What comes next after the divorce?

[JWR]

Chameleon,
 
These international women are expensive from day 1 til the end.  It's just the nature of the beast.  She didn't try to take advantage of me, but I've also been generous all along.  Of course now that she's making good money for the 1st time since we've been married, I am not in a position to enjoy any of it.  Dating internationally, and marrying one of these girls is a bad idea, with too many possible bad outcomes, but the alternative is I guess worse.
 
 

[Chris F]

I stayed in Barranquilla, and I just don't like this city for several reasons.  I dated some, but really didn't find any girls that I liked much.  With more time, that would most likely change, but I would not go back to BQ. 
 

Sorry to ask again JWR but you really have not stated why exactly you did not like living there. Could you go into more detail?

[maritime04]

"Dating internationally, and marrying one of these girls is a bad idea, with too many possible bad outcomes, but the alternative is I guess worse."
 
You could say the same thing about dating and marriage with anyone, its a risk period.
 
I enjoy the time alone, no captain, no bull[snip], if the moon is out its quite nice. you get plenty of time to reflect. plus your traveling, currently i am going no where litterally.
 
whats the alternative? diying alone?

 

[Researcher]

"Dating internationally, and marrying one of these girls is a bad idea, with too many possible bad outcomes, but the alternative is I guess worse."
 
You could say the same thing about dating and marriage with anyone, its a risk period.
 
I enjoy the time alone, no captain, no bull[snip], if the moon is out its quite nice. you get plenty of time to reflect. plus your traveling, currently i am going no where litterally.
 
whats the alternative? diying alone?

           This is where the value in learning to be happy single is. I have spent most of my life single and know I can be happy that way.Now that I am married I am happy also but that takes being with the right person.I'd rather be single and happy than married and miserable. Either situation has its ups and downs. You just gotta find contentment somewhere.That's all anyone can do anyway.

          Researcher

[maritime04]

You have to be able to have fun on your own before you can do it with some one eles.
 
I was single for 4 years in Colombia, dated many women. At times i felt lonely but never did i get into a relationship and stay with a women who was not right for me. Colombians say "better to be alone then with bad company".
 
If your lucky enough to find some one, the problem is making it last and keeping it going. Which requires alot of work and a bunch of luck. There are alot of challanges to making a relationship work period, add in getting invloved with a women from another country to boot.
 
Thats where these websites come to play, where guys who have been there can atleast describe whats its like for guys about to go there. living in Colombia for me may not be the best choice for my family but at least i can honsetly describe what its llike to live there as an expat.

[JWR]

           This is where the value in learning to be happy single is. I have spent most of my life single and know I can be happy that way.Now that I am married I am happy also but that takes being with the right person.I'd rather be single and happy than married and miserable. Either situation has its ups and downs. You just gotta find contentment somewhere.That's all anyone can do anyway.

          Researcher

Researcher,
 
Do you have family outside your marriage?  Are your parents alive?  It's off the subject, but I'm curious.
 
I also never had a problem being single, when I was younger.  I always had my parents around, holidays were fun, and you have that foundation of support.  Since everybody passed away and I have 0 family, having a good marriage / relationship has become more important.  Also why I would like to have a child still.
 
I'm ok being by myself, but having someone there for you is definately a better life.
 
 
 

[JWR]

Sorry to ask again JWR but you really have not stated why exactly you did not like living there. Could you go into more detail?

Chris,
 
This of course is completely from my own perspective.  Every guy has his own reality when they get down there.  Everybody sees things through their own rose colored lenses.
 
I have lived in Cali with my wife for about 7 months, and in Barranquilla by myself. 
 
I miss my culture, I miss going down to the marina, and hanging out with my sailing buddies.  The communication is always difficult, and even speaking Spanish, you still miss alot of the hidden meanings.  I simply don't feel at home.
 
I don't ever feel completely comfortable, relaxed, and safe as I do at home.  We can all sit around and blow sunshine, but it's more dangerous then where I live.  That gets tiresome always being a bit more on guard.
 
When I lived there, I didn't see big age differences as a cultural thing.  I believe that is hype.  Some older rich guys "sponsor" younger girls and have pretty girlfriends.  For the most part, people are married to other people within 5-7 years of their own age.  The pretty, educated girls that are not desperate and poor, want Colombian guys close to their own age.  There are alot of good looking Colombian guys, and many are good people. The girls want these guys, and the pretty ones find them.  When you spend some time there, join a gym, and start interacting more with people, you see things closer to the way they really are.  I wanted to have a child so I was looking for a girlfriend in her late 20s or 30s.  I didn't find meeting the kind of women I wanted to date easy at all.
 
I was not looking for a young super model.  Just somebody reasonably attractive, nice, and young enough to have a child
 
What is the strategy for meeting girls once you are down there? 
 
Ok you can use an Agency .  There are many younger girls that are very pretty.  The selection of older ladies that are attractive and nice is small. There are some nice girls in the Agencies, but after having friends there, and learning more about the situation, I feel that is shark infested waters.  Many guys have been successful taking this route but the % I think is not favorable.
 
Just tell the girl in the agency that you are planning on living in Colombia, and then you will find out their agendas pretty quickly.  They all say they would prefer to stay in their country with a good guy, but for the most part, I think the agency girls want out.
 
You can try to meet them in restaurants, or the mall.  Culturally this is awkward, and not a very good way to go about this.  They are not nearly as enamored by dating a gringo as we think, and many of the higher class Colombianas are actually embarrassed by it.
 
You can network and get introduced to ladies through friends that you meet down there.  I really think this is the best way to go about this, but it takes time, and is a crap shoot.  You have to be really patient, and live down there for a long time.  You better be speaking at least conversational spanish.
 
It's not an easy situation not matter how you look at it.
 
Is it worth the risk, and are the chances better of finding someone nice to spend your life with?  I think so, but you better have the energy, money, and time to put into it.  It's no quick fix, but it only takes one.
 
 
 

[Researcher]

Researcher,
 
Do you have family outside your marriage?  Are your parents alive?  It's off the subject, but I'm curious.
 
I also never had a problem being single, when I was younger.  I always had my parents around, holidays were fun, and you have that foundation of support.  Since everybody passed away and I have 0 family, having a good marriage / relationship has become more important.  Also why I would like to have a child still.
 
I'm ok being by myself, but having someone there for you is definately a better life.

            Yes, my mother is still alive and I have 2 brothers and a sister. I can see why having a good marriage is important to you.I am happier married now that I have a good relationship with my wife. Even when I was single I saw my family only during holidays. I think I would have been OK even if I had spent the holidays alone.I'm kind of a loner any way.

            Researcher

[maritime04]

JWR
 
I really understood your last post, as i live in Medellin, i used dating angencys and often would ask many local women out. i found many of the things you say to be very true.
 
gringos may think that they are the catch of the season, but it simply is not true. I found many girls would not return my calls after 3 dates, or pick up the phone. they just werent that intrested, and to be honest at that time i wasnt very intrested either, i wanted to meet people and date, and live in Colombia sometimes i think i would have had better luck if i said i wasnt living in Colombia, and just said i was looking to marry and take her back to USA.
 
It takes alot of time and energy to find some one right, and if you get lucky sometimes it takes just as much to make the relationship work.
 
Agency girls are often part-time prepagos, and gold diggers, or as i later found out are paid 20,000 COP for a free meal from a gringo. Lot of agencys pay the girls to go out on dates, and for a poor barrio girl 20,000 COP for a free meal is worth it.
 
I also agree that you can find wonderfull girls in Colombia it takes time, money and hard work, its not easy. But its worth it in the end if you can make it work
 
 

[Researcher]

        Living abroad isn't for everyone that's for sure.The time I spent in Mexico I enjoyed.I liked living there but didn't like working there. I never had any problems getting dates with the ladies.My gringo-ness seemed to help in that department. I always had people wanting to fix me up with someone and there were plenty of ladies where I worked, in the plant and front office.I always thought Colombia would be even easier to get dates.The time I spent there was pretty much jam packed with meeting women.When I wasn't meeting women in agencies I was meeting them on the street.One guy I hung out with in Cali during the 90's carried a small pad and pencil so he could write girls phone numbers down he met out in public.It was always full. I remember once he almost got ran over because he was crossing the street trying to get to this babe he saw on the other side.Maybe things have changed in Colombia but I never had any problems meeting women there.

            Researcher

         

[V_Man]

Of course no one can advise you which of those options to take.
Another option if you have the money is to have a child through surrogacy and rise him your self. Just throwing that option out there for you to see that there are many possibilities.

If you married someone half your age then OK you are going to get some snide remarks from some people. Otherwise there is simply no excuse for it. Anyone that disrespects your wife, disrespects you and there really is no point in associating with such people.
I am a convivial sort of guy but if anyone was as rude as that to me I'd confront them  right then and there. Dude, just watch how fast they back peddle if you confront them with their anti-social, bigioted behaviour. If they are going to act like a child then lay it out straight and simple for them right in front of everyone.

I do realise that with "an import" some people are going to jump to all kinds of conclusions.
It sounds to me that in your case it was a good thing because you discovered who your friends really were.

Frankly I'm not that worried about it.
I just don't circulate in such small minded circles.
Maybe just change your lifestyle so that your circulate with more worldly people.

Here is why it is not such a big deal for me personally:
For starters several of my girl friends have been from foreign countries with English as their 2nd language. Admittedly they could all speak more or less fluent English. They have all been younger and very attractive as well. The point is that people are used to seeing me with such girls.
I have introduced a couple of them to my family and their response was:
"Oh! So that's why you are learning Spanish. I can see why."
After my ex-wife I think they wouldn't care if she came from Venus as long as she was going to treat me well.

Secondly two of my best mates are actively encouraging me to go get an "import". One suggests Russians and one suggests Phillipinas. They didn't know I am already thinking about Latinas but they were not surprised in the least.

Thirdly I had a very cute Colombian girl friend who is 12 years younger than me before who had visa issues. There must be more than 20 people that have said to me I should marry her - visa problem solved. Their idea - not mine. Obviously they thought we made a good couple.

Most of my friends are younger than me. I play a lot of sport and other active pursuits so my friends wives and my female friends tend to be in good shape themselves. In any case the locals that I date are also attractive. If I had a hot younger Latina, she is not going to be physically so much different to the rest of my social circle.

Even if all that were not true I tend to hang out with people that have traveled to different countries so they are not so small minded but are also down to earth.

On top of all that I tend to do little harmless things that demonstrate I am a little quirky and am never going to completely conform with Joe average.
For example, die your hair, get a tattoo, go sky diving, whatever there may be that is unusal in your part of the world. If you can't think of anything then just fly someplace for a weekend. Take dance/yoga/painting classes. Anything. Just every now and then do things that are a little bit edgy and laugh about it. After awhile people just expect you to go off and do something a little crazy every now and then so they accept that sort of behaviour from you.

Mate if 3 months goes by and I hadn't done something just slightly quirky, people would ask me if I was feeling OK.

In your case, you were married to a Colombiana for 10 years and parted as friends. No one should be surprised if you married another one.

[maritime04]

Researcher

dates (sex) are easy; relationships based on respect and trust are not, those you have to work for.

[Researcher]

       Maritime, I had plenty of shots at relationships also.The key to finding that is to keep looking. From among the many dates I had I would end up with the one I thought had the best potential for a good relationship.That's what I was looking for.I never have been much of a player or sport dater.That has never really appealed to me.When I pretty much always evaluated the long term potential of the situation.Many relationships just ran out of gas because I couldn't see myself being married to the woman I was with.Then it was time to move on.

            Researcher


         Researcher

[JWR]

"[On top of all that I tend to do little harmless things that demonstrate I am a little quirky and am never going to completely conform with Joe average.
For example, die your hair, get a tattoo, go sky diving, whatever there may be that is unusal in your part of the world. If you can't think of anything then just fly someplace for a weekend. Take dance/yoga/painting classes. Anything. Just every now and then do things that are a little bit edgy and laugh about it. After awhile people just expect you to go off and do something a little crazy every now and then so they accept that sort of behaviour from you.

Mate if 3 months goes by and I hadn't done something just slightly quirky, people would ask me if I was feeling OK."
 
Vman,
 
My friends think I'm a little crazy too,
 
During the 10 years I was married, I sold a sailing charter business after 17 years, bought a new charter sail catamaran, moved to Costa Rica, and started another snorkel day charter business, sold this business, and moved to the San Francisco Bay area and started another business, sold this business, moved back to San Diego, sold the furniture, rented the house,  and bought another sailboat to sail around the world, sailed thousands of miles and explored, sold that sailboat, lived in Colombia for a while, and moved back into our house in SD, sent my wife to nursing school, divorced, spent a few months in Barranquilla dating, and now I've started another sailing charter business in San Diego.   10 years of adventures.  It was a wild ride.  Back to exactly where I was before I was married.  Came full circle.  I just have to laugh.
 
My ex-wife was never content or happy in any of the things that we did, or accomplished.  She is just one of those people that is always driving hard forward, and can never stop to enjoy the accomplishments or the moment.
So that is a fundamental difference that we have among too many.  I like to stop, appreciate, and enjoy the moments.
 
If I would have took longer to get to know her, I would have figured this out and not married.  Our immigration system contributes to the failure of marriages and divorce because they don't let us bring them here for long enough to get to know them.  If they would give us 12mos, renewable for another 12 mos, many times guys would not marry.  The system doesn't allow a normal relationship to develop.  It's too fast.  With the language challenges, as they learn English, it's like every morning you wake up with a new person.  You are just getting to know them and it's full of surprises.

[Chris F]

Thanks JWR for going into detail.  Your perspective on life there is much different than some guys believe it to be.
 
Take Care!!

[Researcher]

 
If I would have took longer to get to know her, I would have figured this out and not married.  Our immigration system contributes to the failure of marriages and divorce because they don't let us bring them here for long enough to get to know them.  If they would give us 12mos, renewable for another 12 mos, many times guys would not marry.  The system doesn't allow a normal relationship to develop.  It's too fast.  With the language challenges, as they learn English, it's like every morning you wake up with a new person.  You are just getting to know them and it's full of surprises.

          Well put JWR and I agree with you.Getting to know the culture and language is good and can help but in the end you are marrying the woman.Taking the time to get to know a woman really pays off.That is why I say meet many women and get to know them somewhat before you choose which one is a better fit.This also can pay off.I'm glad I took my time and made many trips to spend time with my wife.

         Researcher

[Dan Las Vegas]

JWR, excellent post!
 
Dan LV

[maritime04]

depends on the persons invloved but i can agree 90 days is not enough time to determine marriage, thats still getting to know you, my relationship for example we didnt even start saying " i love you" till month 5.
 
I dont think 24 month visa would work, but def. 6 month visas would give a couple more time to get to know each other.

[jvoorhees]

I don't quite understand why the government has a time limit period.  You'd think as long as the couple we living together and still engaged, the reason for the visa is still valid.
 
I've know people to wait 3 years after getting engaged to finally get married.
 
Myself, 90 days is more than enough time.  But that's just me.

[Jeff S]

Hey JWR. I remember when you first headed off to Costa Rica with the catamaran and remember you posting that you were leaving Costa Rica a while later. Glad to see you back but sorry to hear it didn't work out.


It is a fiance visa, not a girlfriend visa, so it is intended for people who have made up their minds to marry. They'll never have a move her here for two years of fun then dump her and send her back home visa, though as appealing as it sounds.

[Ray]

It is a fiance visa, not a girlfriend visa, so it is intended for people who have made up their minds to marry. They'll never have a move her here for two years of fun then dump her and send her back home visa, though as appealing as it sounds.

Exactly correct Jeff!
 
Get to know her over there and be sure about marriage, THEN petition her for a fiancee visa.
 
Ray
 
 

[JWR]

The visa subject is like complaining about the weather and taxes, but it's interesting anyway.  I think it comes down to freedom.  The last few posts show that there are varying opinions on how guys differ on how they would like to go about bringing a girlfriend/fiance/wife home.
 
I just don't think it's any of the US Government's business to get involved in these issues.  We should be able to let's say, fill out a form, post a bond refundable til marriage, or until they go home, and then get a couple years to develop the relationship and see what happens.  What is wrong with a girlfriend visa between 2 consenting adults?
 
At least then, all the options would be available to us.  As Americans in this "free" country, we should have that right afforded us.  We should have the right to invite a guest into our home (the US)anytime we like without some Govt. official in some lame interview, asking my girlfriend if she's been involved in prostitution, or the drug business. Yes, those were some of the insulting questions she had to endure.
 
I think spending the time getting to know them in their own country is a good start.  Most guys don't have the time, or the money, to take enough time off to go down there to do this properly.  So guys end up making quick decisions, and then starting the visa torture.
 
I believe that before deciding to marry, we should be able to bring them here to see exactly how they are going to adapt to living in the US, and for whatever amount a time that the couple decides between themselves is appropriate.
 
I've always thought that until they actually get off the plane, you just don't know what is going to happen.
 
Before I married my wife, we spent 2 months together over 2 trips.  1 month each trip.  I married her in Colombia and did a DCF.  Doing a K1 would have given us another 3 months, and that would have been a bit better, but most likely wouldn't have changed much.

[Ray]

We should have the right to invite a guest into our home (the US)anytime we like without some Govt. official in some lame interview, asking my girlfriend if she's been involved in prostitution, or the drug business.

　
But JWR, it isn’t just YOUR home, it’s OUR home, and I should have a say on who you invite into OUR home. Just because you want to bring YOUR girlfriend into OUR country, you have no RIGHT to do so without proper screening by the authorities.
　
No, we don’t need anymore prostitutes or drug addicts. We don’t need any terrorists, communists, drug dealers, murderers, or folks with serious communicable diseases.
　
Yes, you have the right to choose your own girlfriend or mate as you see fit without government interference. However, you DO NOT have the right to bring a foreign national into this country to live with you without having her screened by the government.
　
If you wish to shack up with a foreign woman for a period of time before you make up your mind if you want to commit to marriage, then you can do that in her country or have her apply for a visitor visa. Those options are available now, so there is no need for any "girlfriend" visa.
　
The reason that it is very difficult for a young single woman to get a visitor visa to the US is not the US government’s fault. It is the fault of her many countrymen who came before her and didn’t follow the rules. They selfishly took advantage of our hospitality toward visitors and overstayed or cheated the system for their own personal benefit. There are many countries where it is relatively easy to obtain a visitor visa to the US because the vast majority of the residents of those countries don’t have a history of cheating the system. Some countries’ citizens can visit here without a visa. You always have the choice to date women from those countries if you desire to have them visit you here and live with you for up to six months at a time.
　
For those guys who don’t have the time or the funds to travel overseas in search of a wife or girlfriend, That’s their problem, not mine. I guess they will just have to stay with the lardoes down at the neighborhood bowling alley.   
　
Ray
　
 

[maritime04]

i am not in favor of a girl friend visa, it would lead to alot of abuse, wouldnt it be grand if you could just look online, fill out an application pay for a flight then BAM, some 20 year old from the third world would show up at your door step for all access BOOTY calls for the next 2 years! When her time is up you can just deport her ass, then file for the next one.
 
but i can agree 90 days is why too little, should 180 day visa, it would help alot for most people., the visa is manily to help couples who have seen little of each other, so 180 day would help those guys out alot.

[Ray]

　
Good point about the "booty-call" visa…LOL!
　
However, the purpose of the fiancée visa is not and has never been to help couples who have seen little of each other.
　
The only purpose of the fiancée visa is for two fully committed people to marry here in the USA. I think 90 days is plenty of time to have a wedding.
　
Ray