Living / Doing Business in Colombia?

[Brazilophile]

I just read an article about country rankings for technical innovation.  Latin America doesn't fare well.  The article suggests that the world's strongest economies will be those that innovate the most.  I am pasting part of the article below.  My question is for those who spend a lot of time in Colombia.  To what degree to you see "on the ground" what the article talks about?  (The author is Andres Oppenheimer.)

The ranking takes into account not only countries’ new patent registrations — an area in which the United States leads the pack — but also investments in research and development, and whether their business and regulatory climates are conducive to inventions with business potential.
Among the study’s data:
• No Latin American country, with the exception of Chile, ranks among the world’s 50 innovation leaders.
•  Chile ranked 39th in the world, while Brazil ranked 58th, Colombia 65th, Uruguay 67th, Argentina 70th, Peru 75th, Guyana 77th, Paraguay 84th, Bolivia 114th and Venezuela 118th. Chile “shows strengths across the board,” with the exception of primary and secondary education expenditures and student-teacher ratios.
•  Brazil, despite benefitting from changes in the way the ranking was made this year, lost 9 positions from last year’s index. The reason was Brazil’s “particularly worrisome” business environment, university education and credit conditions.
•  Venezuela has been steadily losing ground in recent years, and its 118th position this year is near the bottom of the world ranking, below Zimbabwe, Lesotho and Uganda.
•  A sub-index that divides the world among innovation “leaders,” “learners” and “underperformers,” according to countries’ per capita income levels and efforts to improve their innovation standings, places Switzerland, northern European countries, New Zealand and Israel among the “leaders.”
•  The group of “innovation learners” includes China, India, Vietnam and Ghana, with Chile listed in a grey area close to them. The group of “innovation underperformers” includes Mexico, Argentina, Ecuador and Venezuela.

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/08/11/2944923/latin-america-gets-bad-marks-in.html#storylink=cpy

[Brazilophile]

It seems this topic is not very popular.  I posted it because I am interested in doing business in South America. 

[Calipro]

It seems this topic is not very popular.  I posted it because I am interested in doing business in South America.

I'm interested in living and doing business in Colombia....the article is irrelevant to any business models I would be interested in.


This guy does a very good business and it is something that can be replicated in other cities.


http://theapartmentmedellin.com/

[Jamie]

I have some ideas I hope to develop, but a potential business opportunity for others would be setting up nursing homes for Americans. I would assume the "patient" cost to be less than half of what you would pay in the U.S. There are good locations in Colombia where the elderly can experience nature, a modern life and good basic health care. I assume this is a growing market with the baby boomers retiring and the most difficult part would be attracting clients, but with some study there may be some good options for doing that.

[Calipro]

I have some ideas I hope to develop, but a potential business opportunity for others would be setting up nursing homes for Americans. I would assume the "patient" cost to be less than half of what you would pay in the U.S. There are good locations in Colombia where the elderly can experience nature, a modern life and good basic health care. I assume this is a growing market with the baby boomers retiring and the most difficult part would be attracting clients, but with some study there may be some good options for doing that.

I think the idea has potential....one of my ex's best friends worked in a nursing home in Cali and I was surprised to find out that there were a number of elderly Europeans living there....I think selling the idea to Americans would be a bit harder.

[Zon]

yep - Colombia is much different than stereotypes. Obviously, it is one of my favorite places.  But, the history and impression among Americans t is very strong and negative.


I tried the DR for a month 2 years ago, that was before I had basic negotiating skills in Spanish.  The DR is closer, same time zone, cheap / easy to travel, friendly, and with a stable legal foundation.  PLUS, it is the best place I know of where a gringo has a fair shot.  The trap doors in Costa Rica, Panama, and Colombia for conducting business / tax implications greater than 7 years ... it is very challenging. 


Being pragmatic, I am planning on giving the Dominican Republic another try.

[Frank Rizzo]

omg...

[Fuzzyone]

    Yea I can see it now hey mom you cost to much I am sending you to Colombia to a nursing home down there I can save half the cost of warehousing you there! Don't worry when I come to see you I can make it two for one and whore around at the same time!

[Calipro]

    Yea I can see it now hey mom you cost to much I am sending you to Colombia to a nursing home down there I can save half the cost of warehousing you there! Don't worry when I come to see you I can make it two for one and whore around at the same time!

I always heard that Jamie was an honest man with a decent marriage agency. Do you really think he'd use that line as one of his selling points?

[Hector_Lavoe]

This guy does a very good business and it is something that can be replicated in other cities.

http://theapartmentmedellin.com/

Interesting website and business model.  The owner is Australian. The website says he started investing in Medellin in 2005.   
Can a foreign national easily invest in an apartment or hotel in Colombia without any major hurdles or title issues? or was this guy possibly married to a Colombiana before he jumped in the Medellin real estate game?

[Calipro]

Interesting website and business model.  The owner is Australian. The website says he started investing in Medellin in 2005.   
Can a foreign national easily invest in an apartment or hotel in Colombia without any major hurdles or title issues? or was this guy possibly married to a Colombiana before he jumped in the Medellin real estate game?

The guy is married to a colombiana...but any visa that is good for a year or more will allow you to get a cedula and once you have a cedula you will be legally able to sign any contract...including real estate contracts.


You could still do it with just a passport but you used to have a Colombian sign the contract on your behalf. But I think times are a changing....I have a friend that signed a lease in Cali with only his passport and had it notarized. I would check to see it that is legit or not.


But I know things have gotten easier to legalize money that is brought into the country for foreign investment since I bought my apartment years ago.


The guy owns TheApartmentMedellin does not own the apartments he rents...but rather subleases them to Americans.  Doesn't take that much money to start a business like that.

[QRCAP2012]

IMHO the idea to provide retirement housing, including nursing home care, for Americans and Europeans is valid. The medical care and other costs of living in Colombia are substantially less than in some other countries. The climate is a reason for some people to want to come here. I don't think of it so much as a place to warehouse your parents, but I think of it as a place for aging boomers such as myself to establish themselves in a community with the eventual plan of moving to a long term care facility. I am certainly curious where i will wind up once I am no longer able to live on my own. The thought of going into a nursing home in the US doesn't thrill me, but I would be open to the idea of a nursing home here in Colombia. maybe the idea will get some traction and start to happen. I also hope these planned peace talks with the three big rebel groups here come to fruition, it will help offset the perception that Colombia is dangerous. The aforementioned Dominican Republic also has some possibiltiies, especially since it is closer to US and easier to retire. The other idea in this thread, about sub leasing apartments is valid, too, keeping in mind that it is just like any other business, inasmuch as you have to deal with customers, and we all know how fussy US customers can be:)

[Fuzzyone]

I always heard that Jamie was an honest man with a decent marriage agency. Do you really think he'd use that line as one of his selling points?

   Naww I think he would have already trademarked the line in question right?

[Jamie]

As I noted, it is not an idea I plan on pursuing, I just threw it out as a possible option for others. I hope I never have to live in a retirement home, but out of necessity some do. And like or not Fuzzyone, cost is a factor for some families who are unable to care for their relatives. I think one point of research could be what percentage of the elderly that live in retirement homes are in close proximity to family members. If this is a critical requirement for a large majority of the users of retirement homes to be close to their family then you have a tougher sell (can video cams help). Also what percentage of the elderly in retirement homes don't have family where care and cost only mater. Any new business requires a lot of research, I am amazed at how many people start businesses without any research. Good ideas are not difficult to come by, you can steal good ideas. The difficult part is making the idea profitable. The entrepreneur looks for ways to make the idea work, the non-entrepreneur looks for ways to dismiss it.

[Hector_Lavoe]

The guy is married to a colombiana...but any visa that is good for a year or more will allow you to get a cedula and once you have a cedula you will be legally able to sign any contract...including real estate contracts.


You could still do it with just a passport but you used to have a Colombian sign the contract on your behalf. But I think times are a changing....I have a friend that signed a lease in Cali with only his passport and had it notarized. I would check to see it that is legit or not.


But I know things have gotten easier to legalize money that is brought into the country for foreign investment since I bought my apartment years ago.


The guy owns TheApartmentMedellin does not own the apartments he rents...but rather subleases them to Americans.  Doesn't take that much money to start a business like that.

Thanks for the clarification. I had missed that last point.

[Hector_Lavoe]

Any new business requires a lot of research, I am amazed at how many people start businesses without any research. Good ideas are not difficult to come by, you can steal good ideas. The difficult part is making the idea profitable. The entrepreneur looks for ways to make the idea work, the non-entrepreneur looks for ways to dismiss it.

Jamie: Do you mind if I ask if you own the house in Barranqilla where your agency is housed?  And if you do own it, did you purchase it BEFORE you were married to a Colombiana?

[TheLoveMachine]

Great idea Jamie, I could definitely see a market for that type of care.  It would create jobs and prices wouldn't be as extravagant as they are in the US.  I like it...

[Zon]

Be sure to look "Down the Road" ... if you are moving a decent amount of money in business, you will stick out like a sore thumb.   Once you are on the radar screen, you will not get off.  There are some very disadvantageous laws in place after the 7th year, so be sophisticated from the outset.

[Jamie]

Jamie: Do you mind if I ask if you own the house in Barranqilla where your agency is housed?  And if you do own it, did you purchase it BEFORE you were married to a Colombiana?

No I do not own property in Barranquilla. You can protect your property even if you purchase after marriage to a Colombian.

[htown]

Be sure to look "Down the Road" ... if you are moving a decent amount of money in business, you will stick out like a sore thumb.   Once you are on the radar screen, you will not get off.  There are some very disadvantageous laws in place after the 7th year, so be sophisticated from the outset.

Reminds me of a discussion I remember about doing business in russia.  The russians love for a foreigner to come invest and get a good business going, then once it´s making money the mafia comes in and muscles you out of it.  I have no idea if that´s true but I wouldn´t be surprised.

[benjio]

Reminds me of a discussion I remember about doing business in russia.  The russians love for a foreigner to come invest and get a good business going, then once it´s making money the mafia comes in and muscles you out of it.  I have no idea if that´s true but I wouldn´t be surprised.

The Russian Mafia's extortion practices are a very real thing in the United States, so I can't even imagine how bad things can be for a foreign business owner in Russia. A very good friend of mine in NYC owns a clothing shop in Harlem. Since the RICO Act was passed and numerous Federal Law Enforcement Agencies made it their mission to completely eradicate La Cosa Nostra, Russian Criminal Organizations have slowly began to fill the extortion and racketeering voids on the East Coast. My friend tells me many long time business owners in NYC actually miss the Italians. Extortion by the original Italian Mafia usually didn't go as far as bankrupting a business, and it almost always meant a business was actually "protected." When violence was deemed necessary, it was usually only directed towards rival mafia members. And even if they rough up a local business owner, they wouldn't go after his wife or children. The Russians don't care. They extort until you can't give anymore. They kill wives and children when they finally figure out you can't. Then they finally kill you when there's nothing else left to do. The Italian Mob was nonetheless horrible, but definitely the lesser of two evils. Criminal Organizations are a horrible reality in the world we live in. But traditionally, they are usually the direct result of oppresive governments. When a country's population doesn't trust the government to police and protect them, organizations of this nature evolve. Many were initially established to protect people that had no way of protecting themselves. But their propensity to use violence to earn money and demonstrate power eventually corrupts them; as it does with governments that use the same methods of terror to control people. In many cases members are former elite military personnel that are at odds with the governments of their native lands, making them even more dangerous.
 
With that being said, during all my travels to Colombia, and with all the "shady" characters I've met, I've never heard of any seriously organized attempt at extortion of businesses there. This definitely isn't to say that things like this don't go on. Perhaps in Medellin. I wouldn't know. In Barranquilla, in a barrio called La Paz, there is a street lined with tons of clothing and toy stores, fast food restaurants, and bars. I've heard stories of a local gang trying to extort business owners there in the past, but I think this was shut down very fast by the police.
 
Being extorted by a criminal organization wouldn't be my primary concern if I were running a business in Colombia...even with me being a gringo. It's much more likely that your employees will be the people taking money from you.

[benjio]

With that being said, during all my travels to Colombia, and with all the "shady" characters I've met, I've never heard of any seriously organized attempt at extortion of businesses there. This definitely isn't to say that things like this don't go on. Perhaps in Medellin. I wouldn't know. In Barranquilla, in a barrio called La Paz, there is a street lined with tons of clothing and toy stores, fast food restaurants, and bars. I've heard stories of a local gang trying to extort business owners there in the past, but I think this was shut down very fast by the police.
 

Decided to do a Google search after my post...interesting stuff. Learn something new everyday.
 
http://www.insightcrime.org/insight-latest-news/item/1479-micro-extortion-fills-pockets-of-colombia-gangs

[michaelb]

 My friend tells me many long time business owners in NYC actually miss the Italians. Extortion by the original Italian Mafia usually didn't go as far as bankrupting a business, and it almost always meant a business was actually "protected."   

A wise parasite does not kill its host.

[Calipro]

A wise parasite does not kill its host.

Not always the case.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/24/bain-capital-tony-soprano_n_1542249.html