MGTOW

[robert angel]

If these MGTOW guys are complaining, why aren't they here, exploring greener pastures?

[Calipro]

If these MGTOW guys are complaining, why aren't they here, exploring greener pastures?

Because they refuse to go out of their way to get laid. They refuse to pick up the tab....they refuse to get married and they refuse to do anything extra.... because... well women are equal to men now.

[benjio]

The movement isn’t cultural or regional so no change in the culture or region a woman is from is a solution to the problems that spawned it. More than anything it’s about not falling victim to the feminine dominance that’s established itself as commonplace in the heterosexual relationships of Western Civilization. There are actually tons of YouTube videos and literature that attack the idea of foreign wife hunting. They are primarily based on the idea that women are the same everywhere. The only difference between American and Colombian Women for example, is their lack of options with respect to successful men, their lack of job opportunities that would allow them to take care of themselves and legislation to enforce financial traps like child support and alimony. Effective followers usually aren’t interested in alternatives i.e. women from different cultures that don’t behave like AW’s, but instead making themselves into alpha men that use women’s own nature against them. I’ve personally encountered very few effective followers and instead have found that most are very frustrated, VERY horny men.

I don’t agree with most of their ideas BTW, but I read A LOT!!!! Personally I love women...even Americans.

[Calipro]

The movement isn’t cultural or regional so no change in the culture or region a woman is from is a solution to the problems that spawned it. More than anything it’s about not falling victim to the feminine dominance that’s established itself as commonplace in the heterosexual relationships of Western Civilization. There are actually tons of YouTube videos and literature that attack the idea of foreign wife hunting. They are primarily based on the idea that women are the same everywhere. The only difference between American and Colombian Women for example, is their lack of options with respect to successful men, their lack of job opportunities that would allow them to take care of themselves and legislation to enforce financial traps like child support and alimony. Effective followers usually aren’t interested in alternatives i.e. women from different cultures that don’t behave like AW’s, but instead making themselves into alpha men that use women’s own nature against them. I’ve personally encountered very few effective followers and instead have found that most are very frustrated, VERY horny men.

I don’t agree with most of their ideas BTW, but I read A LOT!!!! Personally I love women...even Americans.

I don't really think that many MGTOWers are against foreign women ......but rather think that if a man actually went to a foreign country for the exclusive purpose of meeting women that you are a fool.
I think the idea is that you as a man should go someplace that interests you regardless of women and if you happen to meet a woman that wants to have no strings attached sex than more power to you.

The message is as far as I can tell is that you as a man should have your own priorities in life that do not include women and that you should never change those priorities for any woman.

And certainly never put yourself in harm's way by marrying a woman.
 

[robert angel]

OK, so it sounds like they're a bunch of whining, cheap and narrow minded malcontents. I have met wayyy too many western nation guys abroad--guys who were sketchy--the mongers etc, in my travels. Embarrassing. We don't really need more of that sort.


i dare say we're already somewhat of a maligned group of guys in most western populations, that we're outliers--a small pack of wolves.


Things have certainly changed in terms of male--female interpersonal dynamics almost everywhere on the planet, but I don't think that women are all about the same any place that doesn't have strict religious (Islam etc) controls and/or dictatorial regimes.

There are so many differences in how women really are near and far and I actually like that. You have to sift through a lot of dirt to find gold, but if you have a good, open mindset, it can be a helluva a good time.

[benjio]

I don't really think that many MGTOWers are against foreign women ......but rather think that if a man actually went to a foreign country for the exclusive purpose of meeting women that you are a fool.
I think the idea is that you as a man should go someplace that interests you regardless of women and if you happen to meet a woman that wants to have no strings attached sex than more power to you.

The message is as far as I can tell is that you as a man should have your own priorities in life that do not include women and that you should never change those priorities for any woman.

And certainly never put yourself in harm's way by marrying a woman.

https://sunrisehoodie.wordpress.com/2018/07/26/mgtow-some-men-are-a-plane-ticket-abroad/

https://mgtowmonks.wordpress.com/2018/10/03/foreign-women-are-not-the-answer-nafwalt/

https://www.mgtow.com/forums/topic/foreign-women/

[Calipro]

OK, so it sounds like they're a bunch of whining, cheap and narrow minded malcontents. I have met wayyy too many western nation guys abroad--guys who were sketchy--the mongers etc, in my travels. Embarrassing. We don't really need more of that sort.


i dare say we're already somewhat of a maligned group of guys in most western populations, that we're outliers--a small pack of wolves.




Things have certainly changed in terms of male--female interpersonal dynamics almost everywhere on the planet, but I don't think that women are all about the same any place that doesn't have strict religious (Islam etc) controls and/or dictatorial regimes.

There are so many differences in how women really are near and far and I actually like that. You have to sift through a lot of dirt to find gold, but if you have a good, open mindset, it can be a helluva a good time.

https://youtu.be/71o3hq6iSPM

Dating guru spells it out to a group of women. And this is MGTOW light.

[Calipro]

https://sunrisehoodie.wordpress.com/2018/07/26/mgtow-some-men-are-a-plane-ticket-abroad/

https://mgtowmonks.wordpress.com/2018/10/03/foreign-women-are-not-the-answer-nafwalt/

https://www.mgtow.com/forums/topic/foreign-women/

OF course hypergamy exists all over the world. But culture and the social economic norms of a country do shape the behavior of the women in any particular country.


But I don’t think that MGTOWers are anymore inclined to think poorly of a foreign woman than say a woman from the USA.


I think a lot of guys that follow MGTOW are INCELS and just don’t like women at all. But some MGTOWers are open to relationships on some level with women as long as they pay their own way in the relationship.

[mambocowboy]

OF course hypergamy exists all over the world. But culture and the social economic norms of a country do shape the behavior of the women in any particular country.


But I don’t think that MGTOWers are anymore inclined to think poorly of a foreign woman than say a woman from the USA.


I think a lot of guys that follow MGTOW are INCELS and just don’t like women at all. But some MGTOWers are open to relationships on some level with women as long as they pay their own way in the relationship.

Seems like a bunch of whiny guys who've been hurt and are dealing with that all wrong. What a miserable way to live but to each his own...

[Calipro]

Seems like a bunch of whiny guys who've been hurt and are dealing with that all wrong. What a miserable way to live but to each his own...

As I explained to a young guy in Colombia....that not paying for a date or even a taxi for the girl is a sure fire way not to get laid.


The guy refused to pay taxi fare and said that he still gets laid.....I just asked him ....is the sex really better if the chick had to take a bus to see you and you had to wait an hour longer to see her. Jajaja


I think it is the prerogative of young guys to be stupid at times.


Once you get older you realize it is better to tell the chick you will pay for her taxi to and from the date before she even has time to ask.


If you listen to the guy in the video it isn’t just about money ....it is about principle....he just wouldn’t date a woman that didn’t offer to pay half.

[robert angel]

Seems like a bunch of whiny guys who've been hurt and are dealing with that all wrong. What a miserable way to live but to each his own...

Lord knows that 2020 will be seen as not only the year the virus was discussed by every one regardless of wealth, race and location (with little cooperation), but also an unusual year in that issues like racism police, govt, LBGT and a bunch of others I can't remember right now, all came to the forefront. So I guess these MYGOT guys oughta have their say too. It sounds like there are probably millions of guys in the USA who basically subscribe to a lot of this.


But it sounds like they have nonetheless gone the 'other way', from a greater majority, espousing values that are looked at unfavorably, almost as opposite to 'progressive' groups/media sources, the very groups that seem to dominate the land and media netscape. They're labeled as many things, including 'extremist' and some even referred to as being dangerous, FWIW.


Personally, I enjoyed the hell out of single life. I don't recall being taken for a ride financially--quite the opposite really, but that's just me. I didn't look for women who were quick to pick up the tab, take me places or buy me fine Swiss watches etc,. etc. it just happened that way. When we broke up it was typically amiably--a 'fade away' and without 'monkey branching,' a new GF seemed to always organically materialize in my rather normal small to large city USA life. It was a bit harder than that at age forty, for sure. But I was about bald by age 25 and far from hollywood handsome.--but I always had at least a bit of swagger.


When I foolishly got married the 1st time, yeah that was a long wrong turn, especially after the halfway point,  through a way too long marriage, but glad I had my sons. Overall, no real female regrets here. Why carry any grudges?


The second time around has been heaven. Near 15 years into it with 23 year younger wife and while she's (thankfully) no longer less than half my age, my wife looks at age forty not being far off and it awes her. She can't fathom being 'forty.' And she looks about half her age, LOL. But her stability, grace, heart and character--and yes, the beauty and body most high school girls would love to have, haven't gone to her head. I'm Alpha and she's beta and it all works fine, at least here and now in the real. She's very generous with anything I desire, at times anxiously anticipating what she can do to make me happy. That in turn makes her happy, kinda like how I feel good when I decide to fix her a cup of tea. But in a much larger sense--in her mind and culture, it's woman's traditional duty to put her Husband's happiness first.


She's infinitely more into "we" than the "me" mindset.


That said, God is first and center in her life and that has implications in almost everything she thinks and does. I'll give the grace and credit to the Good Lord and take a VERY distant but clear, second billing, with NO understudies please.

Unless these MGOT guys are total malcontents, I can't help but think some of them would be happy with a God fearing Filipina or Latina woman -- a woman who while---perhaps because she IS embedded with an albeit foreign culture, places high priority on her husband/BF's/children's happiness.


A woman who identifies with more than just her own individual best interests.

But I can relate to the MGTOW a bit. Going all the way back to the 4th or 5th grade (when a girl would 'claim' another boy in that class and you were, like it or not, her 'BF') I had my ups and downs and took my lumps. But by great majority, the women I chose from about age 16 on, were good choices. A lotta laffs, miles of smiles and if I didn't have money, she usually did. And most of the time, going at least 'dutch'--'splitting the bill', was a foregone conclusion.


If a woman didn't at least make a half hearted attempt to at least pay the restaurant tip after a couple dates, or say: "I got it next time"--chances are we weren't going to meet again. That was, unless she was a perfect ten and there was some completely free, absolutely mindblowing sex at her place or mine, for non restaurant desert later!!! (That was an unusual scenario, but why waste opportunity?)


"GOOD CHOICES"--I made em most of the time, screwed up royally a couple times, but I can't complain--nobody's perfect. Get knocked down, get back up. If it doesn't work, change it. You can get so preoccupied with a grudge--with an agenda, that it handicaps you. Sounds like some of these guys are all but totally signing off. Quitting.  No wonder porn's a billion dollar industry.

[Calipro]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/living-single/202008/half-singles-don-t-want-relationship-or-even-date

[Elexpatriado]

https://sunrisehoodie.wordpress.com/2018/07/26/mgtow-some-men-are-a-plane-ticket-abroad/

https://mgtowmonks.wordpress.com/2018/10/03/foreign-women-are-not-the-answer-nafwalt/

https://www.mgtow.com/forums/topic/foreign-women/

I spent 3 years in KSA and I sure wouldnt want to be a womean living there permanently!!


But then, neither would I want to be a man living there permanently.

Thank God Ihave a passport that lets me go anywhere I want!!

[Elexpatriado]

https://youtu.be/71o3hq6iSPM

Dating guru spells it out to a group of women. And this is MGTOW light.

It is called reciprocation or in Spanish, correspondencia


And it has nothing to do with money.

In Colombia. the Philipines,  or  anywhere else, a woman could be earning 5% of what you earn and contribute nothing financially , but could show her class,  respect and love in other ways..


And I am not talking just sexually..

[Elexpatriado]

Believe it or not, Colombia has its own MGTOW group..


https://www.facebook.com/pages/category/Community/MGTOW-Colombia-1066328323396028/

[robert angel]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/living-single/202008/half-singles-don-t-want-relationship-or-even-date

That's an interesting article and while an approx 5000 person sample isn't that huge, the Pew Research Center is pretty legit.


It seems from the article--more precisely from the results cited, that a lot of people are choosing to stay 'out of the game.'


I think everybody has a different idea of what constitutes not just their idea of 'happiness' but also to what extent that happiness involves other people.

[Elexpatriado]

That's an interesting article and while an approx 5000 person sample isn't that huge, the Pew Research Center is pretty legit.


It seems from the article--more precisely from the results cited, that a lot of people are choosing to stay 'out of the game.'




I can see why men of any age would  maybe be interested in at least a physical relationship but uninterested in Marraige...


Seems a lot of older women are uninterested.

I wonder how cat food stocks are doing these days?


I think everybody has a different idea of what constitutes not just their idea of 'happiness' but also to what extent that happiness involves other people.

[robert angel]

That's an interesting article and while an approx 5000 person sample isn't that huge, the Pew Research Center is pretty legit.


It seems from the article--more precisely from the results cited, that a lot of people are choosing to stay 'out of the game.'


I think everybody has a different idea of what constitutes not just their idea of 'happiness' but also to what extent that happiness involves other people.

This my latest idea of adding to my, more accurately, to 'our' happiness and it involves TWO people, both helping out (financially too) in many ways. So what if the other person is my wife, who's from another country.


Anyway, we have a bid in on this property. Six championship golf courses, two marinas, thirty some miles of nature and biking trails and more on an 8 by 3 mile long island, attached to the Atlantic coast by one bridge with two 24X7 manned security gates on 'the other side'. Plenty of room for privacy or the 'club life'--memberships etc--that's not our style.


We just want especially with her working from home, for us both to feel relaxed and unstressed, able to work or whatever, with a view. We want a house that we'll keep for a while, Hiking and biking are just extras.


If we can't make the world go away, we can make our own world more ideal.



https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/4-Woodard-Ln-Savannah-GA-31411/14134607_zpid/


Skidaway Island, Georgia - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skidaway_Island,_Georgia

[robert angel]

https://sunrisehoodie.wordpress.com/2018/07/26/mgtow-some-men-are-a-plane-ticket-abroad/

https://mgtowmonks.wordpress.com/2018/10/03/foreign-women-are-not-the-answer-nafwalt/

https://www.mgtow.com/forums/topic/foreign-women/

There's a lot of 'layers of the onion' on this MGTOW topic, movement--whatever it is. But looking at the above links, and at what little other info I've gathered here and there,  I see a lot of guys putting limiters on themselves and choosing to stay on the sidelines, whining and complaining as the game goes on regardless.


While I don't recall any precise figures, I don't think the divorce rate for guys who marry a woman from abroad is any higher than the abysmal 50%+ mark often bandied about for USA 'domestic content' marriages.


I think the rate of failed marriages, as well as those who've withdrawn from dating, are just two 'misery index indicators' of domestic life in any given nation.


You gotta play to win--no risk no gain.


These guys would probably think I'm insane putting a penny extra more than my partner into a house, because the REAL house--the USA domestic culture, is running the 'game'--> the rules of dating, marriage and divorce--and those rules don't favor guys--after all, they know (or feel that) "The house ALWAYS wins."


For Me--as long as the woman's a sport on giving everything--->mind, body and purse, I'm OK. If she's holding out, playing coy or sly--has an 'agenda'--I'm simply not her guy. I need a woman who's smart enough to follow my lead, yet smart enough to know when stepping in is called for. "Balance" Took me a little while to figure that part out--to feel I knew --that I could gauge if a woman's actual (current) behavior was likely to match her future behavior and likely intentions/designs down the line.


Nothing's written in stone and people can and do change--the USA has a lot of crazy influences for sure, but you take your chances. Nothing lasts forever. What we have today can be gone tomorrow, but I'm not gonna be pissy or negative and predict it's gonna go south. The sky is NOT falling, chicken little.


I have protections in my mind for the possible advent of mental and financial ruin, but I am not going to let those 'precautions' guide how I perceive and deal with male--female relations now in the USA--or any place. I've been burned bad, learned and realize while it could happen again, I'm better prepared and more focused on living (enjoying) life in the here and now.


So in their eager to predict doom eyes, to go for "A" is not only highly likely to turn into a "B" as in BAD, but they're so pissed off at the mere thought of playing (paying?) into the "A game" and a perceived lack of fairness (equality?) therein,  that they're quitting w/o trying or being half assed and playing the A game with a giant chip on their shoulders. God forbid these guys get to a 'C' and 'D'...


Is this a male version of feminism??? Wimpism? Posturing?


If they're in 'B mode'-pity the quitting fools-- but that leaves more women of all shapes, colors, cultures and sizes for Me.


Curse the situation, but you're in it. It is what it is and you might as well make the most of it, Or you can curse the game, take your ball and mitt and go home.


These guys are soooo much more into the 'me' rather than the 'we' that they can barely contain themselves from cursing life outside their self imposed 'me existence.'


Sounds pretty bitter and lonely to me.

I'm still taking chances.

[robert angel]

There's a lot of 'layers of the onion' on this MGTOW topic, movement--whatever it is. But looking at the above links, and at what little other info I've gathered here and there,  I see a lot of guys putting limiters on themselves and choosing to stay on the sidelines, whining and complaining as the game goes on regardless.


While I don't recall any precise figures, I don't think the divorce rate for guys who marry a woman from abroad is any higher than the abysmal 50%+ mark often bandied about for USA 'domestic content' marriages.


I think the rate of failed marriages, as well as those who've withdrawn from dating, are just two 'misery index indicators' of domestic life in any given nation.


You gotta play to win--no risk no gain.


These guys would probably think I'm insane putting a penny extra more than my partner into a house, because the REAL house--the USA domestic culture, is running the 'game'--> the rules of dating, marriage and divorce--and those rules don't favor guys--after all, they know (or feel that) "The house ALWAYS wins."


For Me--as long as the woman's a sport on giving everything--->mind, body and purse, I'm OK. If she's holding out, playing coy or sly--has an 'agenda'--I'm simply not her guy. I need a woman who's smart enough to follow my lead, yet smart enough to know when stepping in is called for. "Balance" Took me a little while to figure that part out--to feel I knew --that I could gauge if a woman's actual (current) behavior was likely to match her future behavior and likely intentions/designs down the line.


Nothing's written in stone and people can and do change--the USA has a lot of crazy influences for sure, but you take your chances. Nothing lasts forever. What we have today can be gone tomorrow, but I'm not gonna be pissy or negative and predict it's gonna go south. The sky is NOT falling, chicken little.


I have protections in my mind for the possible advent of mental and financial ruin, but I am not going to let those 'precautions' guide how I perceive and deal with male--female relations now in the USA--or any place. I've been burned bad, learned and realize while it could happen again, I'm better prepared and more focused on living (enjoying) life in the here and now.


So in their eager to predict doom eyes, to go for "A" is not only highly likely to turn into a "B" as in BAD, but they're so pissed off at the mere thought of playing (paying?) into the "A game" and a perceived lack of fairness (equality?) therein,  that they're quitting w/o trying or being half assed and playing the A game with a giant chip on their shoulders. God forbid these guys get to a 'C' and 'D'...


Is this a male version of feminism??? Wimpism? Posturing?


If they're in 'B mode'-pity the quitting fools-- but that leaves more women of all shapes, colors, cultures and sizes for Me.


Curse the situation, but you're in it. It is what it is and you might as well make the most of it, Or you can curse the game, take your ball and mitt and go home.


These guys are soooo much more into the 'me' rather than the 'we' that they can barely contain themselves from cursing life outside their self imposed 'me existence.'


Sounds pretty bitter and lonely to me.

I'm still taking chances.

It's real easy for me to go hard on these guys, basically as I've got a pretty good long term situation going. Mine is far from the norm--whatever the 'norm' is for any age group. I've seen the world through some pretty tasty rose colored glasses for a while now~done been, am being 'spoiled.'


Most guys here are around age 50 or 60. If any us in that age range was suddenly single in the USA and starting from scratch, it'd seriously suck the moose. Might drive me to rat poison.


That said--I still wouldn't quit 'the chase.' There's a kazillion single women with on-line profiles within a 2 hour drive. In my silly experiment a while back, while I never chatted or replied to letters but just one doll--great pics,-profile--wrote me 150 letters. Tons--young, old, hotties and Polly Annas....But I'd look in my area for starters, but think I'd inevitably go back overseas. After doing my homework online.


But call it dating, I think a term: 'the culture of social dynamics for singles 2020' covers it--but it probably sucks worse than ever for the USA Male.


It's way beyond 'metoo' or 'politically correct'. No, it sucks to have to figuratively feel like you're 'walking on eggshells'--that your words may be untended negative triggers,


But it is what it is. Deal with it, Don't be a quitter.


Sounds like there a bit of overly 'me centric] and selfishness on both sides here.


To me, one plus one adds up to more than two almost all the time...


 

[robert angel]

Because they refuse to go out of their way to get laid. They refuse to pick up the tab....they refuse to get married and they refuse to do anything extra.... because... well women are equal to men now.

Succinctly expressed.


I can see refusing some things based on 'principle' but it sounds like some of these guys would cut off their leg to save an infected toe, 'out of principle"


And according to whom you ask, beyond in general some think women are not just equal to men--that they are in fact superior to the male.


Tell Samson to ask Delilah, but as I recall, we've been beating around this bush quite a while now.


Furthermore, that based on past male behavior, I think it almost seems that reparations are in order for ALL males to pay for any, shall we say "indiscretions'? previous male generations committed. I was raised as a gentleman, as are my sons--they're sports, not suckers--but I think we've been pretty good for womankind--pulling off our half rather well.


The day it became socially inappropriate for me to tell a woman "That's a pretty dress" at work or to accept a hug from kid--really basic human interaction, my world changed for the worse.

[robert angel]

Don't think the MGTOW crew would be too supportive of this endeavor:


https://thesugardaddyformula.com/sugar-daddy-formula-books/

[mambocowboy]

Don't think the MGTOW crew would be too supportive of this endeavor:


https://thesugardaddyformula.com/sugar-daddy-formula-books/

If I were single now or any point in the future I'd be looking in poor countries where my odds are better. I like p---y way to much to go mgtow.

[robert angel]

If I were single now or any point in the future I'd be looking in poor countries where my odds are better. I like p---y way to much to go mgtow.

Amen. The upfront (travel, legal etc) costs are higher, the logistics and time required greater. But yeah, I still think the odds are better on a number of fronts.

[benjio]

If I were single now or any point in the future I'd be looking in poor countries where my odds are better. I like p---y way to much to go mgtow.

Exactly. The movement mainly consist of men who haven’t had it so long they’ve forgotten. Quite sad if you asks me.