I'm totally amazed

[Ray]

Hey Bob,

When a Filipino departs the country, they have to be cleared through Philippine immigration before departure. They check for things like minor children who need travel clearance or may be on a watch list, Filipino emigrants or overseas workers who need a CFO sticker in their passport (this is for the mandatory educational seminar), Filipino citizens who are subject to the travel tax, wanted criminals, etc… At least that’s the way it used to work (?).

This is in addition to the regular airport security checks and the airline checks for visas, etc.

The US government charges the airlines a fine (I think it used to be something like $500) if they let someone on board a flight to the US without proper visa or authorized documentation. I don’t know who pays for the return flight if they are denied entry at the POE (?).

Now if a ‘bading’ (transgender weirdo) with a female passport got caught with extra spare parts during the security check at the airport, who knows what procedures would be followed? I believe that either a full body pat-down and/or full body X-ray scan is required since the “underwear bomber” incident.

There are no American authorities at the airport checking departing passengers bound for the US that I know of.

Ray

[euforia51]

... there were other teeny tiny things that should have thrown flags too, but by that time, after talking for 8 months, they seemed like purely trivial nothings.

OK I can pass with the teeny tiny things but a flat out he/she on the live webcam? The sound of its voice? Nothing gave this away? Or ... was it really girl doing all of this dirty work and the last he/she e-mail that was sent was the "game over" e-mail? I haven't seen alot of gender impersonators but there must have been something that would have tipped this off early on. Bill mentioned having some risque pics of this girl. These have to be of "her" or of some woman. The old pic of Cris on Bill's sig was a woman! A keen eye for detail would pick something up that wasn't right even by accident and even if you didn't want to admit it to yourself. This is a natural process when you're doing webcams for such a long time. You can't help but notice things good or bad. And 8 months is very a long time to wait for a little cash on a scam regardless of how poor someone might be, because there's no guarantee the scammer would get it from the victim in the first place. He/she must have been running multiple victims at the same time.

Bill ... just curious, from the time you sent the money for the plane ticket, how much longer did the relationship go on? I'm not throwing rocks by any means ... I'm just scratching my head over this. The he/she thing is simply not making sense to me.

Guys just don't want to believe that some of those hot webcam "ladies" have a few extra body parts! Tuck and duck tape baby! I have even seen them in thongs...in which case it is tuck and insert baby!  

Like I said, I haven't seen many impersonators but I still have a hard time believing someone would be that good knowing their interacting with someone for 8 months ... at least not without some cosmetic surgery. There are other features to hide ... facial features, ears, an Adam's apple, his voice...

[Ray]

euforia,

If you have never been to the Philippines, then your confusion is understandable.

Even in person and close up, you just can’t tell with some of these impersonators. Same for Thailand, Singapore, etc.

On a Web cam it would be 10 times harder to spot some of them.

Ray

[euforia51]

Fair enough, Ray. I have never been and have never seen. Man, I got to get off of this one.
Kontra, are you out there and ready to finally tell us Part 2 yet?

[z_k_g]

All

And 8 months is very a long time to wait for a little cash on a scam regardless of how poor someone might be, because there's no guarantee the scammer would get it from the victim in the first place. He/she must have been running multiple victims at the same time.

Euforia,

A typical scammer will be running his/her game on up to 15 or 20 at a time.  When one is complete, or fails, they just pick up a few more suckers.  

You got to remember, this is their job, they are very very good at this, they practice, share advice, and they read the same websites, including P-L, that we do, very savvy con artists.

In the course of a year, a typical scammer has had contact with over a thousand men, and they will have extracted large sums of money from maybe 10 or 20, and small sums from a few hundred, adding up to nice tidy sum at the end of the year, so its time well spent.

And that's just the statistics for ONE scammer!

Zulu

[Bill_McC]

OK I can pass with the teeny tiny things but a flat out he/she on the live webcam? The sound of its voice? Nothing gave this away? Nothing, not even on the telephone. His/her voice is female

The old pic of Cris on Bill's sig was a woman! That is Cris and if the email is true then she is a Ladyboy

And 8 months is very a long time to wait for a little cash on a scam regardless of how poor someone might be, because there's no guarantee the scammer would get it from the victim in the first place.  In this case "a little cash", the price of the ticket, is approximately 10 months salary of an RN

Bill ... just curious, from the time you sent the money for the plane ticket, how much longer did the relationship go on?  Approximately 2 weeks. From the time I sent it until he/she didn't show at the airport

Since I told what the email said about her being a Ladyboy I've had two people on here tell me back channel that they have literally picked up Ladyboys in a bar without knowing what they were. If I knew how I'd upload a pic so you could see for yourself. You can not tell.

This is one very very sharp/intelligent person. He never ever forgot anything that I told him. Two or three weeks later if I questioned, the info came back as an almost direct quote.

Bill

[robert angel]

Euforia,

Ray's right. Unless you get the underpants totally off (and some even have surgery that removes all male genitalia and creates the appearance of a vagina) there's NO way of knowing sometimes.

In Asia, probably more than anywhere else in the world, the 'art' of gender changing via surgery seems to me to be more advanced than it is anywhere else in the world. I sometimes wonder how they can afford it.
 
I have seen lady boys, he shes, transvestites, or what ever you want to call them, in NYC, L.A. Key West and other places and none of them could fool me as convincingly as the Asians.

The Asians may even go so far as to do neck surgery to remove the appearance of an Adam's apple, typically more prominent in the male neck. Hormones, surgery and other medicinal treatments can raise the voice and can help to make them thin and shapely. They can be quite adept with make up and fashion sense as well.

My wife can tell better than me, but it's no big deal to her. Sometimes we'd leave a store at the mall and once outside, my wife would casually mention 'Honey, you that 'she' was really a 'he''?

I guess the last frontier in medical science for gender bender surgery, short of putting a uterus in these guys, is to down size their hands. To have a close look at their hands, typically, when all else fails, (not that I pursue this as a contest) is what may give them away--their size in particular. Even on women who have plastic surgery and stay women, but to look younger, the hands are typically still what gives their true age away.

As mentioned here many times before, these people are typically accepted into many Asian societies in a good natured, 'no big deal' matter of fact way, much more so than they are in the USA.

I've heard a lot of women here and there say that these people, as well as gay guys s in general, especially hair dressers, are some of the best and wittiest friends they have. I'll bet gay hair dressers and beauty shop workers are the holders of more gossip and relationship secrets than just about any one out there.

[Jeff S]

Dave posted some pics a while back: http://www.planet-love.com/forum/index.php?topic=4618.msg52466#msg52466

[euforia51]

2 weeks from the time the money was sent to the time she was suppose to show. And this after 8 months of talking? What kind of perfect he/she, who also never forgot anything, has got that kind of time to wait for a payday from one guy? I'm assuming you talked to her nearly everyday and for a lengthy amount of time as well. You also mentioned pics of her sitting at election tables, with her family, and others as well. All of this is just not adding up, right now.

If there's one thing the caucasians are not good at, at least here in the U.S., it's gender impersonation even with surgeries, hormones, and all of that. The Asians must have this down pat like Robert says. The ladyboy pics from the post are pretty convincing at first glance...

I admit I'm a little green to how complex these cons are because I haven't been scammed like this before. Call it luck, call it being cautious, being pretty savvy to the Internet, call it whatever. But this is the kind of sh*t that begs to be told on 60 minutes, in prime time, and following the Super Bowl for god's sake! Not necessarily Bill's story persay but the whole Internet dating scam methods in general and how complex they are. Make a mini-series out of it. Make the everyday person who is thinking about Internet dating aware that this stuff is going on. Maybe it's been done already and I haven't paid attention. Thanks guys for all the explanations... but more importantly, someone else may be thanking you later.

[Jhengsman]

2 weeks from the time the money was sent to the time she was suppose to show. And this after 8 months of talking? What kind of perfect he/she, who also never forgot anything, has got that kind of time to wait for a payday from one guy? I'm assuming you talked to her nearly everyday and for a lengthy amount of time as well. You also mentioned pics of her sitting at election tables, with her family, and others as well. All of this is just not adding up, right now.

If there's one thing the caucasians are not good at, at least here in the U.S., it's gender impersonation even with surgeries, hormones, and all of that. The Asians must have this down pat like Robert says. The ladyboy pics from the post are pretty convincing at first glance...

I admit I'm a little green to how complex these cons are because I haven't been scammed like this before. Call it luck, call it being cautious, being pretty savvy to the Internet, call it whatever. But this is the kind of sh*t that begs to be told on 60 minutes, in prime time, and following the Super Bowl for god's sake! Not necessarily Bill's story persay but the whole Internet dating scam methods in general and how complex they are. Make a mini-series out of it. Make the everyday person who is thinking about Internet dating aware that this stuff is going on. Maybe it's been done already and I haven't paid attention. Thanks guys for all the explanations... but more importantly, someone else may be thanking you later.

You forget an important social fact, to the producers of 60 Minutes and the rest of the media we are the bad guys, little better then sex traffickers even if some of us are victimized that won't change..

[piglett]

I think the ladyboy story may be 100% BS too
it's a way to shame Bill.....poor guy
& also try to keep him from posting her info on sites like dragonladies
most guys would not have layed all the goods out like Bill has here.
they would have just moved on & never informed anyone of the real story.


just my gut feeling
pig

[Ray]

euphoria,

This isn’t rocket science. Forget about 60 Minutes and those liberal whackos!

The solution to avoiding scams like this is actually very simple.

1. NEVER send money to someone you have never met in person.

2. Visit her early in the relationship.

3. Forget about funding her offer to visit you on a visitor visa


I don’t care what the reason, just don’t send any money…period.

If she can’t afford even basic communications costs, find someone who can. Don’t expect her to be on the Internet every day chatting and e-mailing you. Be reasonable and keep in mind that few of these ladies have home computers and Internet access.

If you have a soft heart and feel a need to help the less fortunate, find a reputable charity in her country and send your generous donations directly to them or through a recognized church group if you prefer.

Keep money, specific job info or lifestyle, and all financial discussions completely out of early communications as much as possible. If she keeps bringing the subject of money up, dump her fast!

Before you start communicating with the ladies, get a passport, save up for a trip, and plan for time off from work for a vacation. Don’t invest too much time in a potential relationship without making that visit. If you offer to visit and she tries to talk you out of it for any reason, run like hell! She may have a husband and family, children, extra spare parts in the genitalia area, works in a brothel, etc., so she doesn’t want you to show up in person, but just your wallet. When you do travel to meet, make sure it’s in her place of residence preferably with her family present. BEWARE of offers to meet in a neutral country or away from her daily life.

Most ladies from the most popular countries cannot qualify for a visitor visa, so forget about her coming to visit you on your dime until you have traveled to meet her and her family first. If she can fund her own visa and trip expenses 100%, then go ahead and let her try, but once again, DO NOT send money for anything!

If you don’t send money, you can’t get scammed out of your money.

We have had members here who strongly disagree about sending money. We have had guys who actually insisted on sending her money even when she refused it, and then they hired a private “detective” to spy on her and find out what she did with the money. That is just plain dumb in my book.

If you want to throw away your own money, that’s your business, but just don’t come back later and cry about it. At least I’ll give Bill credit for taking responsibility for his own actions, unlike some other whiny idiots.

Ray

[z_k_g]

I think the ladyboy story may be 100% BS too
it's a way to shame Bill.....poor guy
& also try to keep him from posting her info on sites like dragonladies
most guys would not have layed all the goods out like Bill has here.
they would have just moved on & never informed anyone of the real story.


just my gut feeling
pig

Piggie,

Good point.

Thats why its important to spread the news quickly and in as many places as possible, with pics, names and locations and MOST IMPORTANTLY the ENTIRE SCAM!

Typically these crooks only change their names, but they use the same pictures, locations and ENTIRE SCAM like a cookie cutter.

When you post the entire scam package, they have to start pretty much all over and that takes a lot of work.

If they can embarrass a guy, he may not reveal the scam and now the scammers can just cookie cutter and trap the next sucker.

REPORT & REVEAL & EXPOSE names, dates, pictures and chat logs!

This won't stop them but it will make it more difficult because as they lay the trap their ENTIRE SCAM is public record and easy to recognize.

After they have your cash its too late to feel sorry for yourself, now its time for a bit of revenge!

Ronin Style!!  

Zulu

[z_k_g]

You forget an important social fact, to the producers of 60 Minutes and the rest of the media we are the bad guys, little better then sex traffickers even if some of us are victimized that won't change..

Jhengsman,

Sad but true!

But I think that most of the men that seek a foreign bride are cut from a different cloth anyways, and don't give a dead rats as* about what people, the media or the little old lady next door thinks.

This entire incident was avoidable, bottom line.  Bill did not ask the right questions and kept the experienced guys out of the loop.  If he didn't want his business in the public forum he could have easily laid out the "facts" in private messages.

The vast resource of knowledge on P-L - HE DID NOT USE IT!

Big mistake, but he is a big boy, he will be ok.

The reason why this is such an hot topic, is because its very rare!

That says a lot for the guys that post on here and the value of the information and guidance on the P-L forum.

Zulu

[Researcher]

  Yes, you don't hear many stories like this one first hand here on this forum but scams are fairly common.Many guys get scammed and just don't tell anyone let alone put it on a public forum.Most guys I've ran across in my day that were getting scammed didn't want to hear it.I've seen guys get pissed when they were told that their "one and only" was taking them for a ride.The best time to educate someone about this kind of thing is when they are about to go out and meet foreign women.It's definitely something to be aware of.Meanwhile, if a guy does get scammed all you can do is give them support.Their chances are better the next time because they are aware of scams and will usually look for red flags, hopefully.

  Researcher

[thekfc]

Just a little video to watch.

WARNING:
FOUL LANGUAGE - NOT SAFE FOR WORK -  NOT SAFE FOR CHILDREN - IT MAY OFFEND SOME - WATCH AT YOUR OWN RISK.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4z3FxQNYFc&feature=channel


Jeff/Dan if not appropriate - you can remove.

[robert angel]

Seeing is believing!

[z_k_g]

Nice video!  I wanna see that monkey!!

Zulu

[Jedironin]

^ Some things that have been seen, can not be "un-seen"!   

[z_k_g]

 

[Bill_McC]

Cris is a hell of a lot hotter than that.

Bill

[Dave H]

Like I said, I haven't seen many impersonators but I still have a hard time believing someone would be that good knowing their interacting with someone for 8 months ... at least not without some cosmetic surgery. There are other features to hide ... facial features, ears, an Adam's apple, his voice...

Hey euforia51,

I can usually pick out white, black, and Latina female impersonators from a mile away on TV or a computer screen! Asians are another matter...I would be lucky to get half right. Most are petite and hairless. The easiest way (without grabbing or doing a visual inspection, which may be little tough when they are thousands of miles away or post-operative) is when they act "too feminine" and exaggerate their movements and gestures. But some have learned to be more subtle and keep it under control. So with limited movement while sitting in a chair at the Internet cafe and no physical contact (a la Crocodile Dundee), it could be very difficult. Want to see some skin...move the video cam and point it at one of your your girlfriends. Most Filipinos gays seem to have many Filipinas in their close circle of friends.

If she is too beautiful to be true...she may be a ladyboy! Better to go with Ray's advice and drop down a bit from a 9 or 10!!!

Dave

 

[Ray]

The easiest way… is when they act "too feminine" and exaggerate their movements and gestures.

That’s exactly right Dave.

Or when a Filipina is overdressed and wears too much makeup, better take a closer look…

[Jeff S]

If you don't know where to take a closer look, here's a hint....

[piglett]

If you don't know where to take a closer look, here's a hint....

sausage smuggler