Help!

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Help!, posted by wayne3 on Dec 12, 2005

You know Wayne, your idea of pulling all of the INS out of the airports and putting them on the barbed wire isn’t that far-fetched.

Some years ago here in San Diego, they literally solved the illegal immigration problem overnight. Someone came up with a brilliant idea called Operation Gatekeeper and it worked beautifully. Instead of letting the illegals walk across the border and then chasing them around all night, they pulled every Border Patrol Agent in the county and lined them up on the border, with orders that no one gets by.

There has been virtually no significant illegal entry problem here in San Diego since that first night years ago. Now they cross out in the deserts East of San Diego where they at least aren’t stealing my car and breaking into my house :-)

Ray

[Keith NC]

... in response to Actually..., posted by Ray on Dec 12, 2005

Ray,

I saw the nice fence they built out there in San Diego.  That seems to keep anyone out that wants to come in.  Are they going to build that kind of fence across the whole Southern border?  Seems like I heard some rumblings about that but they are waiting for more funding.  I have a funding solution.  Just take all the welfare, medicaid money that we spend on the illeagals and put it toward the fence.  Kill two birds with one stone.  

Keith  

Keith

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Actually..., posted by Keith NC on Dec 13, 2005

Keith,

That triple-layer fence works great but the leftists and environmental whackos won’t let them finish the last few miles. The California Democrats and others have it tied up in the courts over some stupid environmental nonsense. These are some of the same folks who want driver’s licenses for illegals and won’t let the local or state police cooperate with the border patrol in apprehending illegals. Go figure...

Ray

[Keith NC]

... in response to Re: Re: Actually..., posted by Ray on Dec 14, 2005

Leave up to the anti American libs to stop a good thing for the country as a whole.

[Beattledog]

... in response to Re: Actually..., posted by Keith NC on Dec 13, 2005

agree 100 pecent

beattledog

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Help!, posted by wayne3 on Dec 12, 2005

What a stupid suggestion! Wouldn’t that be great if any citizen could invite anyone he wanted to and his guests would be guaranteed entry to the U.S.! All it would take is one stupid citizen terrorist like John Walker Lindh inviting all of his Al Queda buddies to the U.S.  Think man!

As far as bringing over the wife’s family or friends, you should place the blame where it really belongs, not on the U.S. government. For many countries, it is very easy to get a tourist visa to the U.S. and for other countries you don’t even need a visa. Why do you think it’s so difficult for citizens of Colombia, Mexico, the Philippines, etc, to get a visitor visa? Because the people from those countries have a terrible history of visa fraud and too many of them never return after their visit like they promised to do. So, you can place the blame on your wife’s countrymen before her who selfishly abused their visas and never went back home.

Ray

[Gary Bala]

... in response to Re: Help!, posted by wayne3 on Dec 12, 2005

on “illegal immigration”, you get your chance this week. Tell your Congressman.

The Republican-controlled House of Representatives will vote Weds. Dec. 14, 2005, on the Border Protection, Anti-Terrorism, and Illegal Immigration Control Act of 2005 (HR 4437), introduced by introduced by Rep. James Sensenbrenner on Dec. 06, 2005.

It basically militarizes the borders, criminalizes “unlawful presence” of “illegals” (a federal crime), expands expedited removal, strips the courts of judicial review of immigration cases, imposes the stiffest penalties yet on “illegal” hiring employers, and expands alien-smuggling punishment to families and others. Getting the borders and the noose tighter.

SUMMARY OF HR4437
http://judiciary.house.gov/media/pdfs/immbillsection.pdf

[Pete E]

... in response to If anyone wants to get tough..., posted by Gary Bala on Dec 12, 2005

There are way to get tough if we REALLY wanted to.I suspect this bill will fail as too extreme.
Years ago I thought employers were penaized,but it seems not.My ex worked for a company that hired lots of illegals.When notice came through thier SS card was fake   they had to fire them,but it took months.The boss actually told my ex,you are legal!She said yes,thats what I told you.
He presumed she was not.

Pete

[utopiacowboy]

... in response to Re: If anyone wants to get tough..., posted by Pete E on Dec 13, 2005

She works with several people who are illegal and they envy her green card.

[Beattledog]

... in response to Same with my wife, posted by utopiacowboy on Dec 13, 2005

if you and she knows that they are illegals, why not turn them to the immigratin authoriies, including the employer to the government?

Beattledog

[Pete E]

... in response to Re: Same with my wife, posted by Beattledog on Dec 14, 2005

These people are co workers.The others workers tend to sympathise with them.One woman who my wife knew had the notice come back she was illegal was called in to talk to the boss.She called my wife saying do you know why he wants to see me?My wife says I don't know,didn't want to give her the bad news.Its easier to sympathise with a human being,somebody who basically only wants what you already have than  a government policy.One reason we have no strong enforcement is alot of people do not want it.My prediction,this new tough law will not pass.

Pete

[Gary Bala]

... in response to Re: Re: Same with my wife, posted by Pete E on Dec 15, 2005

[This message has been edited by Gary Bala]

HR 4437, the get-tough Immigration bill, was passed by the House tonight by 239-182.  

The immigration issue next moves to the Senate in Feb. 2006, where they are expected to take up a comprehensive immigration reform plan, to include consideration of the Bush temporary guest worker plan.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,179012,00.html

[Ray]

... in response to Pete, the House passed the new tough law, posted by Gary Bala on Dec 16, 2005

Hi Gary,

The version that passed looks pretty good to me overall. At least it includes part of the fence :-)

But the best part of all is that Vicente Fox doesn’t like it. Screw him!

Ray

[Gary Bala]

... in response to Re: If anyone wants to get tough..., posted by Pete E on Dec 13, 2005

[This message has been edited by Gary Bala]

"Illegal immigration"

"There are way(s) to get tough if we REALLY wanted to"

Do you have any special ways in mind? The House bill HR 4437 probably has the toughest employer sanctions and enforcement of any bill around lately. I agree with you however that this bill is too extreme, one-sided, focused on "enforcement-only", and will not likely even come close to being passed by the Senate or signed by the President. But I do think that the Republican-controlled House will pass it, albeit by a small margin, and that it will help placate the social conservatives on the "illegal" immigration issue. (It passed the House Judiciary Committee by a small margin, 23-15, on 12/08/05).

I think most people know that I favor a broader and more comprehensive solution to immigration, trying to get at the root causes and pressures creating the "illegal immigration" in the first place, and agree that the borders should be tightened up vastly better, but would also advocate a limited form of temporary guest worker program for some, not all,  undocumenteds, such as the one in the McCain-Kennedy bill in the Senate and even the Bush Administration proposal.

It is interesting to see the current battles going on in the Republican Party now between the social conservatives (anti-"illegal" immigration on principle) vs. the business conservatives who want and need the employment of "illegal" undocumented workers (in jobs domestic workers don't want) in order to continue U.S. economic growth. The Republican (conservative) Administration and President Bush personally is lobbying the social conservatives in his party, in the House and Senate to go along with some form of temporary guest worker program for some undocumenteds.

It will be interesting to see how all this will play out next year 2006. The final bill will probably be worked out in negotiations between the Administration and future Senate/House conference committee members, and will likely consist of a broader and more comprehensive immigration solution that what we see in HR 4437.

[Ray]

... in response to Thx, Pete..., posted by Gary Bala on Dec 13, 2005

[This message has been edited by Ray]

Hi Gary,

In my opinion, this is EXACTLY the approach we need to take. It makes absolutely no sense to me to attempt some broad, comprehensive solution until you get a handle on the enforcement problem FIRST. I want to puke every time these dumb-ass politicians propose ANOTHER “amnesty” program while the borders are still wide open and employers get away with murder. We have been sending the wrong message to our neighbors for way too long now.

Also, there just aren’t enough people taking this “War on Terror” seriously. We need those borders protected NOW, before we even start to worry about the welfare of the illegals who are already here. "Ideally", we would send ALL illegals back home while securing our borders. I agree in principle that we need some sort of controlled temporary guest worker program, with the emphasis on “temporary”. To just keep rewarding the folks who broke the law and came here illegally is insane. Why shouldn’t those who respect our laws have first crack at a guest worker card?

I agree with your comments on getting to the real root causes of the illegal immigration problem, but unfortunately the solution lies in Mexico City and with the other governments where the bulk of the illegals are coming from. Unless they get a government in Mexico willing to take responsibility for their own poverty, the ONLY remedy on our side of the border is the “get tough” approach.

At least the Republicans are beginning to show the courage to step up to the plate and actually do something to secure the borders. All we get from the Democrats is more of the same garbage and cowardly pandering to their Latino voting base.

Ray :-)