The Misadventues of the Well Intentioned

[drm64]

I have recently begun reading the contributions of fellow latina lovers at the urging of 2 of my friends who are regular contributors. They have also encouraged me to share as I have quite a story. To you veteran travelers my story will either amuse or horrify depending on how dark a sense of humor you have. I'm sharing my experience for the rookies who are still on the fence about making a trip ISO their latin lover or perhaps those who have made one trip and think they have found that someone special. My first advice to those still considering this option is if you don't have a lot of patience and money, don't even consider this option. If you've been saving for years to make this trip, you will only frustrate yourself because after that first trip you will want to go back within months. I'm leaving for Barranquilla next Thursday, my 4th trip in less than a year. You also must have a lot of patience as the development of your relationship abroad will need to be nurtured in letters and phone calls during the months of separation. Getting to date someone locally that you can see whenever you want and even speak the same language with is a luxury you are sure to miss. Now my story and the reason for the thread title. I began my search for my latina in March 2005 via an internet search where I came across Inernational Intros. Of course the women were gorgeous as you all know. I spoke with Jamie about his service and he forwarded along the names of men who had used his services so I could get an unbiased account. My first call was to one of this site's contributors. We spoke for hours and have since became great friends. We even went to Barranquilla together in Feb. That conversation was followed by 5 others with men equally enthusiastic. I remember a guy in Las Vegas who was in a board meeting when I called and he excused himself from the meeting so he could talk to me about his experience. All 6 guys said the exact same thing - It was the greatest time of their lives! I decided to write a few girls to see if there would be any interest in this gringo, and to my surprise, 6 out of 6 responded. A few letters were traded before I decided I was really interested in this one girl and discontinued writing the others. I then decided  after a few months of writing I would go to Barranquilla and meet her. Thinking we were really hitting it off in letters and now phone calls, I made the trip to see her. First Big Mistake! In my mind I was thinking although the guys I had talked to had said how great the personal intros were, I was also thinking how if this was anything like that tv show The Bachelor, I was soon to be breaking a lot of hearts. So, to save the girls the heartbreak and me a few bucks on the intros, I went down and met only my girl. Everything was fine. We used a translator for 2 days and then we did a pretty good job communicating just the 2 of us with my limited Spanish. 2nd Big Mistake!! I stayed 10 days and fell in love quickly. I was ready for a relationship with a girl that I believed to be from a country full of loving, passionate, sincere, faithful, trustworthy women. 3rd Big Mistake! More months of letters and phone calls followed and we began discussing marriage.(Note the lack of patience on my part) She wanted to marry in B. because she was the oldest of 5 kids, none of whom were married. It didn't matter to me, so we planned it for there. We had a civil wedding and I returned to the US 3 days later. A few more months passed and I could hardly wait to see  my new bride again. My friend and I went down in Feb but this time, after just 2 days, I was miserable and wanted to go home. She had completely changed personality. She was no longer loving or attentive. She spent her time cleaning or watching tv while I was left to amuse myself. I spoke with her about the change on 3 different occasions including once with the translating assistance of my friends wife. Each talk brought no change or response. I knew this "new" woman would be a miserable one, and after talking to friends in B who knew both of us, I decided I would not bring her here. I would end the marriage. I was so certain of this that I wrote the "dear john" letter on the plane trip home. For some reason she was shocked to get my letter and wanted me to reconsider. I gave her an opportunity to address all my questions and grievances, but she failed miserably.For example, when I asked her why she only kissed me on the forehead instead of passionately like she had previous trips, she said a kiss on the forehead was the sincerest showing of love!!  When I asked why she would not once sit down and practice English with me, she said it was because she couldn't think of anything to say!!  Gimme a Break!! ( You guys who have read Sean's "fed flags" now know where he got the banners from. He had a front row seat to the game) I wrote her back that the relationship was over and that I had withdrawn the visa application. Instead of cooperating with an uncontested divorce like she said she would, she got an attorney and demanded $10,000 to sign the papers!! The reasoning behind such a settlement for a 4 month marriage??? She claimed I had forced her to quit her job and college to come to the US! I told my attorney (English speaking referred by Jamie at ii) that she was lying and I could prove it with her own words in our letters. My wife quit her job and let me support her without any discussion with me beforehand. She told me after the fact. I was on the hook for college costs and living expenses while she did nothing all day!! RED FLAG!!  And that guys is where we are today and is part of the reason for this trip next week. I have to get this divorce done with or without her participation.
Now, for the rookies I will go back and explain my mistakes. First, all the money I was going to save by skipping the personal intros is going to be spent this trip. All I succeeded in doing was wasting a year, 3 trips and the cost of a marriage and a divorce. Plus, starting a relationship by letter allows you to read into the person (pardon the pun) personality and chemistry that may or may not be there. This trip, all the girls I meet are on an even playing field. I have not written any of them so no preconceptions. 2ndly, Use a translator. I go a little proud of not needing one but maybe I could have gleaned more info about this woman with the help of one. However, a woman intent on deception is going to be hard to read translator or not.  My 3rd mistake I mentioned was thinking here was a country full of the kind of woman I wanted to find. I have read some some discussions here about cultural differences. There are some, but you cannot make blanket statements about the passion or faithfulness of a country's women. I believe there are more of the type women I am looking for in Colombia than in the US but leave it to me to find one who isn't. As was mentioned in "red flags", you can never understimate what a mother will do for her kids. My wife has 2 boys and I believe what was really in play here was a woman who wanted to come to the US with her kids and was going to find a good man, whether she loved him or not, that would bring her here. I don't think she had intentions of leaving me once here, but who knows? What I do know is she played a role long enough to get me and then dropped it once she felt the need for it was over. Unfortunately for her, she didn't expect me to react the way I did. I have learned this lesson too late in life "Never invest more in  a person than they have earned." I am much wiser for my experience but you know the expression "once bitten, twice shy"? You rookies have the insight of all those red flags that I didn't and I hope by sharing my story will help some other well intentioned men from the same misadventure I have had.  I'll let you all know how the trip goes and wish me luck with a "real" woman this time.  
If anyone would like more info or details, I'd be glad to share with them. I was just trying to highlight the last 15 months as briefly as I could.

[Ken]

PARAGRAPHS!!!

[Patrick]

Thanks for sharing.  I definitely agree about not considering this if you don't have the patience or money to make quite a few trips.

[surfscum]

Excellent post, drm64!  Thanks for telling your story.  I think you were very lucky that she was still in Colombia when you found this out: it could have been a lot worse.  This story should be placed in a new section called: "Must reads for newbies".  Please keep posting, this is the kind of material this board needs.

[doombug]

Great read.  

I knew this "new" woman would be a miserable one, and after talking to friends in B who knew both of us, I decided I would not bring her here.  I would end the marriage.

Way to go.  No use importing spoilt fruit.  

...when I asked her why she only kissed me on the forehead instead of passionately like she had previous trips, she said a kiss on the forehead was the sincerest showing of love!!

:shock:

Holy shiat, how funny is that! :lol::lol::lol:

Some would accuse you of being culturally irreverent for not believing such hokum.

[Ken]

This is the thousanth repeat of the same failure story. Look in addition to the "money and patience" (you and her both for patience!) you need to make a serious effort to learn Spanish. This is not a cd you stick in your car radio but a community college course. Second you need to go out of your way to get a grip on Colombian culture. You can't go by what yer momma taught you in the the good old US of A because it ain't, I repeat it AIN'T the same. Meeting, getting to know, courting and eventually marrying a colombiana/peruna/dominicana etc. etc. is not just a matter of charging a ticket on your Visa Card to South America on American Airlines. It is time, effort (and yes lots of money) and real commitment to enter a new world that consists of a whole lot more than pictures of pretty girls on your computer screen. Your post sounds like you skipped all the hard parts and were surprised it didn't work out?!!!!.  

[sean126]

This is the thousanth repeat of the same failure story.

And there will be a thousand more of the same story.  As a matter of fact...we ALL have had failure stories in our lives. IMHO it takes guts to admit to a bunch of strangers that honestly couldn't care less about you...that you made some stupid mistakes and would like to pass those along to others who may be blinded for the moment to prevent them from perhaps repeating the same.  Not to mention the fact that your opening yourself up to ridicule from others who have probably made stupid mistakes in their life also.   I don't think there is a man on this site that hasn't made very stupid mistakes when it came to women....if they didn't then they would still be with their first serious love. Instead of rubbing salt in your wound....I'd like to say I think you did a good job at telling your story for benefit of others.    

you need to make a serious effort to learn Spanish.

While this is certainly important....I don't think it's "as important" as some may state.   The woman, more than likely, is coming to your country.  This is not always the case of course.  In the overall scheme of things I would think it's more important for her to learn YOUR language..if indeed she is going to live in your country.  True, you need to learn her language...But is it paramount if your using an agency and/or translator? IMHO...learning her language is NOT going to prevent you from falling into the commom pit falls that guys will fall into when it comes to women.  Some men are more trusting, naive, or less experienced than others...however you can tell more from someone's body language and actions about how they truly feel about you than by what they say.  Pertaining to drm64's case...speaking spanish would not have prevented his misfortune.  Hell, we've all dated women in our OWN countries where language WASN'T a problem at all and the relationship has ended badly.    
*** Before someone jumps all over this paragraph...let me say again...Pertaining to this person's situation and probably many, many others...Speaking her language probably would not have prevented his and many other's misfortunes. It is smart and important to learn her language though.****

you need to go out of your way to get a grip on Colombian culture. You can't go by what yer momma taught you in the the good old US of A because it ain't, I repeat it AIN'T the same.

In stating my own experience....I do not find the cultural differences (in Barranquilla) a major issue as it pertains to women.  I'm from Indiana...I lived in buffalo NY for a short period of time....I found more differences in women THERE than I did in Barranquilla.  My wife is a little bit more spirited, passionate, and has more of a zest for life than others that I've dated.  But in my experiences....I've not seen anything that would make a big deal as far as relationships are concerned.  Unless you're a jerk and then of course you will probably see the "hot-blood" in them come out.   Again, others may have different experiences...but I didn't see the culture as any big deal as it pertains to dating, courting or meeting women.  Contrary to other's advice here....I did nothing out of the ordinary when it came to meeting or courting women and I was very blessed in the end just like many others I assume.  

I didn't get that you were surprised at the ending....I got that you were only trying to pass along your mistakes and misconceptions for the benefit  of others.  We can't all be perfect and I'm sure theres someone else who will be falling in the same holes that you did.  Hopefully they will read your post first.  I hope your next adventure will be a smarter one.

   

[Maestoso]

PARAGRAPHS!!!

[Fuzzyone]

  I think you are missing the point, learn Spanish learn spanish. You might have avoid part of your problem if you knew the lingo. I don't know how many guys go to Colombia and don't know any spanish. They meet a girl that knows no english, so how do they talk when the girl gets here? I would bet most marriages that the couples cannot talk to each other might last 6 months at most.

  Anyway you basically learn a good lesson at least you did not bring her here like I did with my ex wife.

[drm64]

Surfscum, thanks for the input. You are right. I was just talking to Ebony Prince about that. I said for as miserable as this was, the silver lining is certainly that this all unraveled in B before lots of money was spent getting her and her 2 kids here and then trying to deport her.

Sean 126, Like you said unfortunately this story will probably be repeated many times over. A smart man learns from his mistakes, an even smarter man learns from anothers. I am hoping the readers here are all smarter than me and can learn from mine.

[soltero]

drm64, what was the incentive in marrying a woman with two kids, if you don't mind talking about it.  I know people that don't consider it an issue, but prior kids is an immediate deal breaker for me.

[utopiacowboy]

Good post. "Never invest more in a person than they have earned." Yes.

[Ray]

...for as miserable as this was, the silver lining is certainly that this all unraveled in B before lots of money was spent getting her and her 2 kids here and then trying to deport her.

Thanks for sharing your story here. I'm not sure what you meant when you mentioned "trying to deport her", but I just wanted to clear something up for the readers.

When you petition a wife (and her children) for an immigrant visa, they are effectively issued Green Cards upon arrival in the States. Even if the marriage fails and you divorce her a few months after she arrives, she (and her children) already has legal residency here and she will not have to leave the country. After two years, she can self petition for Removal of Conditions even though she is divorced. As long as she married in good faith and there is no evidence of blatant fraud involved, she can legally stay here permanently if she wishes to.

Even for those who petition a fiancée with a K-1 visa and then the marriage is called off by one or both parties, the chances of her being deported are slim and none. You could do nothing to “have her deported” and the government doesn’t really care anyway. The government has effectively given up on deporting anyone that doesn’t want to leave. There is no longer any will to enforce our immigration laws and it is common knowledge around the world that if you can make it past the border inspectors, you can stay forever and enjoy the benefits of our society.

[sean126]

Ray........that's good info.

[EbonyPrince]

Ray wrote:

There is no longer any will to enforce our immigration laws and it is common knowledge around the world that if you can make it past the border inspectors, you can stay forever and enjoy the benefits of our society.

That is excellent information Ray!  Although I haven't verified it, it is common knowledge from the articles that I read that the govt. doesn't actively pursue (or maybe doesn't have the resources to pursue) people that are here illegally or doesn't belong here.

I think a lot of people take it for granted regarding people getting here and staying here illegally through the marriage process without good intentions.  I also think that a lot of people aren't aware on both sides of the fence the opportunity for them to stay.   I for one don't want to be a meal ticket or an immigration broker for getting someone here that doesn't deserve it.

I think that drm's candidness is beneficial for guys looking into this.  As we have discussed, I am fortunate to have been on this forum prior to going to SA.  During my experience I have learned and shared that the process does in fact require a lot of work and patience, because SA women are the same as others around the world.  You must remain focused, diligent, and cautious in your search.

[drm64]

Doombug, love the humor

Soltero, I am 42 with 2 kids already, ages 8 and 11. Starting a new family from "scratch" wouldn't be my first choice. If the right woman came along and she has 1 or 2 kids, and we can just blend our 2 families, that would be great. However, finding a woman with none but wanting some would not be a deal breaker for me. Bottom line, find the right woman and enjoy all life that will bring the 2 of you.

Ray, I appreciate the clearification of the "deporting" issue. My thinking was if I have a woman here on a spousal visa, then my one bite at the apple was taken. If I didn't show she had left the country I would not be able to bring another here.

[soltero]

Thanks for responding, drm64, What you say makes sense and I would probably feel the same way if I already had kids. After I have my own, I don't think I would feel as strongly about whether or not I would accept someone else's. I would, however, like for my first experience with parenthood to be with someone who would be sharing that first experience also.

 

[utopiacowboy]

Thanks for responding, drm64, What you say makes sense and I would probably feel the same way if I already had kids. After I have my own, I don't think I would feel as strongly about whether or not I would accept someone else's. I would, however, like for my first experience with parenthood to be with someone who would be sharing that first experience also.

When I read your first comment on the topic above, I was like, what?!?! But now that you explain it, I agree with you. It's nice to share it with someone who is also going through it the first time too. After you've got kids, it is much easier to accept someone else's. I must admit that kids are a tough issue - it's easier to accept bad behavior from your own kid than someone else's.

[soltero]

UC, I don't have any problem with kids per se. I actually love kids. I have actually had experience through a former girlfriend of four years with raising hers. We broke up, and the child went with her, and to be honest, I would have rather kept him with her in the picture or not. I was the only father he knew up until the point when we split and he was six at that time.

I think I may have mentioned this in the archives somewhere. I just feel that everyone gets to have that first time, and that is one of the great joys of life, and I want that to be an experience shared equally between my wife and I.

[SocialDreg]

Good info RAy.  I think if the divorce occurs within the first two years, she can file at that time for the removal of conditions. She doesn't have to wait for the two year period. Every time I hear some guy say he is going to have his ex deported I have to laugh. It ain't going to happen.....unless...

You can have your ex deported if you get an annulment.  I know two guys personally that got an anulment based on marital fraud.  The INS deported the women.  It took a year or so.  What happens a lot is the woman abandons the gringo early in the marriage.  You don't know where she is at.  File for an annulment for  marital fraud.  Win by default because she won't be there to respond to the petition.

The INS will look for them and deport them after a hearing.

LEARN SPANISH!!!!!  If you have to rely on translators you are in for big trouble.   I learned the hard way.  

[Looking4Wife]

drm64:

Thanks for sharing this very personal and painful story for the benefit of others.

Based on what you have written, clearly you were dealing with a "chameleon" that would have been "hard to read (with a) translator (or even if you were a spanish speaking gringo) or not".

Having been through a divorce from an AW, I would not wish divorce upon my worst enemy.  But if your wife has married you under what appears to be fraudulent pretenses, then hopefully you will be able to terminate it quickly.

Dios te bendiga...

[English]

Surfscum, thanks for the input. You are right. I was just talking to Ebony Prince about that. I said for as miserable as this was, the silver lining is certainly that this all unraveled in B before lots of money was spent getting her and her 2 kids here and then trying to deport her.

Sean 126, Like you said unfortunately this story will probably be repeated many times over. A smart man learns from his mistakes, an even smarter man learns from anothers. I am hoping the readers here are all smarter than me and can learn from mine.

Thats a deal breaker for me as well. And you would think that after a failed relationship and having 2 kids that she would learn to appreciate a man willing to come to her country and sweep her off her feet.  

She is going to regret every single day...you have no idea!

I think if you have the means to stay at least a month or two, you can find a good woman and know her well enough to invite her here on a fiancee visa or if you plan on having a wedding, have a non-legal wedding to satisfy her relatives and be done with it.

[English]

Surfscum, thanks for the input. You are right. I was just talking to Ebony Prince about that. I said for as miserable as this was, the silver lining is certainly that this all unraveled in B before lots of money was spent getting her and her 2 kids here and then trying to deport her.

Sean 126, Like you said unfortunately this story will probably be repeated many times over. A smart man learns from his mistakes, an even smarter man learns from anothers. I am hoping the readers here are all smarter than me and can learn from mine.

Thats a deal breaker for me as well. And you would think that after a failed relationship and having 2 kids that she would learn to appreciate a man willing to come to her country and sweep her off her feet.  

She is going to regret every single day...you have no idea!

I think if you have the means to stay at least a month or two, you can find a good woman and know her well enough to invite her here on a fiancee visa or if you plan on having a wedding, have a non-legal wedding to satisfy her relatives and be done with it.

[Houndog]

I ony have two things to say:

1- It takes Guts to admit you're not far enough up the learning curve to not make mistakes!!!

2- Communication is an art not a skill, fukk language barriers, when you find love you will know it, bcause SHE will follow you to the end of the earth When She Loves You, whether she understands a word you're saying or not!!!!

[Looking4Wife]

Piggybacking off of what Houndog said...

"... when you find love you will know it, bcause SHE will follow you to the end of the earth When She Loves You, whether she understands a word you're saying or not!!!!"

While it is extremely important to learn Spanish, understanding the "person" is far more important than what they are "saying" verbally.  As Richard Flint (motivational speaker) says, "behavior never lies".

A lot of guys make it sound like learning Spanish is the key to prevent from being scammed or misled... if that was the case, we'd all be happily married to English speaking AW's and we would have no need for this forum.

If you speak the same verbal language, and don't ask the right questions, and don't discuss the right issues to determine the future of your relationship, and resolve conflicts, then it means nothing.  

However, if you have a (well-intentioned, preferably female) translator to help you address these important issues upfront, and as conflicts arise, then you can still select a potential wife efficiently that speaks a different language.