collective wisdom solicitation

[rwnovice]

I am planning my first trip to UA and need some advice.  Here's the deal.  I've been talking to a couple of girls in Lugansk (not currently on any of the antiscammer sites I've seen) and want to go visit.  One I'm a good bit more interested in than the other.  I'm also emailing one in Donetsk and may go there from Lugansk.  Having been on blind dates in US, I know how reality can hit when you actually meet someone.  How do you all feel about making the trip to meet only 2 or 3 girls?  What about only 1?  Should I have a backup plan with an agency?  I've been searching agencies and have found a few interesting girls in Kherson (of course not all in one agency).  I could fly into Odesa, go to Kherson for a couple of days, and then go on to Lugansk (if they even have transportation between those 2 points).  But I'm really only interested in the one Lugansk girl, and I'm thinking Lugansk is so far out of the way that on my first trip I'll only have time to go there.  Without her, I don't know if I'd be making this trip.  Or am I too naive?  I need the benefit of your experience.  What path do you recommend?

[johnnydudeman]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

yeah, its kind of naive to go to lugansk just to see one girl that you don't even know.  you should know that lugansk is the scammer capitol of ukraine.  that she is from lugansk AND on an obscure american "match" site really really suggests something is wrong there.  have you even spoken to her on the phone?  most ukrainian girls DO have phones or, at the least, access to a phone...and don't believe the girl who says she does not.  i think a girl saying she does not have a phone is a big scammer red flag alert.  you should definitely talk to her on the phone before you go all that way just to see her.  also, check with someone like jack to have flowers personally delivered to her along with a picture taken of her receiving them to verify that she is even real.  if she does not give you her physical address where she can receive mail and flowers, she's probably a scammer.  its probably also a good idea to have someone else who's received a few emails from FSU women to read some of the emails she's sent you for a quick "scam scan."

[thesearch]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

I was involved with a lady from Lugansk. She was not a scammer just had emotional problems - overly sensitive type with end result being an end product of repeated abuse from Ukrainian men.

Absolutely gorgeous lady.

However, what I want to say is that she told me that she would never let me travel to Lugansk unescorted by her. She said she would meet me in Kiev and we would travel together.

I would not go to Lugansk this first trip. Have her meet you in Kiev or somewhere else. Just pay for her train ticket and a place for her to stay. If you really like her, you can have plan B to go with her back to Lugansk or go there your next trip.

How did you find those ladies in Lugansk. My lady from Lugansk told me that several of the ladies she rubbed shoulders with at an agency clearly were not looking for a husband but a green card. She told me that it was a dangerous proposition for an American man to find a sincere Ukrainian woman from what she could see by the type of ladies that were using the agency services.

[rwnovice]

... in response to /, posted by thesearch on Sep 20, 2002

Mine in Lugansk were from a free site-matchdoctor.  I've checked out ALL the sites listed in planet-love, and they do not appear in any of those agencies.  Nor do they appear on scammer alert sites.

[rojak]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

Wow! RWNovice, you come across as pretty insincere...

[rwnovice]

... in response to Re: collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rojak on Sep 20, 2002

You a male???

[rwnovice]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

I have never traveled outside of the states (except for the Bahamas and NYC) but have traveled extensively alone in the US.  I'm a lawyer who handles cases in port cities around the US.  I know it's going to be culture shock.  Don't know Russian or Ukrainian (BTW, I'd rather learn Russian as it is more widespread-what are your thoughts?)  I'll approach my girls about the possiblity of meeting me in Odessa or Kherson and check their reaction.  To save me the time, I would gladly pay their $79 autolux bus fares both ways.  I'll have to be really slick about scheduling to pull it off without overlap-maybe feigning a departure for one of them.  If things go unbelievably well with one of them, I might make the rest of the trip to Lugansk to check out the family.  But if they are not receptive to meeting me, I believe I can get valuable info from trekking to Lugansk and meeting the families.  I would need insight into their backgrounds if things would develop.  And if they didn't, I would be stuck in Lugansk looking for transportion to another city where I have previously established leads.
 I'm not big on meeting a lot of girls at this point-the aforementioned target confusion.  The whole motivation for the trip is this one girl. . .she seems quite down to earth, humble, sweet.  Met her on matchdoctor-she's not with any agency.  So, I'm leaning towards the very few girls approach this time out with a backup plan.  Next time out, if this doesn't pan out, I can cast the net wide.  BTW, I've seen Firstdream, and the site is pretty vague about prices.  I might contact him to see if he has any assets (no pun intended) in Lugansk or Donetsk.

[MarkInTx]

... in response to Re: Thanks for the benefit of your exper..., posted by rwnovice on Sep 20, 2002

If you bring multiple girls from out-lying cities to meet you don't forget one very important detail: Change apartments!

It will be easier for the girl to pack up and go home if she sees you packing up and "leaving" also.

[rwnovice]

... in response to Re: Thanks for the benefit of your exper..., posted by rwnovice on Sep 20, 2002

Stuff like flats, translators, girls, etc???  I know you strongly recommend the wide net cast at least as a backup. . .Thanks!

[Jack]

... in response to Re: HEY JACK-You got any back up in Luga..., posted by rwnovice on Sep 20, 2002

rwnovice, by just reading only a little bit of what you have written, I would say you need to make some changes in your plans. Might be best for you to call me when you have half an hour or so.

[rwnovice]

... in response to Re: Re: HEY JACK-You got any back up in ..., posted by Jack on Sep 20, 2002

[Ramblin]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

My advice, go to Lugansk and see you #1 first.  If all goes well with her, spend as much time with her as possible.  It is more than likely that she will be unavailable at certain times and you will be there with nothing to do, so even if all is going well with girl #1, you still need a backup plan for Lugansk.  That will give you a comparison so that you do not go and marry the first Ukrainian lady you meet and if things do not go well, you will need the back up plan anyway.  In my opinion, the best first back up plan is to have telephone numbers of ladies that you are corresponding with in that city.  Agencies in that local area are a second back up plan behind the telephone numbers being your first back up plan.  You also need a back up plan in case Lugansk sucks or you have bad luck there.  Make back up plans for Kherson and let us know how it goes.  Best of luck.

[Ramblin]

... in response to Re: collective wisdom solicitation, posted by Ramblin on Sep 20, 2002

I agree with Zink that you should also bring with you a list of internet sites and e-mail addresses so that you can write to ladies from an internet cafe.  But keep in mind that once you tell a lady that you are in her city and would like to meet her, it could take her two days to schedule you.  And it is very rare that a local agency can get you a date for the same evening that you show up.  So you will need to get the ball rolling on your back up plans ahead of time.  I think whenever you can get to the point that you don't need an agency or an e-mail but can just call the girl up yourself or with your interpreter, then you have your back up plan covered.  But for new ladies, you will need the agencies and internet.

[Bobby Orr]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

What is your life experience?  How many times have you been out of the USA?  Are you an experienced travelor?  Do you speak Russian at all?  Do you like taking long train rides?  Do you like flying between cities (do you mind it much) on old airplanes?  Will you need a translator?  How much of the Russian (mostly in Eastern Ukraine) culture and Ukrainian culture do you know?  You should think about all of these things.  You must know yourself and should know what you seek.  For all I know you are from the Ukraine, speak the language fluently and know exactly what you are getting into - but somehow I doubt that.

Now, assuming you are about 40 with a number of trips overseas, are confident in your traveling ability, know the culture and speak little to no Russian and drawing on my experience - which is a guy who wants a vastly superior girl than I could attract here - if I were you I would see the girl in Lugansk and after a period of time see the other girl in Donetsk.  If I were you I would contact someone like Jack at Firstdream to help you with transportation, housing and translator problems as well as help you with backup plans ie. which agencies to go to in the cities you visit in the event that things do not work out with your two girls.  No, I never used Jack's services, but may so next year - I like his references from this board as well as his advice which is the soundest I have ever heard from anyone in the business.

I think you are a lucky man at the beginning of a wonderous adventure.  All the best.

[Zink]

... in response to collective wisdom solicitation, posted by rwnovice on Sep 19, 2002

Watch out if you start the one woman versus many discussion again! A few times a year we go through that one. The last time it was fairly friendly. I'm not very familiar with Ukraine as I chose to focus entirely on Russia. Just bad luck when I wrote Ukranian girls. The Russian ladies seem to like me better.  But maybe my thoughts on the matter will help.

Go to meet as many girls as you want. I prefer to only meet a few each trip(I went to Russia several times for just one), others want to date half the city. It's up to you. But make a back up plan. Find some recommended agencies in your chosen area or make a list of secondary contacts yourself. Meet the girls that you contacted before you went and then decide where to go from there. If none suit you, go to the agencies or an internet cafe and write/meet some from your back up list.

As for Lugansk. Why not have the girl come to meet you somewhere else if you don't want to go there? If you can fly half way around the world to see her, then she should be able to make a shorter trip for you. It all depends on how strong your attraction is to this girl. Is she worth it to you to make that trip?

Just keep a positive attitude and try to enjoy your trip even if you don't find what you're looking for quickly. You seem to have your act together so far, so don't worry about being naive.