not to start trouble...bout sex...

[Frank O]

I was reading a post below which ended in a heated discussion about the discussion of sex in this board. Now I don't mean sex in terms of bragging as to your conquests etc but in terms on how it comes into play in our situations. I had a lot of questions about the subject but was afraid to ask due to the nature & how it can be taken out of content. For example my comments about my lady being a model twisted into her being a prostitute. Or my comments about my growing up in South Texas & the Red Light District aspect of that. Even Clayton Williams didn't get in trouble for admitting that was part of Texas culture. Anyways I have spoken to several guys via e mail or on the phone who have been there. Naturally I asked if there had been any intimacy. My reason for asking is I don't know how Ukrainian or Russian women perceive this. I know in Mexico from my experience (not IN the Red light!) sex while dating is very much like in the US. That does not mean I have dated loose women (those I don't date I just "did" them) but it happens when there is that "spark". I also read a post about someone who got it going within 20 minutes with his lady. Nothing wrong with that. But what I'm getting at is I have gotten the distinct feeling that many men don't get very far in this aspect. My lady had stated that was because most men were not very attractive & were in their 40s or 50's & wanted younger girls that looked like models. HOWEVER after reading the profiles most of you hear are varied in age with MANY in the 30's as I who am 34. I guess my concern is if your traveling around the world to meet someone & expect something special doesn't making love to that person come into play?  I know 1 guy who is a good friend of mine who has made 3 trips to see the same girl every time & has NOT made love to her. Their relationship is almost over now. I hate to sound bad but I think if I DON'T receieve that I would perceive my chances for somthing long term as pretty much dead. Man I don't know if I'm making sense but it's hard to try to write it without having someone take something out of context. I guess someone is going to respond by saying I'm traveling around the world to try to get laid. I'm not. I'm searching for a wife & partner for life but am curious as to other persons experiences in terms of this. Not details just experiences. I mean what is the RW culture dicate in terms of coursthip in this facet of a relationship? What about birth control or lack thereof? STD's? I know there are VERY many single women or unwed mothers so I know they're "getting it on" but how does that apply to us AM while courting them? Once again if someone is just going to get bent out of shap just don't respond. And PLEASE don't put words in my mouth or put down my lady.

[Frank O]

... in response to not to start trouble...bout sex..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

some kind of contraceptive that is a shot? That is it is injected like ever month or couple of months? I had a Mexican girlfriend who took this form. It's VERY widely used in MExico. I don't know the exact deal on it, for example how long before it takes effect etc but I wonder if this is available in Ukraine/Russia.

[Pordzhik]

... in response to anyone ever heard of..., posted by Frank O on Oct 14, 2002

Came across this one over 20 years ago in Germany, been around 2-3 years here in the UK and has just started to be used in Ukraine. It has the added bonus that she don't have the decorators in every month.

I might have some info about this around somewhere, If I can find it I'll scan it and Email or post you later.

[Dan]

... in response to anyone ever heard of..., posted by Frank O on Oct 14, 2002

in Ukraine.

The ?? is the cost - and drugs/medications imported from other countries (outside of the FSU countries) are almost always cost-prohibitive.

- Dan

[Pordzhik]

... in response to not to start trouble...bout sex..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

To add to everything else that has been said below, a word of warning here; Even if your lady is in possession of oral contraceptives, don't imagine that she has any idea how to use them correctly, these are expensive items for these ladies, few of them will have a complete knowledge of their use, plus the instructions are often only in English or German.

I was very suprised to find (and my fiance shocked) that I had more knowledge about these things than her and all of her girlfriends put together.

[Frank O]

... in response to Oral Conraceptives, posted by Pordzhik on Oct 14, 2002

nt

[juio99]

... in response to not to start trouble...bout sex..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

First, I fully realize that I am not allowed to say what others can say.  But, second, I will say it anyway.

I will make some statements relative to what LP and KenC and others have stated.

The FSU women are as varied as women in the USA.  Most were interested in pleasing the man, but that is also true for USA women.  There were some in FSU who were really focused just on themselves, and that is true for USA.  Some are very knowledgeable about methods and procedures to ensure that both parties enjoy the acts, and some seem completely dumb about the issue.  There seems to be no way of predicting this either.  One lady was a physician (age 45)and she knew practically nothing.  When I brought up the issue (her being a physician), she said why should I think she would know anything.  I told her in USA many always advise people to talk to their physician.  She said maybe the younger physicians get training on this issue in FSU, but that she didn't.

It has been commented that some women may have sex thinking they should somehow 'payback' the guy for coming halfway around the world.  This seems to ignore the fact that women enjoy sex just as much as men.  True, they do not necessarily have the initial sex drive that we do, but during the romantic process, they become just as anxious to have sex as we men do.  And at that point, they can become very demanding.

On my recent trip, I was in two situations (if you think I am bragging, just kiss off), where I wasn't particularly looking for sex because of very recent encounters.  But I was still involved in make out on couch.  Right out of the blue, one lady on our very first date said, "don't you have a bed that we would be more confortable in."  With another lady, on second date, I offered her my 'hand' and she said, "I want the real thing, and I want it now."

I agree with Oscar in that oral seems to be the complete standard there, and no fussing around about getting to it as is often the case with USA women.

Another interesting thing is about the womans sex appetite and how early they have sex with you.  One lady waited until 4th date, but then she told me she wanted to have sex every day and multiple times each day.  Others had sex on first date, but said that would be enough for the week.

All in all, there really isn't that much difference from USA, except for one major aspect.  That is, that no where in USA could I experience a situation where I could line up 12 ladies for 12 consecutive days and have 20 or more backups.

And for those who think this is all unfair to the ladies, grow up.  Many that I met with were looking for nothing more than a good time on the town and some romantic moments.  Why they choose to do it with AM and not just stick witht the homegrown types, we could debate that forever.

JR

[Frank O]

... in response to Re: not to start trouble...bout sex..., posted by juio99 on Oct 13, 2002

Interesting, I guess everyone input pretty answered most of my questions. Oh well I've got 24 days to go. Thanks for the input.

[Frank O]

... in response to not to start trouble...bout sex..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

while on this subject birth control obviously comes up. I remember one lady I was writing (no longer writing her) she mentioned about making love etc. Anyways I was a little worried because the attitude was brace yourself when you come here. Anyways I asked her about birth control obviously I dont want anyone coming out pregnant unless I'm committed to her for life (married). She wrote me back & said I don't understand what you mean, what is birth controL? Man that freaked me out. I assumed they probably don't talk about. I know in Mexico they either take REALLY good care of themselves or they don't. There is not much in between. What is the most common form of birth control in Russia/Ukraine apart from condoms of course?

[juio99]

... in response to bout birth control..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

Regarding this topic, the women in FSU and USA do seem to be very different.  I have never once had a USA gal tell me not to use condom, but I have had several FSU women complain to me about using a condom (they don't want me to).  And they aren't wanting to get pregnant.  They say the feeling isn't as good for them as without condom.  I told one that was stupid because I was the one wearing it and should be complaining if anyone.  But she told me to think of the difference if she brushed her bare finger on my arm versus using a gloved finger.  She said, don't you think you could tell the difference?

But, while it is all true, about the feeling, it is still completely illogical for them to want to go 'condomless' in view of all the potential problems.  They some how seem not to worry about it as they should.

True, the AIDS thing is accelerating there, but from what I have read it is still mostly confined to those who are involved with drugs or with drug users.  But of course, it only takes one person to get involved with such, then pass it on to several others, who pass it on to several others, ad infitum.

JR

[Philb]

... in response to bout birth control..., posted by Frank O on Oct 12, 2002

The FSU has some of the highest per capita abortion rates in the world.

[Stevo]

... in response to Worth mentioning, posted by Philb on Oct 12, 2002

one abortion, if not more.  This is very common knowledge.  Any RW will tell you so...if you have her trust.

Stevo

[Dan]

... in response to Very true...probably every sexually acti..., posted by Stevo on Oct 13, 2002

n/t

[WmGo]

... in response to Then It *Must* Be So   n/t, posted by Dan on Oct 13, 2002

Dan,

I don't know why this seems to be a sore subject with you, but all you have to do is research the matter (I have) and you will see that the most common form of birth control in the FSU is abortion. There are many studies on the rates of abortion for just about every country on the planet, including Russia and Ukraine. By age 30 *most* women there have had several abortions. For a women to have none by that age is uncommon. For a woman to have had many (more than just a few) is also not uncommon. This is an unfortunate reality of life there -  and I don't mean to sound as if I am excusing them because I excuse no abortion anywhere.

Best regards.

WmGO

[JohnL]

... in response to Re: Then It *Must* Be So   n/t, posted by WmGo on Oct 13, 2002

N/T