Another, and Hopefully Last, Political Post

[Brazilophile]

Papi, Heat, WS244, OKM, Jake, and others have made remarks that my posts are out of line, I need to apologize, etc.  That's OK.  However, your remarks about Islam and Muslim countries leave me dumbfounded!  But I am stupid so please humor me and answer another question, or 2.  

Hoda, please don't delete this thread for at least 24 hours or so.

If all Muslim countries teach their citizens to hate the US and Israel, how do you explain Turkey!?!?!?!?

Turkey is a Muslim country that is, and has been, a strong ally of the US for decades.  In addition, Turkey is a close friend and supporter of Israel.  The two country's intelligence communities worked closely to contain Saddam Hussein.  

How do you guys reconcile the reality of a Muslim country like Turkey with your rhetoric??

(Note as well that Pakistan is also a Muslim country that is a long time ally of the US.)

Second question.  Many of you claim to be strong supporters of President Bush.  A few weeks ago Bush hosted the Crown Prince Abdullah of Saudi Arabia at Crawford, Texas.  A dramatic photo that was plastered everywhere was one of Bush and the Prince HAND-IN-HAND  going into Bush's house.  This is the same Saudi Arabia from where 15 of the 19 9/11 hijackers came from.  The same Suadi Arabia from where bin Laden comes from.  The same Saudi Arabia that promotes Wahabism, the extreme form of Islam that terrorists follow.  

How do you guys reconcile your strong suport of Bush, and conservatives generally, when there are so many close ties betwen the Bush family and other wealthy Republicans with a country and society that has more and stronger ties to 9/11, and terrorisnm generally, than any other country in the world with your rhetoric??!?!?!?!?!

[Heat]

... in response to Another, and Hopefully Last, Political P..., posted by Brazilophile on Jul 8, 2005

N/T

[Ray]

... in response to Another, and Hopefully Last, Political P..., posted by Brazilophile on Jul 8, 2005

[This message has been edited by Ray]

"How do you guys reconcile your strong suport of Bush"

My God, man! Did you see that silly fag he was running against? When the Democrats keep nominating garbage for candidates, why in the world would you question why anyone would vote for Bush ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

[WS244]

... in response to Dumb Question..., posted by Ray on Jul 9, 2005

Though this board has commented about politics, but i have to respond to this one.
Well the other guy was not exactly a "fag" but a very liberal person to most on this board who in turn voted for Bush.  I only bring this up as those who went to vietnam stationed in saigon, danang, etc. in a logistics-clerical capacity may not have had the same sense of intrepedation as one going over knowing one was going to be shot at, but still the empty stomach feeling was still there for any rational normal man.  Bush who should have gone as his father did.  Senator McCain did following his fathers and grandfathers footsteps, and though i do not agree with some of his more liberal views, i respect him for his duty.  Just as i do not like his liberalism, i respect kerry for his duty also.  For those of you not knowing history, Senator McGovern, one of the most liberal senators of his time, was a WW2 army aircore B24 pilot in europe, and wrote an  excellent book on the subject.  I did not agree with him either but respect him for his duty.  While many rich kids did not go, many poor kids did not go either.  My dad was a WW2 army aircore pilot and i was a vietman army pilot. Bush had a tradition to hold up to and he was not a better man than me. It scares me when we go to war with gung ho administration people in charge of a war never being there themselves. Clinton was another example. I do not buy the story if we were not there they would be here, for they are already here because of our politically correct society as the english. Our texas borders today are wide open and last year thousands of "otm's" crossed over. (other than mexican) and if you do not know the policy, those people are simply released with their promise to appear for a deportation hearing at a later time (only 15% appear) and the rest melt in to our general public.  The mexicans will not allow us to deport "OTM's back to mexico. If you recall when the "minute men were along the border" bush called them vigilantes.  So for those of you expounding how we have to be in Iraq, why not instead let the arabs kill each other, write your congressman and have them control our immigration and border laws that have been on the books for years.

[Ray]

... in response to Re: Dumb Question..., posted by WS244 on Jul 9, 2005

I thought I was being kind to Kerry. If he were simply a “very liberal person” as you call it, like George McGovern, then I would have no problem with that. I didn’t vote for McGovern, but I had nothing against him personally. The big difference between Kerry and McGovern was that McGovern didn’t come home during the war and attack his fellow servicemen in public and give aid and comfort to our enemies by verbally attacking his country.

Personally, I think John Kerry is an arrogant twit and a traitor. During my time in the military, I have had the honor to serve with some REAL war heroes. Unlike John Kerry, they didn’t go around like an arrogant ass proclaiming to be a hero. Something that I have learned about real war heroes, like George McGovern and all of the others, is that they NEVER talk up their war record and refer to themselves as war heroes.

After Kerry served in the war, he came home and disparaged the reputation and good name of the brave men and women still fighting the war, including the POW’s like McCain. As a veteran who was serving in the war while Kerry was trashing us in public, I despise that stinking little ass and would NEVER vote for him. To me and virtually all the other veterans I know, Kerry was NOT qualified to be our Commander-In-Chief. SCREW HIM!

Ray

[OkieMan]

... in response to Excuse me..., posted by Ray on Jul 9, 2005

Ray,

You are so right about Kerry!  What a jerk!

                          OkieMan

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Dumb Question..., posted by WS244 on Jul 9, 2005

WS244,

I cannot find fault with most of what you said.  I served in peace time in the Air Force, but I did do TDY in Saudia Arabia when the old Ayatollah Khomeni (?) in Iran was giving everyone fits.  Also, one of my sons fought recently in  Iraqi war (2 tours).  So, I have at least some knowledge of what you are talking about.  But, I think it is a little off the mark to make it a prerequisite for every president to have to be some kind of "war hero". It is a nice thing, and I am always glad to support a president that is also a vet (assuming I can agree with his politics).  But, as you pointed out, guys like McGovern and Kerry were waaaaay to liberal for me to support.  Apparently, for you too.  So, just because W. didn't go to Vietnam, let's not slam him for that.  He did serve in the Air National Guard.  Compared to McCain's record, that might not be as impressive; but since when do we require our presidents to all be POW war heroes?  Also, I will tell you that in my opinion, the greatest president in my lifetime has been Ronald Reagan.  We all know that he was formerly governor of California, and also before that, an actor.  I well remember many people saying he was just a "dumb actor", he would be a flash in the pan, etc.  He had many, many detractors,as well as enemies.  What many people don't remember about him is that he also served in WWII too.  But, he never saw combat.  He was in some training division.  He became a Captain in the Army, but because of poor eye sight, he could only do "light duty", like the training.  So, since he was an actor, he made training films for the army. But, he was a great patriot, and a great president, later in life.  Also, Ronald Reagan was great friends with John Wayne.  Many people don't know it, but John Wayne never served in the military; even though he made many war films. He was always my "hero".  And no one ever questioned John Wayne's patriotism.  Many other actors of that generation  who did serve in WWII:  Clark Gable, James Stewart, Henry Fonda, Tyrone Power, Robert Taylor--- the list goes on.  But John Wayne did not.  Some say it was because he had 4 kids, at the time (he went on to father a total of 8 kids).  A little more trivia for all of you old movie buffs, like me.  John Wayne was married 3 times.  All three wives were latinas.  His first wife was from Panama.  His second wife was a Mexican lady.  His third wife was from Peru!

                            OkieMan
P.S.   I am a big old movie buff, and certainly a John Wayne fan.

[WS244]

... in response to Re: Re: Dumb Question..., posted by OkieMan on Jul 9, 2005

My response to you was to the word "fag" and to me means a "queer" and in the old days we referred to queers as queers.    
For a little history, Johnson a "Democrat" got us in to vietnam, and Nixon a "Republican" took 7 more years to get us out of it.  In the end we had both incompetent democrat and republican presidents who managed to get 58,000 americans killed.  I do not like kerry either, but i respect his service because he did not run like many of my age group whom are the same flag waving give those arabs heck hippocrites of today.  He was also out of the service when he testified, and by then it was a losing war and many americans were against it.  Senator McCain who suffered more than most during that period, and a well respected and honest man, does not have such harsh words for kerry and i suspect for the same reasons.    

Ronald Reagan was in the army and an American, and having gone through WW2 understood what was at stake.  Reagan, being a realist of history, was also smart enough not to expound democracy and equality for the world no matter what in every other speech.  He was also smart enough less some forget on this board to pull out of Lebanon when 200 some odd marines were killed.

This is why discussion of politics is important on this board.  If people  on this board really believe in all this democracy, political correctness, and equality suff, then be honest and forget about south america and foreign women.  what they are believing is opposite to what they are attempting, which is one reason many are failing at this endeavor because the two do not mix.

[Michael B]

... in response to Re: Re: Dumb Question..., posted by OkieMan on Jul 9, 2005

I read some where that when Mr. Morrison (his born name) was divorcing one of them (the first, I think) he was using 'refuses to perform her matrimonial duties' (or what ever the legal term actually was) for the grounds (wasn't any 'no fault' in those days). The judge said "Mr. Morrison, you have four children by this woman, how can you allege such a thing?" He replied "Four KIDS, four TIMES" and the judge replied "Divorce granted".

P.S. You left out Gene Autry, a gunner in a B-17 crew. And Woody Guthrie served in the merchant marine (some times as an OS, but usually as a cook or mess hall attendant) and was torpedoed three times.

[OkieMan]

... in response to John Wayne's Divorce, posted by Michael B on Jul 9, 2005

Michael B,

I left out many other stars of that era. I could go on forever about that, since I am an old movie buff, and also a lover of history.  By the way, the first wife of Duke's that you referred to, one of the four children was Patrick. You probably have seen him in several of Duke's old movies.  His oldest son Michael died last year, I think.  Yes, unfortunately, the Duke did not stay with any of the women he married.  I don't believe he actually divorced Pilar, his last wife (Peruvian).  But, they were at least separated.  Still, I always thought that it was fascinating that he obviously had a "thing" for latinas.  Years ago, I never thought that I would be chasing latinas in South American.  Life has a way of throwing us some surprises.

                           OkieMan

[Dan Las Vegas]

... in response to Re: John Wayne's Divorce, posted by OkieMan on Jul 9, 2005

I used to live in Newport Beach california, close to John Waynes home. as far as I know, he never seperated from Pilar, they were married 27 years by the time he died, They were always seen together in the local restaurants, particularly Gullivers...He was always pleasant to people coming up to him for autographs... Last I heard, Pilar was quite an artist and remarried sometime in the late 1990's.

He was larger than life in person as well....no mistaking his voice amongst others... A true patriot.

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Re: John Wayne's Divorce, posted by Dan Las Vegas on Jul 9, 2005


Dan,

SO did you get to meet the Duke too?  Boy, that was a dream of mine.  I have met a few actors before, but John Wayne would have been the biggest thrill.  Unfortunately, I never got the chance. I don't know if you are familiar with the late actor Ben Johnson.  He was also a real live cowboy from Oklahoma.  He acted in many John Wayne movies. Well, in 1994, I got to meet him.  That was a real treat for me.  He was a very nice man.
           
                                 OkieMan

[Dan Las Vegas]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: John Wayne's Divorce, posted by OkieMan on Jul 9, 2005

Yes, I did one day when I was 18 in 1974, we went to dinner at the Five Crowns restaurant in Corona Del Mar and the Duke was there and I said hello to him, I was in awe of him and it is something that I'll never forget. I have had the opportunity to have met many celebrities, but none have ever had the impact that meeting John Wayne did.

[OkieMan]

... in response to Re: Re: Re: Re: John Wayne's Divorce, posted by Dan Las Vegas on Jul 10, 2005

Dan,

Let's face it; there are actors and movie stars galore.  But, there was only 1 John Wayne!  He may be gone, but he will never be forgotten!  Pilgrim! ha

                          OkieMan

[Pete E]

... in response to Another, and Hopefully Last, Political P..., posted by Brazilophile on Jul 8, 2005

All muslims are not the same.Sometimes we can lump them all together and thats a mistake.We have muslims killing muslims in Iraq right now.Hopefully its going to sink in its not the US killing all those civilians.I think its coming around .We will see. So the question is,isIraq better off without that a-shole of the world Saddam Housin running things?Maybe things are worse in the short run.In the long run better I hope or it makes the case is the worse dictator possible better than different groups fighting amoung themselves?
I think the war was worth it if the only reason was to take out Saddam.
And,if a person  can't tell the difference between a Saddam and a Bush he has a big problem with reality.

Pete