How about some purposefull ideas?

[Pete E]

Ok,As king of the tangents,I admit it,we get off base alot.Some of you other guys are king of gotchas,waiting to nail someone.Papi might have been heading for the ditch but he got shoved along also.We could have done that better,been helpfull not destructive.Its hard to just not do it I know.So how about we try some perhaps usefull stuff to fill that void?
My idea,a series of posts on how and how not to do it.One idea at a time.Often we will see a big list.Better I think to take one at a time.Less confusing and allows us to focus more.
First there is no one common goal.Some guys want a wife to take to the states,Some guys just want girl friends.WE tend to guys who have been around the block here.Sometimes we can be cynical.Many guys no longer are looking for marriage,or at least that is not their primary focus,been there.done that,isn't that 2 of our guys?Guys who are successfully married tend to go away,so we get an unbalenced view.Thanks to Steve,Hoda,James,Dave and alot of others for sticking it out with us.
Ok,in order,in my opinion,biggest ways to screw up,in my opinion,starting with the worst examples.that will be a new post.
This may or may not turn in to a book.I am wired this morning,this prednesone doesn't let me sleep.We are dosing down,hopefully I will be off it in 3 or 4 weeks,Beats surgury.I was lying there thinking this stuff,lots of guys came to mind,so I got up and here goes.

Pete

     

[teoblas]

... in response to How about some purposefull ideas?, posted by Pete E on Sep 22, 2005

We live in a three dimensional world.  Men and women can be evaluated on three aspects: the physical, the mental and the emotional.  We all want a woman (or women) that are "good or great or excellent" in all three aspects but the fact is you only get to pick two.

If you seek a great looking and emotionally sweet girl she is generally not up to speed in one or more areas of the brains or common sense department.

If she is great looking and mentally sharp she is often times emotionally defecit or scarred in some area.

The girl that is mentally well off and emotionally well balanced was able to develop these qualities or had to develop these qualities because she is lacking in the looks department.  

The error that any guy can make is to keep looking in search for that girl that is outstanding in all three aspects.  They either don't exist or if they do exist they get taken off the market at the speed of light by the guy that can and will provide them the best offer for marriage, babies (or care for existing children) and long term economic well being (a home, a car, nice clothes, an occasional vacation, etc).  

A man is as faithful as his options.....  A woman falls in love according to her options......

If she is a fantastic catch (hotter than hot, great heart and really, really sharp in all areas) she will hook up with a young (more or less the same age as she is) very good looking, single and never married, intelligent, healthy, financially well off but not overly wealthy guy that genuinely wants to start a family or will accept the family the girl already has.  (Note: deep down she wishes she could have a multimillionaire and knows that she could get one, but also knows that she can't have it all since a multimillionaire that can maintain a trophy woman can and will (sooner or later) maintain multiple trophy women....)  Also the guy is a smooth talker.  Guys fall in love with their eyes and girls fall in love with their ears.  

Now the age that a fantastic catch gets pulled off the market is 22 or 23 in the US and 16, 17 or 18 in Latin America.  If the guy that pulls her off the market does not have his stuff together or screws up, then she lands back on the market but there is already a few guy "friends" that have been seeing it coming and waiting for the opportunity to hook up and waste no time taking this once in a lifetime catch off the market again.  

There is also a curve ball or wild card in the equation.  Most any girl or guy does not really really know what he wants until his or her mid to late 20's.  So when a guy that has his stuff together and is lucky enough to encounter one of these women and adept enough to take her off the market at the earliest opportunity (a young age) it is possible that when she hits her mid or late 20's she unilaterally decides on a significant life/direction change in your agreed upon relationship and the guy is out of luck!

Did I mention that most guys do not discover Latin America until it is too late (for them)?  Did I mention the smooth talker thing - it means that you need to be fluent in the girls native tounge.... Did I mention that all women age and sooner or later hit the wall?

By the way, if a girl has zero or only one aspect in her favor you call that girl a Gringa.

Teo

[OkieMan]

... in response to Pick any two, posted by teoblas on Sep 23, 2005

Teo,

This is a very interesting post.  May I ask how you came to these conclusions?  I agree with most, if not all of it.  But,here is the "real deal".  Many of us gringos are "over the hill", age wise, (Myself included).  I certainly don't think I am an old man at 52, but still, let's face it.  One of the big, big reasons why many of us are even attempting this, is because we have been led to believe that we can realistically expect to find a younger latina who will accept us, even though there is often times a significant age difference.  Also, because of this, it is a tremendous ego boost for some of us older farts, who wouldn't get the time of day with a 25-35 year old AW.  Now, I realize that if I was in the "Donald Trump" category, I could get a model type like he did.  But, then again, she probably fell in love with his wallet, not his heart.  Like most of you, I want "true love", but I am not a love-struck teenage boy either. All that to say this,  I just hope that I am not buying into something that is just so much baloney the agencies and others are selling. I am not a cradle robber, in that I am not chasing the 18-21 year old girls.  But, I really hope that I can work on doing all that I can (ie learning spanish, etc), and then trusting the part about the latinas are really interested in middle-aged guys like me.  Otherwise, the disillusionment will set in, and I will feel like a first class idiot!!  Also, I cannot do what you have done, and that is to move down there.  Who knows what the future holds, but for anytime in the near future, I cannot do that.  So, just how realistic is it for someone like me to travel down there, and meet a decent, attractive lady, and get married?  That is the $64,000 question. Yes, I know there are other guys who have already done it, but I still think it is a valid question, and I would like to get your take on it?  Based on what your post said, it sounds very unlikely, or at least very dicey, at best.  Maybe I just did not understand what you said, but I don't think it sounds too encouraging.  Just my read on it.

                             OkieMan

[caslug]

... in response to Re: Pick any two, posted by OkieMan on Sep 23, 2005

"So, just how realistic is it for someone like me to travel down there, and meet a decent, attractive lady, and get married? That is the $64,000 question."..Okie

It's VERY easy to do that, but it does require a bit of time, first time to go out with several women till you hit the one that clicks, then time to get to know here(which generally means a few more trips.  Of course langauge and understanding local culture helps too, it allows you to see which gals are good and which are bad.  The problem w/ foriegn guys is that a) we dont have tons to time for extended trip, b) we dont know the langauge, & c) dont know the culture.

The only way to get the hurdle is a) make the time or b) outsource(via personal consultant or agency services).

I notice the guys that have the best success w/ gals is ones that travel frequently(2 or 3 times a quarter) down there.  They dont live there, yet come down enough that they have a good understanding of langauge and culture.  The guys that live there have know langauge/culture but i notice they have another problem...They cant stay faithful! LOL!  Sure they may have gf/wives, but they still play on side, because it's sooo accessible.

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Re: Pick any two, posted by caslug on Sep 23, 2005

Caslug,

Thanks for your comments.  I still have a lot of work to do, so I am trying to learn a new lesson in patience.  (Easier said than done).  However, I am sure that sometime before I crumble back to dust I will figure it all out.  I just hope it doesn't take too long, or I will be so old, I can't get it up anymore, and the girl will just have to keep me from drooling and change my diaper every now and then. ha

                                 OkieMan

[Pete E]

... in response to Pick any two, posted by teoblas on Sep 23, 2005

Ted,
A thought on Colombianas,Colombiasnos.We are meeting,by default,the Colombianas who's Colombiano screwed up.If not she would still be with him.Yes,she will give you a list of his bad behavior,probably true,but he was probably alot more fun than the gringo she meets next.So she is pulled between the two,and the winner is often the one in front of her,which is not the gringo who has returned to the states.Many mysteries are solved when we realise the Colombiano is still in the game.
See my next post,the 90 per center.

Pete

[utopiacowboy]

... in response to Re: Pick any two, posted by Pete E on Sep 23, 2005

He died! Was he a lot more fun than me? Hell, no. Even my wife says he had a "mal genio".

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Pick any two, posted by Pete E on Sep 23, 2005

Pete,

See, this is the scenario that just freaks me out!! This is the kind of crap that I hope I can one day overcome, but I really did not want to have to deal with this kind of junk in the first place!!  I thought that was why I was getting away from all the weird head games the AW were playing.  So, this sounds sort of like going from the skillet into the fire!!  I got burnt already by Yadira.  I don't want that mess again.

                              OkieMan

[Pete E]

... in response to Re: Re: Pick any two, posted by OkieMan on Sep 23, 2005

WHEN you find the one who fits and trully cares about you it will not be an issue,Untill then everything will be an issue,including a possible guy.You want one WITHOUT a mystery so you don't have to wonder what it is.Its not a head game,she is just being her,not the girl for you.
Its just easier to find an acceptable woman here,but its not automatic.
Keep on Keeping on.Its much more likely to happen here.You can do so much better.
You just tried to fit the wrong girl in to the picture.First you find the right girl,then she fits.Don't give up,its not so tough,takes some time effort and clear direction.

Pete

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Pick any two, posted by Pete E on Sep 23, 2005

Pete,

Thanks for the words of encouragement.  I am not giving up.  But, I am still on the learning curve.  Hey maybe this little latina who posted on the board from Cali can help many of us.  I hope so.

                                 OkieMan

[Bueller]

... in response to Re: Pick any two, posted by Pete E on Sep 23, 2005

Unintentionally funny typo here: "asno" means ass/donkey/burro, thus the "columbiasno" who screwed up. Oh well, sometimes I find myself being an "americasno". ;-)

[Cali James]

... in response to How about some purposefull ideas?, posted by Pete E on Sep 22, 2005

[This message has been edited by Cali James]

In keeping with your theme, I think it makes good sense to concentrate this adventure in one city.  It may take a few trips to find a city that you like, but once you find it, keep going back.  I think there are inherent advantages to this, you learn the local culture, how people interact, what they like, what they don't.  You develop friends outside of the agency scene, relationships with people in real life and I think this will be helpful to guys in search of a novia or a mate.  I went to Bogota before concentrating on Cali.  Nothing wrong with Bogota but I was personally much more comfortable in Cali.  You brought up Papi, he's an example of how not to go about it in my mind.  One week he's chasing women in Panama, the next Barranquilla, and so on.  The next city on his agenda is always the next great place to find a Latina.  I think this causes a lack of focus and because he's always at the next destination, he doesn't pick up on cultural clues as fast as he should.

[Frank O]

... in response to Concentrate in one city, posted by Cali James on Sep 22, 2005

I agree with that. I was married to a Ukrainian I used a similar approach. I know many men who went that route, one trip was Lugansk, another Kiev, another Nikolaev sometimes more than 1 on a trip. For me it was easier to get to KNOW a city then take it from there. It worked for me. Unfortunately my marriage did not.

[Pete E]

... in response to Concentrate in one city, posted by Cali James on Sep 22, 2005

James,
Charlie will be here tommorow night.He will stay 4 days,then go to Barranquilla to see a girl he talked to on the interrnet.Then back.He has 10 days,never been here before. I tell him 4 days,you just get started,you are gone.You could meet 15 more girls HERE WHILE YOU ARE DOING BARRANQUILLA TO DO ONE,PLUS FOLLOW UP WITH OTHERS YOU ALREADY MET.HE SAYS I REALLY WANT TO SEE HER.I  hope its worth it.I doubt it.She is just one possibility,taking the time of 15 or 20 others.Untill you meet them,you never know.
If he is not carefull he could get added to the how not list here.

Pete

[utopiacowboy]

... in response to Re: Concentrate in one city, posted by Pete E on Sep 22, 2005

What you forget is that for most of us, it only takes ONE. Is the whole idea to try to start a collection of women? I didn't have to meet 200 women in two weeks in Colombia. There was one I wanted to see and she was the one. Hell, after I met her in person, you could have paraded 500 naked women past me and I wouldn't have cared in the slightest. For me she was it. She is still it. Maybe this chick in BAQ really gets to him somehow and he has a gut feeling about her. I say follow your instincts - when I saw my wife's photo for the first time even before I had completely decided to write to her, I thought, that's my wife. I can't explain it.