Needle in a Haystack

[Researcher]

        Just my two cents but there are those here who imply an educated woman would make a better wife. That is simply not true. Now,for me, I used to think the same until I married one. One of the things I learned from that mistake was 1) What I really like is an intelligent woman 2) Educated does not always equal intelligent. I will say that a college would have been an excellent place for me to find my preference but that was just one thing I liked. It wasn't the be all and end all for me. And to be honest all this talk about "class systems" in relation to a woman's "worthiness" as a wife does seem like snobbery. Some will deny this is the case but remember I said "seem like".


          Researcher

     

[Jeff S]

OK Maritime, I'll come out and say EXACTLY what I mean.

You get to pick whoever you want to marry and I get to pick whoever I want to marry. I don't give a rat's azz who or how you pick yours. It sure seems to irritate the snot out of you that I didn't use the same set of standards that you did, but you know, again, I don't care.

[robert angel]

        Just my two cents but there are those here who imply an educated woman would make a better wife. That is simply not true. Now,for me, I used to think the same until I married one. One of the things I learned from that mistake was 1) What I really like is an intelligent woman
2) Educated does not always equal intelligent. I will say that a college would have been an excellent place for me to find my preference but that was just one thing I liked. It wasn't the be all and end all for me. And to be honest all this talk about "class systems" in relation to a woman's "worthiness" as a wife does seem like snobbery. Some will deny this is the case but remember I said "seem like".


          Researcher

     

I have to agree here. Educated does not always mean intelligent and education doesn't necessarily make someone a better spouse.
 
 
I just ran into an old girlfriend Sunday who works for Gulfstream Aerospace, drawing the electric schematics for jets that cost upwards to 70 million US dollars each. She came over as a young child from Vietnam. Her family had worked with the USA govt. during the war and they escaped the communist regime, sailing at great peril in an overloaded makeshift boat to the Philippines.
 
 
Although she still speaks with an accent, she is as patriotic and American as anyone I've ever met--and her politics make Beck and Limbaugh look liberal. She came from a very poor, simple upbringing, but with great work ethic, a thirst for knowledge and desire to be successful.
 
 

She was hired 25 years ago with just a high school diploma and having demonstrated her high intelligence, a gift for technical drawing and perhaps most importantly, her thirst for knowledge, she was eventually considered as and paid as an Electrical Engineer. Most people there work four days a week, ten hours a day--they often ask her to work five and even six days--her work is exceptional.
 
 

Different era, but my Grandparents on my Mom's side came from rural Ireland and never completed high school. They encounterd things like signs that read "Help wanted--NO Irish need apply". They were the most completely self educated people I ever have known--well versed in Math, the Arts, Sciences and above all in grammar and literature. For FUN, they would come to our house and read the Encyclopedia Britanica Scientifca from A to Z. In her 90's my Grandmother was still doing the NY Times and London Times crossword puzzle in INK, w/o any reference books.
 
 

Their children, my Aunts and Uncles, had the benefit of being allowed a formal education and became things like Doctors, Nuclear Engineers and upper lever business executives, but to a one, they never felt that their formal education made them better than anyone else.
 
 
My wife's upbringing was quite simple--to be honest, in a word, she was 'unsophisticated'. She read all the books, but there just weren't a lot of books around her village and certainly no library. She's gifted in Math though and earned a five year bachelors degree/s in both hard and software computer engineering, got an Internship w/ Cocal Cola and after she graduated, they hired her.
 
 
When she came to the USA, she felt a bit like a fish out of water. Stores with books and magazines that people could actually sit and read--never mind libraries, were foriegn to her. She reads all kinds of books and magazines and in many respects regarding 'intellectual' thinking, she has become much more 'sophisticated'. I saw in her all along that this would probably be the case and that she'd  grow in such a way.

[Jeff S]

Neither me or anyone else on this board have EVER said that uneducated = unintelligent or that uneducated = bad spouse. Nor have I ever said that educated = good spouse.

On the other hand many have said that educated automatically = bad spouse. Which is completely false.

[robert angel]

Neither me or anyone else on this board have EVER said that uneducated = unintelligent or that uneducated = bad spouse. Nor have I ever said that educated = good spouse.

On the other hand many have said that educated automatically = bad spouse. Which is completely false.

Jeff--I know you haven't equated uneducated with 'bad spouse' or 'bad choice'. Many posts, especially lately, seem to be misconstrued around here. I think that overall, your reasoning is quite sound. It's all about personal choice--how YOU choose to make YOUR own decisions.  I don't feel that you remotely come off as dictating or insinuating that others should follow your tack.
 
We do reasonably have to have standards--things--parameters--rules, if you will, that guide us in choosing what kind of person we hope to make our 'significant other' in life. After all, you might be with her a while and any which way, the consequences are serious. But ultimately it's a custom fit for everyone, from start to finish.
 
Personally, I tried not to be too narrow in what I was looking for in a wife, but like most people, I did have some 'deal breakers'--non negotiable things. I did go outside by age range a bit, with somebody younger and also prettier than I initially planned, but after knowing her about ten years and going on 7 years of marriage now, I guess I'm learning to live with those 'mistakes' surprisingly well. Only time will tell...

[Ray]

 
 
 
     
 
 
 
 

[InnocentVixen]

On the other hand many have said that educated automatically = bad spouse. Which is completely false.

I agree with this, it is borderline frustrating to hear those kinds of comments so often and I don't even fit into the "educated" category so it's not personal, perhaps it has much to do with the fact that men get intimidated, it is bad enough you are going to a place where you think women are sensual goddesses of beauty but to find out they know how put that pretty head to use other than to fix their hair is a scary thought. I've said it before, you guys don't give yourself enough credit.


It always make me smile when whitey says he was intimidated by Nazly when he found out she owned property, I don't know if it is an american saying but I once heard something among the lines of "if you find a woman that is too good for you, marry her"

[Researcher]

Neither me or anyone else on this board have EVER said that uneducated = unintelligent or that uneducated = bad spouse. Nor have I ever said that educated = good spouse.

On the other hand many have said that educated automatically = bad spouse. Which is completely false.

    I agree. Both are false as is with the notion of a person's class means anything. These things are just what someone prefers and has nothing to do with what kind of spouse a person will be so why is it even mentioed at all? I think it is because guys try and generalize to try and find the "magic formula" for finding a wife. Truth is it takes good judgement bottom line.

           Researcher

[V_Man]

    I agree. Both are false as is with the notion of a person's class means anything. These things are just what someone prefers and has nothing to do with what kind of spouse a person will be so why is it even mentioed at all? I think it is because guys try and generalize to try and find the "magic formula" for finding a wife. Truth is it takes good judgement bottom line.

           Researcher

I basically agree with Researcher. There are some things that stand out to me though.
I don't see anything wrong with trying to increase your odds of success.

I see guys dating a girl 20 years younger than them, from a poor barrio who has little education. Fundamentally it is true that none of these things tell me what sort of wife she will be. However I am also not surprised they have problems. Her life is a long, long way from his life.
Hence although these aspects don't tell you if she would be a good wife for somebody, one should be asking one's self if it is one bridge too far in these circumstances.

Each to their own of course but I note that Jeff S wrote:

In the 12 years, I've been hanging around and contributing here, I've seen hundreds of guys come and go - some successful, some not. It's interesting that those who stick around for some time and seem to be happily married are often married to educated, professional women - nurses, engineers, businesspeople, artists, writers, and so on, both from Asia and Latin America. I can't recall one of the many horror stories over the past dozen years, like the new one just posted in the last couple of days, where the woman was an educated professional.

In no way does being an educated professional qualify anyone to be good wife material. The point is that someone who is good wife material AND is an educated professional of some kind has better odds in this endevour.

Ultimately it does come down to good judgement and values of course.

For me personally, I want a wife with a good attitude to education and it really doesn't matter to me what other guys are looking for.

[Researcher]

Ultimately it does come down to good judgement and values of course.

For me personally, I want a wife with a good attitude to education and it really doesn't matter to me what other guys are looking for.

      Of course VMan. Good judgement goes a long way in the endeavor. The rest comes down to preference. I know that some here try and attribute success of finding a good spouse to this or that but they don't offer one shred of proof there is a direct correlation between success and what they attribute the success to. One thing I've learned is that in life if you don't have good judgement then you'd better be damn lucky.

            Researcher

[Bob_S]

[]
The value of a woman with a demonstrated education:
For most of us, the ultimate goal was or is to find a woman, make her our wife, and bring her into our world.  Not all of us are fortunate enough to be able to move to her land and enter into her world, nor are most of us in a situation where we live in an ethnic neighborhood where our future wife can live in a bubble of people from back home, where all the neighbors, shopkeepers, signs, and publications are predominately in her language.  For most of our wives, they will be thrown into a brave new world where they will be a stranger in a strange land.  As such, they either need to be equipped to hit the ground running when they arrive or have the capacity to quickly adapt.

It has been suggested that you can just teach her what she needs to know.  Well, no.  That is bad.  Here's why.  When you become her teacher, you change the dynamic of your relationship from Man/Woman or Husband/Wife into one of Teacher/Student or Parent/Child.  That is very destructive to your relationship over the long haul.  Of course there are some things you will need to teach her simply because our system of laws and finance is different.  You may need to explain the difference between a credit card and a debit card.  You'll need to show her how to write a check.  For my wife, I needed to teach her how to drive on the right (she already had a driver's license but had spent years driving on the left {I still have flashbacks over that episode}).  But the more you have to teach her, the longer you will stay in a Parent/Child role, and it is the ultimate fate of all children that they should grow and eventually rebel against and leave their parent or teacher.  So, for a wife that you plan to bring to your country, you need someone who is a quick study, eager to learn, ready to adapt, and self-motivated so she can learn as much as possible on her own (or with a teacher other than you).

So when you are searching for a potential wife, how can you judge if a woman is a quick study, eager to learn, ready to adapt, and self-motivated?  Well, one obvious clue would be that she has completed or is currently engaged in some form of post-secondary education.  It is not the only way, and it certainly doesn't guarantee a woman who will make a good wife.  For an older woman, you can see how accomplished she is in her life with or without such education, is she self-made, well managed in her life, and capable of facing the challenges of her world's complexities.  But a lot of you guys are not going for an older accomplished woman.  You want the hot young thangs who've most likely not accomplished anything in life yet.  Therefore, lacking any further evidence of her capability to learn and adapt, a college education (which is achieved by choice, not legal compulsion) is a good indicator that she has an inner quality that will help ensure she will not get crippling homesickness as soon as she arrives in your home country.

Now, if your plan is to ultimately emigrate to her country, go native and become a permanent expat, then the above doesn't apply.  You will find plenty of women will little or no education who are decent good women and will make wonderful wives as long as they stay within their own environment.  But how many of us truly plan to live in that world?
[/]
 

[benjio]

[]
The value of a woman with a demonstrated education:
For most of us, the ultimate goal was or is to find a woman, make her our wife, and bring her into our world.  Not all of us are fortunate enough to be able to move to her land and enter into her world, nor are most of us in a situation where we live in an ethnic neighborhood where our future wife can live in a bubble of people from back home, where all the neighbors, shopkeepers, signs, and publications are predominately in her language.  For most of our wives, they will be thrown into a brave new world where they will be a stranger in a strange land.  As such, they either need to be equipped to hit the ground running when they arrive or have the capacity to quickly adapt.

It has been suggested that you can just teach her what she needs to know.  Well, no.  That is bad.  Here's why.  When you become her teacher, you change the dynamic of your relationship from Man/Woman or Husband/Wife into one of Teacher/Student or Parent/Child.  That is very destructive to your relationship over the long haul.  Of course there are some things you will need to teach her simply because our system of laws and finance is different.  You may need to explain the difference between a credit card and a debit card.  You'll need to show her how to write a check.  For my wife, I needed to teach her how to drive on the right (she already had a driver's license but had spent years driving on the left {I still have flashbacks over that episode}).  But the more you have to teach her, the longer you will stay in a Parent/Child role, and it is the ultimate fate of all children that they should grow and eventually rebel against and leave their parent or teacher.  So, for a wife that you plan to bring to your country, you need someone who is a quick study, eager to learn, ready to adapt, and self-motivated so she can learn as much as possible on her own (or with a teacher other than you).

So when you are searching for a potential wife, how can you judge if a woman is a quick study, eager to learn, ready to adapt, and self-motivated?  Well, one obvious clue would be that she has completed or is currently engaged in some form of post-secondary education.  It is not the only way, and it certainly doesn't guarantee a woman who will make a good wife.  For an older woman, you can see how accomplished she is in her life with or without such education, is she self-made, well managed in her life, and capable of facing the challenges of her world's complexities.  But a lot of you guys are not going for an older accomplished woman.  You want the hot young thangs who've most likely not accomplished anything in life yet.  Therefore, lacking any further evidence of her capability to learn and adapt, a college education (which is achieved by choice, not legal compulsion) is a good indicator that she has an inner quality that will help ensure she will not get crippling homesickness as soon as she arrives in your home country.

Now, if your plan is to ultimately emigrate to her country, go native and become a permanent expat, then the above doesn't apply.  You will find plenty of women will little or no education who are decent good women and will make wonderful wives as long as they stay within their own environment.  But how many of us truly plan to live in that world?
[/]

Excellent post! This is something I've attempted to reiterate on this board numerous times, but I lacked your "eloquent" touch Bob.

[Bob_S]

Excellent post! This is something I've attempted to reiterate on this board numerous times, but I lacked your "eloquent" touch Bob.

Thanks.  I've been knocking around the idea of how to say it for a while.  But then Maritime went and had his tantrum and I sort of lost the motivation to engage this topic.  But I just had to get it out there, especially for the handful of newbies who've recently joined and are just starting their search.  Maybe they'll read it and take away something they can use.