A Retrospective: 1 Year Later

[Capstone]

Flashback: It was last June that I found myself sitting in the coffee shop of the Guangzhou Consulate nervously awaiting the outcome of my then fiancée’s K-1 interview. I can't tell you how many cups of coffee that I had during my 4 hour wait in an attempt to calm my worries about something going wrong in the interview. As it turned out my wife's visa was approved after a very quick 5 question interview – and what a relief that was considering all of the Guangzhou visa horror stories that I had read and became familiar with over the course of the preceding year. 

Fast Forward: So here I find myself one year later and things have gone about as smoothly as I could have ever hoped or expected.  My wife entered the US, we got married, and she obtained her Social Security & green card all without any problems. My wife's adjustment period was very brief to say the least as she has had no problems acclimating herself to life in the US outside of not being able to find any good Chinese restaurants. She keeps herself busy without being overly dependent upon me – if she wants to go shopping or out to lunch while I am at work then she gets in her car and drives herself. We have not actually gotten into a real fight since we were married – we of course have had a few minor disagreements but nothing that we haven't been able to work out between ourselves quickly and in a loving manner. Although my wife never did much cooking while living in China, she has become a wonderful cook over the past year and I enjoy all of her dishes. We usually eat Chinese food about 4 or 5 times a week and then I will cook us western dishes on the other days.  We seem to be tailor made for one another and I realize that I have really hit the jackpot and am a very lucky man to say the least.

We live in a semi-rural community in which one would not expect to find many American/Foreign marriages but surprisingly we have met 5 other Chinese/American couples in the area since my wife's arrival and they all seem to have pretty solid relationships as well. So it is nice that there are some other Chinese women in the area that my wife can talk with and go out with – I know that it must be nice to be able to speak with someone else in your native language from time to time. My wife has also quickly become friends with several of my friends’ wives and so we all go out as a group once or twice a week and I know that has helped with my wife's adjustment as well. She also starts her first job in the US as a substitute elementary/high school teacher in the coming weeks – she probably won't work much during summer school but the school district said that they would probably be using her quite frequently once the regular school year starts back in the fall. She was a high school teacher back in China so she is looking forward to trying her hand at teaching in the US as well.

We have made one trip back to China for 3 months this past year and plan to return at least once every year until I retire and then we will look into the possibility of living in China on a semi full-time basis. To all the guys who have just started the process I can't stress enough how important that I think it is to take as many trips and spend as much time with your girl, her family & friends before getting married. Although I got engaged soon after returning from my first trip I took 3 more trips before my wife came to the US. No matter how much you may chat via web-cam & IM there really is no substitute for getting some real, first hand experience with how your girl handles every day situations. Now I am not knocking anyone who may get married on their first trip but speaking just from my own experience I am very glad that I took several trips and am actually thankful that the visa process took as long as it did because it afforded me the opportunity to do so. Actually if I had it to do all over again I almost wish that I had gone the CR-1 route instead of with the K-1 and even took more trips before getting married. I say this because I would have liked to have had the opportunity to spend more time with my wife's parents before we actually got married – they are great people and I think that it would have calmed some of my father-in-law’s fears about his daughter going off to a far away country to live. But as it turns out, my father-in-law is ok with the concept now although he is still constantly trying to get us to move back to China on a permanent basis. Here are a few suggestions that I would have for new guys based upon my personal experiences:   

1. Take as many trips as you can – Not only to get to know your girl better but to ascertain whether or not the culture is right for you. I have already discussed this in some detail above and would only like to add that yes my wife did act differently in person while around her family & friends than she did on the phone and during chat sessions - this is normal and to be expected but how she acts in person may not be what you expect.
2. Spend as much time getting to know your girl's family as you can – its not like most of us are going to be able to make weekend trips back to our wife's country after she gets here, so take full advantage of the opportunity to get to know and understand her family up front. This will not only benefit you but will also help soothe her parent's fears of their daughter moving to a foreign country
3. Be there for your girl's interview– Considering that it could be one of the most important days of both of your lives I find it ironic at how few petitioners actually accompany their beneficiary to the interview. On the day of my wife's interview there were well over 100 women at the consulate interviewing for fiancée and spousal visas and there were a grand total of 3 Americans (including myself) there to support there loved ones. Now as is the case in Guangzhou, there are many consulates that do not allow the American fiancée/spouse to actually attend the interview but you can definitely make your presence be known by letting your fiancée/spouse take in your passport with them and by also attending either a American Citizen Services or American Citizen's Hour session which are offered at many consulates. But most importantly your presence will help calm your fiancée’s/spouse's nerves and you will be there to comfort her in the event that something goes wrong in the interview.  If you attend the interview and everything goes right then the reward was well worth the trip but if you don't attend the interview and something goes wrong then you will probably forever be kicking yourself in the ass for not making the trip.
4. Don't let cultural differences be an excuse for red flags – I see many guys on this and other boards try to brush real issues under the rug while convincing themselves that it is all due to cultural differences and that all will be ok once she gets to the US. Don't put up with anything from a foreign woman that you wouldn't tolerate with an American woman.
5. Fully embrace your girl's culture – once you marry someone you pretty much marry into their culture as well. So make sure that it is a culture that you can live with for the rest of your life before getting married. If there are things about a certain culture that absolutely drive you nuts then you would be best served by crossing that country off your list. I love Chinese culture but I can also definitely see how a lot of people would not and in that case I would be the first to advise – don't go to China for a girl.
6. Don't isolate her after her arrival: once the visa process is over and she finally arrives in the US make sure that she gets out and experiences things; don't inadvertently isolate her in your home because of communication fears, etc. Getting out and meeting other people will greatly smooth her transition to her new life and will make things easier on the both of you.

Like I said these things are my opinions based upon my experiences alone and I am by no means an expert on foreign/international relationships but they are what I have learned so far along the way.

[Ray]

Very good advice Cap!

I'll be looking forward to your 2-year retrospective. Any little Cap-pebbles in the planning yet?

May you and your spouse have many more good years like the past one...

Ray

[Capstone]

Very good advice Cap!

I'll be looking forward to your 2-year retrospective. Any little Cap-pebbles in the planning yet?

May you and your spouse have many more good years like the past one...

Ray

Thanks Ray and yes we just found out last Friday that there is a little Cap on the way.

[z_k_g]

We have made one trip back to China for 3 months this past year and plan to return at least once every year until I retire and then we will look into the possibility of living in China on a semi full-time basis. To all the guys who have just started the process I can't stress enough how important that I think it is to take as many trips and spend as much time with your girl, her family & friends before getting married. Although I got engaged soon after returning from my first trip I took 3 more trips before my wife came to the US. No matter how much you may chat via web-cam & IM there really is no substitute for getting some real, first hand experience with how your girl handles every day situations. Now I am not knocking anyone who may get married on their first trip but speaking just from my own experience I am very glad that I took several trips and am actually thankful that the visa process took as long as it did because it afforded me the opportunity to do so. Actually if I had it to do all over again I almost wish that I had gone the CR-1 route instead of with the K-1 and even took more trips before getting married. I say this because I would have liked to have had the opportunity to spend more time with my wife's parents before we actually got married – they are great people and I think that it would have calmed some of my father-in-law’s fears about his daughter going off to a far away country to live. But as it turns out, my father-in-law is ok with the concept now although he is still constantly trying to get us to move back to China on a permanent basis.

Cap,

Great post!  Lot of good advice for newbies like myself.  

Did you ask for permission to court your wife?

My sweetie is in the Philippines.  I would love to live there permanently one day!  Have started making any future plans- buying land, exploring house building, etc., to eventually move to China?

Zulu

[Capstone]

Cap,

Great post!  Lot of good advice for newbies like myself.  

Did you ask for permission to court your wife?

My sweetie is in the Philippines.  I would love to live there permanently one day!  Have started making any future plans- buying land, exploring house building, etc., to eventually move to China?

Zulu

Hi Zulu,
Yes the first time that I made a trip to the Mainland I had to get Mom & Dad's permission to marry their daughter. They were very cordial throughout the 'inquisition' but were understandably very worried about the prospect of their daughter marrying a foreigner and moving away to a foreign country. They had many, many questions for me and I had to make a few promises before they finally gave their consent. My wife had already warned me that if they were to say no then that was it, she would never go against there wishes which is par for the course in China so I was a bit worried about it going in but everything turned out fine in the end.

We have already been looking at real estate and plan on buying an apartment in Xiamen at some point - her Dad  wants us to buy a place in his neighborhood. But I think there is a huge real estate bubble in Chinese cities right now and we are going to try and wait until the bubble bursts before we buy. In the city centers a high rise apartment is pretty much your only option if you want something new. If you buy a new apartment it will be nothing more than a concrete shell that you have to finish yourself - flooring, all but rough plumbing, electrical, closets, cabinets, etc is the buyer's responsibility. Labor is dirt cheap though so getting those things done isn't an expensive endeavor but you still have to take all of that into consideration when buying.

[jm21-2]

4. Don't let cultural differences be an excuse for red flags – I see many guys on this and other boards try to brush real issues under the rug while convincing themselves that it is all due to cultural differences and that all will be ok once she gets to the US. Don't put up with anything from a foreign woman that you wouldn't tolerate with an American woman.

I imagine this is one of the biggest potential pitfalls in dating internationally. I fell into it with my first GF and it was no fun. It can be very confusing to tell sometimes whether it's a different custom or whether you better run, especially when you are trying to trust the girl and she is telling you something that may not be true. Ultimately you have to say different culture or not, I am not going to accept that behavior. Hard to do after investing a lot into a relationship.

[z_k_g]

I imagine this is one of the biggest potential pitfalls in dating internationally. I fell into it with my first GF and it was no fun. It can be very confusing to tell sometimes whether it's a different custom or whether you better run, especially when you are trying to trust the girl and she is telling you something that may not be true. Ultimately you have to say different culture or not, I am not going to accept that behavior. Hard to do after investing a lot into a relationship.

Sounds like a pretty tough dilemma!

I've had a few of those already!  I'm not sure how I will deal with tampo on routine basis.  I've gotten my taste of it and it is very very frustrating to say the least!

I'm sure there are more cultural clashes to come!

I've started reading articles on the internet and the archives here to prepare myself beforehand!

Zulu

[Capstone]

I imagine this is one of the biggest potential pitfalls in dating internationally. I fell into it with my first GF and it was no fun. It can be very confusing to tell sometimes whether it's a different custom or whether you better run, especially when you are trying to trust the girl and she is telling you something that may not be true. Ultimately you have to say different culture or not, I am not going to accept that behavior. Hard to do after investing a lot into a relationship.

And make no mistake about it despite our best efforts cultural differences is going to be the real reason for some degree of strife in any international relationship, it is bound to happen. That's why it is so important that guys find a culture that they can pretty much tolerate as a whole but even when that is the case your own ingrained ways and ideas about things will sometimes still clash to some extent. 

[Jeff S]

Yes - Great advice Cap. I spent four trips with my wife before marrying - two here and two there (one big advantage of dating Japanese women) and I'd been to Japan 3 or 4 times before I met my wife - on business, but I did do some dating also. I also spoke more Japanese than my wife did English when we first met. I asked her father's permission to marry also, (after she accepted of course,) and got the usual twenty questions.

You can't stress enough fitting in with her culture - because it will become yours also and you'll have to deal with it for the rest of your life.

Congrats on the cap in the oven!

- Jeff

[z_k_g]

And make no mistake about it despite our best efforts cultural differences is going to be the real reason for some degree of strife in any international relationship, it is bound to happen. That's why it is so important that guys find a culture that they can pretty much tolerate as a whole but even when that is the case your own ingrained ways and ideas about things will sometimes still clash to some extent. 

Cap, I second that!

Guys look at the HOT babes, the bodies, the lips, the hips, the eyes, the nose, the tits, and butts and forget that this is  a PERSON from a foreign country that I have to LIVE with for the rest of my life!

You can get a HOT babe but you also get her family and culture in the package!

I chose the Philippines because not only were there HOT women, but there  were also great things about the islands that I loved.  My best friends mother and cousins wife are filipina and great wives!!

The pictures and profiles are only 10% of the total proposition!

CONGRATS ON THE CAP IN THE OVEN!!

Zulu

[Capstone]

Yes - Great advice Cap. I spent four trips with my wife before marrying - two here and two there (one big advantage of dating Japanese women) and I'd been to Japan 3 or 4 times before I met my wife - on business, but I did do some dating also. I also spoke more Japanese than my wife did English when we first met. I asked her father's permission to marry also, (after she accepted of course,) and got the usual twenty questions.

You can't stress enough fitting in with her culture - because it will become yours also and you'll have to deal with it for the rest of your life.

Congrats on the cap in the oven!

Thanks Jeff!

You and your wife really had the perfect situation then - you both had the opportunity to experience each other in your own environments which really made the final decision for both of you much easier.

[jm21-2]

And make no mistake about it despite our best efforts cultural differences is going to be the real reason for some degree of strife in any international relationship, it is bound to happen. That's why it is so important that guys find a culture that they can pretty much tolerate as a whole but even when that is the case your own ingrained ways and ideas about things will sometimes still clash to some extent. 

And hard to know what the culture is really like without visiting first. If you don't want to take a trip just to check out the country then there's even more reason to take multiple trips. I read extensively about China and it was still very different than what I expected. But a lot of the things that surprised me made me like it more. Taiwan seems like China but with a heavy western and Japanese influence.

After visiting Thailand I can't see myself ever hooking up with a Thai, but seems to work for some.

Congrats on the kiddo!

[throwawaydad]

Capstone:

ALWAYS good to hear positive news.  Excellent advice for ANY cross-cultural relationship.  I'm relieved to hear success stories from members with more experience than myself.

With all the bad news in the World lately, it's good to hear of Love in Blossom.

Congratulations on the baby "situation".  Is this the first child for either / both of you?  If it's not, you'll understand what I say, but if it is your first child, take this to the bank.

"Your life will never be the same."

Maybe someday, there will be yet one more baby in my life.

[Capstone]

Congratulations on the baby "situation".  Is this the first child for either / both of you?  If it's not, you'll understand what I say, but if it is your first child, take this to the bank.

"Your life will never be the same."

Maybe someday, there will be yet one more baby in my life.

Thanks! Yes, this will be the first child for both of us and we are both very much looking forward to it. We are both hoping for a girl but a boy would be absolutely great also. 

[braziliangirl]

we just found out last Friday that there is a little Cap on the way.

Great story, Caps! And even greater that you are having a baby. I can't help myself from being touched by such news.

Best of luck!

[robert angel]

Wonderful information and it's great to hear about another lil "Cap' on the way. Wishing health en-route to and after that joyous event.

A healthy child is the foremost thought and females seems more inclined to take care of her elderly parents than males, almost like an insurance policy against a nursing home, but in some ways, males are easier to raise and less expensive as well.

There are pros and cons to both and although my two sons have given us fits at times, even if they turned into little fish, we'd never throw them back.

Interesting to hear talk of getting to know the family of a foreign spouse more, even embracing the opportunity, as it seems that sometimes on Fil-Am unions, we talk more about establishing boundaries than we do about building bridges.

We always enjoy your posts about China from the inside, and we'd love to be a part of a street corner English learning session over there someday!

[throwawaydad]

Open question to anyone who has married or been engaged to an Asian.

Hey Cap:

When you spoke to the 'rents about making their daughter a "honest woman", was your Spouse aware that you were going to discuss that with them?

Was she present when you had the chat?

Was it both her parents or only one?

When I was married to my First Wife (who is Venezuelan/Ukrainian), I spoke to her Father first about marriage, who then told me to talk to her Mother, as well.

I told her Dad that his Daughter was not aware of our conversation, and that if either parent disapproved, I would gradually "kill" the relationship...not wanting to cause a rift in their family.

Her Father was actually grateful that I would think of that possibility.

Regardless, our marriage ended 10 years later.  The FIRST divorce in EITHER of our families'.

Your (and anyone else's) thoughts?

[robert angel]

I had to 'run the gauntlet' by my wife's dad and her three brothers. After I passed muster with them, they brought in her Mom and two sisters who gave us their blessing as well.

Life is funny sometimes. I was staying at a hotel in town where a lot of prostitutes would congregate not too far away from. Each night, I'd send my wife back to her boarding house around 12:00--1:00 AM (she didn't want to set a bad example for her siblings) and  as soon as her taxi was out of sight, the 'ladies of the night' would descend upon me. Each one seemed to have a relative in the USA and wondered if I had been to where their kin now lived.

I would engage in conversation with them, but never took them up on their 'offers', which as we came became more familiar each other, went from asking for money to asking to go come up to my room and eat room service to out right offers of 'free fun' with one or more of them.

To be honest, going back to my empty hotel room, laying in bed alone and knowing my fiance' wouldn't be there for 5 or so hours while those young hotties were right outside, made me think. The temptation was there.

Boy, was I surprised to find out that the hotel had a private, plain clothes cop who was watching me intently! He told my wife's brothers that unlike most Kanos he saw, that I didn't bring even a single one of those hookers up to my room. I tell you, a few of them were mighty cute, were fresh from the farm and seemed very sweet as well.

But if I had 'partaken' and my now wife's bros had found out, things might be very different. Instead, my wife's family, especially her brothers, were impressed.

[throwawaydad]

Hey Rob:

What's the old saw?

"The way to find a good person is to watch what they do when they think no one's watching."

[z_k_g]

Open question to anyone who has married or been engaged to an Asian.

Regardless, our marriage ended 10 years later.  The FIRST divorce in EITHER of our families'.

Your (and anyone else's) thoughts?

I am confused about the point you are attempting to make with your post.

What does getting the parents permission to court and marry have to do with your untimely and unfortunate divorce?

The two are pretty much unrelated.  I'm sure EVERY marriage in her family required the parents permission!

Divorce is really a function of the two people in the relationship.  There may be some instances that the parents interfered with the relationship to an extent that the marriage failed, but otherwise its on you and your mate!

Zulu

[piglett]

We are both hoping for a girl but a boy would be absolutely great also.  

hey great to hear about CAP jr. showing up in the months to come.
so the 2 of you want a girl? Well I don't think there is a return policy on babies these days but, i hope you get what you want.


piglett  

[z_k_g]

Well a don't think there is a return policy on babies these days but, i hope you get what you want.

All deposit, No Returns!!

Zulu

[throwawaydad]

I am confused about the point you are attempting to make with your post.

What does getting the parents permission to court and marry have to do with your untimely and unfortunate divorce?

The two are pretty much unrelated.  I'm sure EVERY marriage in her family required the parents permission!

Divorce is really a function of the two people in the relationship.  There may be some instances that the parents interfered with the relationship to an extent that the marriage failed, but otherwise its on you and your mate!

Zulu

Hey Z-Kong:

I don't know if you live in America or have experience with American courtship...

In America the "typical" marriage-minded couple do not ask their parent's permission to marry.  They dictate it.

Certainly not in ALL cases, but more often than not.

If Mom or Dad have a problem, they'll bring it up, but IT IS post-proposal.

Mom or Dad say NO, and the smitten couple are left with two options.

1. Marry anyway, and hope for the best.
2. Deep-six the relationship, and harbor lingering doubts and resentment to those who said NO.

The reference to my divorce is simply an acknowledgment that in spite of all good intentions, and in spite of all good efforts, sometimes times things go awry.

Have you ever been married in America?  If not, perhaps you should try.
If you have...well, you should know better by now.

[Dave H]

Thanks Ray and yes we just found out last Friday that there is a little Cap on the way.

Hey Cap,

CONGRATULATIONS!

Dave

[z_k_g]

The reference to my divorce is simply an acknowledgment that in spite of all good intentions, and in spite of all good efforts, sometimes times things go awry.

I get your point now clearly.

I didn't quite get your point with your post earlier or misunderstood it based on the context of the threads which was dealing with local customs and family expectations!

I will add that different cultures operate successfully despite the modern world of the "me" culture.  

Asking parents permission does not guarantee success, its just the right thing to do when you take a foreign bride that comes from a family that expects it from an acceptable suitor.

And yes I'm born and raised in the US of A!

Zulu