? Honest to God I've had more intelligent conversations with my dog...... think he is a chicken, low-life  (lp) The guy has more turns than a snake. He's just a loser who had to settle for an AW because he was unable to make it work with a lady from the FSU. And I beg him for autographed pictures so I could put them on my wall, and stare at them with wonder.....LP is just a mean old man -- not.....Yep, he's an idiot, and only slightly better than a troll. I've said my last about the weenie......He's a blowhard and a jerk, who just wanted to act superior. No one needs him. Anyone can be a crochety idiot.. that doesn't take any talent at all. My initial "shot" at LP was when he posted something about Stan B that I found objectionable. So... this is all my fault, huh? I asked for it? .....You;ll have to forgive LP. He's just a cynical, crochety old man who has searched for a woman abroad and not found one yet, so he's back with the AWs for now. So, naturally, he assumes that the problem MUST be the RWs... Couldn't be him, after all... The board was better off without him when he was "retired." But he didn't stay retired, did he? Nope... and you know why? Because he needs to stroke his own ego. He'll never go away. Insecure people need their egos stroked. I learned the secret to longevity on the board: When you know someone's an idiot... you simply don't read his posts. "Did he ever offer "good advice?" Well many people on here say that he did... so I'll yield that point. I always thought the bad out weighed the good.  "And I hear they hire inferior pilots :-).. Surely the great LP isn't afraid of a woman, is he?.Yeah, I noticed that LP seems to be making a lot of posts for a guy who has told us several times that he was done with us and is leaving!  I see no difference between LP and Claire.......To Barry, Jack may have his faults, but I would never accuse him of being you!.. To Barry Yeah... you're a gentleman and a scholar. Your Local Russian Orthodox Church must be so proud... Barry, Only you and your pals get bitter and apoplectic...I thought you were a reasonable guy. I was wrong...(dan)  Dan Congrats, That "Word a Day" calender you bought must be paying big dividends for you! ... Is it possible for you to work the word Condescending into any more posts?... To Dan,...I won't bother commenting on your pathetic attempts. You are part of the Bragg Brigade... you can't help yourself..."I'm glad to know that I inspire you... "Dan, It is impossible for me to have "my feelings hurt" by anything you say, because I have no respect for you at all. You continue to show a complete lack of: * Honor * Class * Wit...My feelings are SO hurt by your elementary school wit.
Dan, "You, however, are a fraud. ... "It seems that the care you take begins and ends in bed.... Feet wet? Shucks, JR... I thought you were wet up to your elbows by now....
You may VERY well have a LOT of men who enjoy working with you. The Anna Nicole show was a big hit on E!, too. So, anything is possible, and there is no accounting for taste. ...  Jack ISN'T right about almost anything.
....Apparently, you are just too stupid to see it, so I give up.... I'll bet you sit on the toilet every morning saying "Hey, it's true, my sh!t doesn't stink!" ...As for where you are... yeah.. I'm sure you're in absolute bliss. Probably have beautiful babes falling all over you. When I need your help "calling me on it" and helping me sort through my personal life, I will take a vow of celibacy and join a monastery instead. Funny how when anyone holds a belief contrary to yours, then their reasons become rationalization. I find it impossible to believe that you got all of the way through Med school without learning how to do a little research...Scams almost always happen to stupid or desperate men....Why don't YOU post one single solitary thing that is in the least bit informative... and then you can criticize someone else for their posts.....If you wanna contribute fine. If not... shut the hell up.

I won't get into stupid name-calling, school-yard fighting, and inane bantering... I promise! Posted by MarkInTx on 10/15/2002

...makes your behavior boy blunder that of a first-grader!

As to your remarks as to me leaving your wife out of this what the he!l are you talking about? I have never mentioned your wife, never meet your wife, never seen your wife and do not even know her name!  I challenge you to show me where I have mentioned your wife! I do not know what you are talking about. I do know we have a major disagreement as to what you and I consider a difference of morals in men and ladies but that does not mean that I am singling out in one lady who I consider a good Russian woman or any one woman I consider as a bad Russian woman, but all good and bad Russian ladies as a whole. I just know you and I have a big difference of opinions here. As far as I know she is one of the millions of good Russian women and not one of the bad Russian women. Only you know this.

And although your so wishy-washy as what you said yesterday, and what you will say tomorrow, in your over 2400 post's you have made on the Planet-Love board, you have actually made some half dozen post's or so I agree with. I agree with so little of what you say when I do see something you say that I agree with, I try to remember it, little doubt if we both agree on something you could put it in stone.

In closing, and I hope not to have to write you again and going back to not responding to any of your post's written to me, or about me (but I seriously doubt you have the class, but it would be nice), I will leave you with a few of the post's of yours I do agree with.

12-05-01 In other words... use the three months to really decide if you BOTH will be happy here, together.

(about WOVO) For every guy who can say like you did that they wrote just one lady and went over and found love, I can find ten who will tell you that it didn't work for them.

You will find those -- like Jack -- who searched for years, and who have reduced the whole process to a series of steps that makes it almost like a science. Best advice for someone who is doing this the first time is:  Look at everything you have read about Jack. Even the bad stuff. Has anyone ever said that he didn't deliver the services he said he would? No. ...Maybe its just me... but for the first time there, I would HIGHLY suggest that you hook up with a professional... contact Jack....I cannot imagine what my last trip to Russia would have been like without Jack's help...

Once my lady gets here, I'm gone. But, my fiance is computer savvy. And the last thing I would want is for her to read this site!

11-23 -01 I know there has been much discussion on whether you should expect sex when going to visit your FSU girlfriend. I would say that A) a true gentleman never expects sex – no matter what continent he is on.

5-25-02  You can phrase it a lot of different ways... but how can you want a wife (or husband) without Morals  

[MarkInTx]

... in response to the (*/*), boy blunder., posted by Jack on Nov 4, 2003

A loud of sound and fury signifying nothing...

[LP]

... in response to (*/*), posted by Jack on Nov 3, 2003

[This message has been edited by LP]

...nah, on second thought I'll just get my pee-pee whacked for posting  about my little adventure on here. It's really no one's business what goes on between me, my guests and other guys. If they want to behave like that than more power to 'em. However, it sure makes them look bad in my opinion. One told me they're dealing with older guys because of their assets, young A/M are easier to milk but have much less to spend on them. Nice huh?

As for the PansyMan in TX, it's all water under the bridge for me. I dunno about low morals, I blew her off before I could find out. Beauty is in the eye, after all. Yeah, I realize you and a few others know the real story but that won't stop him from believing what he wants. It's called denial. He's happy so who cares? Look on the bright side: They're a good match and both are out of circulation.

Don't worry about class Jack, you show plenty in your actions and thats as it should be. Words don't mean squat. Somebody else's squeeze means nothing because they're just that: somebody else's. Where as a general rule does it say women deserve more respect than men anyway? Thats the problem, too many guys put them on pedestals, shows how codependent they really are. Our pal can't even see he might be a tad biased.

I'll say one other thing too: He's full of it when he says guys should avoid the larger cities because of the "bad" quality of the women. They're too westernized? That more than anything else reveals spades about him and his motivation. And thats based on what? One trip to Ukraine before he met his wonder girl? What an authority on the matter. The truth is Kiev and Moscow are full of fine women if one isn't threatened by their intelligence and sophistication. Who wants some backwoods Ellie May Clampett type with half a brain? Oops, I forgot...

[Buddabelly]

... in response to (*/*), posted by Jack on Nov 3, 2003

I don't want to start any trouble here, just trying to check out facts and get the best advice I can.  I can see there has been some bad blood between you two and I would like to stay out of it.  Everyone has their own opinions and what does or doesn't work for them, I just have to find what will work best for me.  I appreciate all the advice I can get and keep from it what may work for me.

Markintex actually said that if a guy is going to meet many women as opposed to just one, that you would be a guy who could help them.  He just seems to not subscribe to that idea of meeting a lot of girls, but rather just one at a time.  I know some guys do feel that way and others feel you need to meet more women.  I know I personally cannot feel comfortable going all that way to meet just one girl.  I just feel like what would I have to compare her to, the way they think and react and such if I didn't meet at least a few?  But that's me.  He also gave me some links to agencies in Kherson.

Peace,
BB

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Wow-, posted by Buddabelly on Nov 3, 2003

Yes, BB, you are right about what I said in my email.

And, no problem here. You are right... everyone has their own opinion on these matters.

Good luck to you.

[exlabman]

... in response to Question about Kherson and Kharkov-, posted by Buddabelly on Oct 31, 2003

I would suggest you contact Jack Bragg at www.firstdream.com. Jack will help you work up a plan of action. I agree the smaller towns have more down to earth women. My suggestion would be for you to go to Dnipropetrovsk and then let the women from the many small town around come in to meet you. Jack can put some ads in the local papers for you and you can write some of the ladies that respond to get started. Jack is a great guy with a wonderful staff in Ukraine...you will be well taken care of and get good guidence. You are in for an experience of a lifetime. Enjoy.

Larry
Atlanta
1st NOA 5/23/03 TSC
2nd NOA 9/29/03
NVC 10/2 and still waiting

[Jack]

... in response to Re: Smaller towns, posted by exlabman on Oct 31, 2003

Thanks for the kind words Larry. Help a guy find a good wife, he's a happy camper.