UW's who leave children at home

[chuck12]

Hi Guys -

Thanks for all the replies, I had written a thread (see below) about a UW with whom I've been corresponding with and what problems might entail if it gets to the point she comes back to the U.S. with me. I know I'm taking a big jump in the timeline here, but better to understand this now then be reactive down the road if things do work out.

I want to clarify a few things, this is as much as I know. I am writing her through a very legit agency and have spoken with her. She is very pleasant and upbeat. I had asked inquired to her children coming over to the U.S (they are both under 10) and she did not want to go into all the details (she is using an interpreter). But said her ex is "holding her children hostage". Not sure what that exactly implies. I don't think there are any legal restrictions which would prevent her from bring them back, and its not that she wouldn't. She is very close to her kids, she talks about them all the time, I have a number of photos of both. I think you can tell by a pic, and her kids really look great and well behaved.

Her children also adore their father and the dad cherishes the kids, so with this alone, it might be difficult to bring them, I would not want to rip the kids away from their dad w/o his approval. She did tell me, that if things were better between her and her ex, she would not even be looking abroad, but things apparently have gotten to the point where she can not stand it anymore, he wants her back but she wants nothing more to do with him, I guess he is making her life unbearable, that is the conclusion I am coming too.

As to the obvious, I know how tight UW and RW families are. I know this would be a monumental effort on her part, since she is close to her kids. I have tried to talk about why the children must remain, but she avoids this and only wishes to discuss this when we meet. I'm not the type of person to ignore a problem hoping it will disappear, in this case I think it is better to confront this in the open even if it is uncomfortable for her to talk about. Any comments would appreciated.

[Cold Warrior]

... in response to UW's who leave children at home, posted by chuck12 on Mar 12, 2003

I see nothing wrong with a Dad having custody of the kids, more and more dads in the US are doing this. Let the kids decide, but I'm sure they will love to have both parent nearby.

[Globetrotter]

... in response to UW's who leave children at home, posted by chuck12 on Mar 12, 2003

You know, for all the problems marriages have when everything is perfect, ie, marry the childhood sweetheart who lived next door, I think any wild obstacles thrown in is a recipe for disaster.

In my situation I think I've done most things right...maybe
as we've met several times, write almost every day, known each other for 2 years, age police can't fault us, language skills and communication are great, she opens up her heart and we discuss everything, and everything seems very well.  Different than others, all my business is overseas, I can go anywhere, anytime, money isn't a problem, and I own the store.  Still, I'm not comfortable with the idea.  Reason...throw in all the changes necessary from cultural, language, lonliness, etc., etc., etc.,and how well equipped I am to be counselor, mentor, teacher, father, and I take a step back.  I think when the Disneyland scenario wears off after a few months, the real work and reality sets in.  She
may be incredibly happy...maybe not.  My lawyer says there is not much risk...financially.  Still, I cringe.  Why?  My sister lives in Paris, is an artist, married to a French PhD
who is a magnificent fellow, has a perfect family (little boy and girl, both bi-lingual)was fluent in the language 10 years ago, loves France, is a dual national, and married 5 years.  (Sounds like it doesn't get much better)  She was unhappy as she didn't have her family and friends nearby and didn't make enough French friends to make up for her loss.  She has plenty of money to come home any time she likes and does many times per year.  She is not a spoiled feminist, and a great sister with her head on straight, didn't move to a country or culture she was unfamiliar with, and she gave her husband fits.  This is only one example of what can go wrong if everything seems perfect.  They even had marriage ceremonies there and here, and we hosted several of his French relatives at our houses.  

Actually, I'm about to call it off and bail.  And, I'm a very positive person, but at the same time realistic.  

Please save the criticism for those of you who have succeeded, or think you have.  You just have bigger
"stugats" than me, or haven't taken off the rose colored glasses yet.

Advice for you.............I have none, except, "Look at the way things really are, as opposed to the way you would like them to be."

Best of luck to all.

[thesearch]

... in response to Re: UW's who leave children at home, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 12, 2003

Hey Globe,

My take is your post has some information - just enough for people to come up with all kinds of possible conclusions that may or may not have anything to do with reality. Isn't that typical?

In an ideal world it would have been nice if you had figured out you were not ready for marriage before you started this whole process with a woman from the FSU. Certainly would have been better if you had not taken two years to understand yourself and even now you are not still sitting on the fence threatening to jump ship but you haven't - not yet.

But then again, maybe it is not important at all and the timing has been perfect. Perhaps the lady you have been involved with for this past two years was not seeing you because of marriage interests at all on her part. Maybe she just was only interested in trips in exchange for sex or maybe you two never had sex. Maybe she was actively pursuing other men this whole time and thus loosing you would not create any problems or delays and all simply had a great time.

However, if this lady is like most, only participating because of genuine interests in getting married and in addition if she has focused on you for the past two years well, your lack of finding yourself in all of this has taken two years of her life. A major window of opportunity may have passed for her because of her focus on you or, maybe the delay actually saved her from a guy that would have made her life miserable. Everything until it happens is merely speculation.

I think the bottom line is that if you are not interested in marriage, you could be hurting someone out there by being really in the final analysis an unwilling participant. Again, Globe, you are the only one who knows all the facts, the only thing is that you have been slow at knowing yourself, your needs, your fears and how they would ultimately impact you and any lady you have been courting. What has happened to you has happened to many well intentioned people, it is just life. Good luck to you.

[Globetrotter]

... in response to Hey Globe, posted by thesearch on Mar 14, 2003

Thanks for your comments.  You're right, it's not a perfect world, and anything is possible!

[thesearch]

... in response to Re: Hey Globe, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 14, 2003

Globe,  keep posting as I for one would like to know what you end up doing -- again good luck to you

[Scaught]

... in response to Re: UW's who leave children at home, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 12, 2003

is doing the right thing. He knows that after two years with multiple trips to see her if this girl in this situation is right for him or not. Most of us are a bunch of romantics and hate to see a break up without a serious affront having been committed. However, GT has thought it through. There is no doubt that almost any other kind of relationship makes much more sense than dating an FSU woman. My situation seems to be unfolding differently. I have known my girlfriend for over two years, have visited her four times, been all over Europe and Africa together. I had huge doubts and mega suspicions at first, at second and third. I hung in there and found that I was projecting a lot of the crap that was routinely slung on this website once upon a time: the "they're all scammers" cry. We have grown so close together and I hope she'll be here later in the year (paperwork pending).

Of course, I am concerned about what she will do here. She is very concerned, too. She likes to study, so she will enroll in the school here. That will give her something to do. And I have a lot of woman friends (colleagues) who would like to meet her. We both like to travel and enjoy cultural experiences. There is always something to do. But the most important thing is how she and I get along here with each other, day-to-day. That's what it's all about. If our attachment grows, we plan to have children (neither of us has children). All I know is now we both feel ready for this. I have my insecurities at time, like everyone does, including her, but I don't have any doubts that she is an amazing woman and I want her influence on my life in a daily basis, and we are totally going for it.

[SteveG]

... in response to Re: UW's who leave children at home, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 12, 2003

Globetrotter,
 I know nothing about UW but do know about what you are experiencing due to my wife being from the Philippines.  Having said that, my advice is simple.   Imagine that from this instant on, you will never have contact with this lady again for the rest of your life - period.   You will never even know if she is dead or alive.   Can you live with that?  If the answer is "No' then I would give some serious thought before ending what you have together.
                                      SteveG

[micha1]

... in response to I have a short bit of simple advice, posted by SteveG on Mar 13, 2003

SteveG, you are a wonderful human being.
Caring for others.
You may have your ups and downs,
but in the end you must be a happy camper.

[SteveG]

... in response to Re: I have a short bit of simple advice, posted by micha1 on Mar 13, 2003

Micha1,
 Thanks for the compliments but I'm not sure I am so wonderful.     I was just trying to get him to think in extremes to measure how important she is before ending it based on nothing more concrete than what might go wrong.  He should be VERY sure that he isn't going to regret this in 10 years when he starts to think of how good it might have been.
               SteveG

[Globetrotter]

... in response to I have a short bit of simple advice, posted by SteveG on Mar 13, 2003

If we were to have no contact and she wanted it that way, then so be it.  However that has not been my experience from others in the FSU I have known.  Ask LP who probably has the most "old friends" who he keeps in contact with.

[SteveG]

... in response to could happen............, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 13, 2003

GlobeTrotter,
 In a way, I think you are saying you aren't very sure you could live without her, right?  I mean, you are more or less implying that she will stay in contact with you and be your friend.   At least it looks to me like you want that.  Well, if there is that much of a bond between the two of you and you can't point to anything concrete that is wrong, then why are you in such doubt?   Hey, I'm not nitpicking you, just trying to keep you from making a big mistake due to being overly cautious for no apparent reason.
          Good Luck,
          SteveG

[Globetrotter]

... in response to Re: could happen............, posted by SteveG on Mar 14, 2003

Thanks for your thoughts.  My concerns are as I stated in several posts, and for me they are very apparent reasons.
My contacts with 2 others I have known contact me to ask how westerners think, and tell me how and what they are doing, and who they're engaged to and from where.  One, who is engaged even wanted to shack up in Spain...so I'm glad I saw through her early on.  (What a lucky fellow who gets her!)  I would always respond to a friend and help in most any way.  If one were to choose not to stay in touch, I'm OK with that.

It took a while for me to realize just how much work and sacrifice was involved in marrying one of these girls, and with a child is another life you become responsible for.

So you can say I'm cautious, also realistic.  By the way, I do care for her very much.  We'll see where it goes.  

[lswote]

... in response to Re: UW's who leave children at home, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 12, 2003

Somehow you moved from giving advice to Chuck to describing your situation which you feel you are about to bail from.  Only thing is I don't understand what is wrong with your situtation of 2 years other than you have a case of the "could happens".  What am I missing here?

[DanM]

... in response to Re: UW's who leave children at home, posted by Globetrotter on Mar 12, 2003

I am not here to judge you. I am not here to tell you that you are right or wrong. I just want to give you a little saying that has helped me many times. One time someone told me "We can either see the good in a situation or the bad in a situation. Its up to us because both are usually there."

I am not telling you this to convince you to be with this girl. I don't care how wonderful you are or how wonderful she is. The fact remains that if you are looking so hard to find a reason it may not work out, then you probably are not ready for the relationship and have no business dragging her or you through the drama. Instead of being critical of you, I commend you for not proposing to her. When you are really ready for a relationship, you will spend more time looking for ways to succeed than ways to fail. Just remember risk of failure is always present in any relationship. When the risk seems worth it, the doubts will not stop you.

Best of luck.