Has anyone else noticed....

[AsphaltVoyager]

I've been thinking a lot about what it is regarding Asian women that is fundamentally different about them versus "American" women. However, as I think more about the idea, I think that it quite applicable to a great deal to women of Central and South America as well.

The fundamental difference, I have come to realize, is the relative lack of importance to the non-AW where "chemistry" is concerned versus the extreme importance of strong family values in the mate they seek and what his moral character is like. Whereas being a really good person in this country will get you absolutely nowhere with a woman who is native (she'd rather chase the "bad boys"), those qualities have the potential to take you straight to the heart of an Asian woman in very short order.

I realize that this is a blanket generalization, but other than the green-card seekers, from what I have observed and experienced, this is pretty accurate.

This difference was not accurate in the days of our parents. Being a genuinely good person meant something then. No longer, however. Not in this country. And, to be perfectly frank, I think that the feminist movement HAS had a large role in creating this problem.

Am I the only one who has observed this? Or, do you see something else, very different from what I have?

edit** As I was thinking more about this, what occurred to me is that all I have said above adds up to: women in this country do NOT appreciate a good man. You hear them constantly whining about "where have all the good men gone?". Well, the answer to that is they've gone in search of women who actually ARE good and who will appreciate a man who is, as well.

[z_k_g]

AsphaltV,

I agree with you 100% and would add a few pointers of my own.

AmW live by one philosophy, "Whats mine is mine, whats yours is mine- or will be mine soon after I divorce you!!"

AmW enter into the relationship with an aura of entitlement, "I am the prize and you must do everything in your power to keep me around"

They make demands and have a list of requirements for YOU in the relationship, but, when asked what their wifely duties are....silence, a puzzled look and the stupid answers, "Didn't we just have awesome sex?", "Did you notice my tight abs?", "I am so sexy all the guys want me and you are soooo lucky!" and "how dare you ask that I participate as an equal in this relationship!!"

Our women have become barbie dolls that need only new Mercedes, Gucci purses, Sex In the City 2 tickets, a gay BFF, and girls night out.  Husbands and relationships are second thoughts.  No money dude, no relationship.

Just my rant for tonite.

Zulu

[william3rd]

Wow- what an epiphany. I will have to discuss this with my daughter and see where I went wrong. Allowing her to be all americanized and all. Same with my sister-where did my folks go wrong?

[AsphaltVoyager]

*lol* Yeah, there are plenty of AW who see you as an investment (if you're successful financially or have the potential to be).

The wonderful woman I met is divorced and childless (both of which conditions will be remedied at the first opportunity ). Like most women in the Far East and Middle East, she hasn't been in a relationship where she had equality with her mate. Additionally, she had to live with her spouse's wealthy parents because his character was too weak to separate from them. So, when I told her that I would insist that she be an equal partner with me, I rather suspect she was dumbfounded. She told me that she had always hoped for a relationship as an equal, though. To reinforce that feeling of equality and independence, she will have a bank account of her own once we marry. With that kind of security, I can be reasonably certain that she will not be staying with me out of some feeling of being trapped and when she stays with me, it will be of her free will, making our relationship all the more precious.

These are things that I offered to her, not that I was EXPECTED to give her as an AW would.

Furthermore, we have discussed our mutual goals in depth and agree on how we should get there, with both of us making contributions toward the goals. There's nothing lovestruck about either of us. We do love each other, very much so. But, we also are using common sense and giving each other the respect we deserve by agreeing to share a mutual ideal.

I feel I have been truly blessed to have met this woman. I could wish I was 20 years younger so that she and I could celebrate our 50th and 60th weddding anniversaries together, but I don't want to taint the miracle that we ever met at all by sullying it with any regrets. Instead, I will simply be thankful for every moment we have.

[z_k_g]

Wow- what an epiphany. I will have to discuss this with my daughter and see where I went wrong. Allowing her to be all americanized and all. Same with my sister-where did my folks go wrong?

W3,

It wasn't your fault.

1. Television
2. Television
3. Television
4. Hollywood

Got it?

Just my opinion of course!

Zulu

[z_k_g]

*lol* Yeah, there are plenty of AW who see you as an investment (if you're successful financially or have the potential to be).

AsphaltV,

If they saw us as an investment i would at least feel like i had some value!! 

No, they see us as a means to an end!  Drop and Insert whatever male fits the profile; you as an individual doesn't really matter!  Divorce you, get another, newer, model.  Sounds like the guy with his arm candy doesn't it!!

Did we create this dysfunctional atmosphere?  Was it feminism?  I don't have a clue.

There are some good AmW out there!  Just not enough to go around!

That's one man's opinion. 

Zulu

[william3rd]

W3,

It wasn't your fault.

1. Television
2. Television
3. Television
4. Hollywood

Got it?

Just my opinion of course!

Zulu

Good opinion- Television and ADVERTISING ruins everything.

[Bob_S]

1. Television
2. Television Public school
3. Television College (especially humanities courses)
4. Hollywood

FIFY
 

AmW enter into the relationship with an aura of entitlement, "I am the prize and you must do everything in your power to keep me around"

Except for the ones looking for their next dysfunctional codependent. 
If you're not an abusive, asocial, alcoholic, un/under-employed sociopath, you just aren't interesting enough to get their attention.
Fortunately, in the Far East, women still appreciate a stoic, hard-working, chivalrous, responsible guy.  But all this is preaching to the choir.

[Ray]

Hi Asphalt,

I was just curious about something you said.

You said your Filipina lady is divorced. Was she married to a Filipino national? How and where were they divorced, since there is virtually no legal divorce in the Philippines?

Thanks,

Ray

[robert angel]

Maybe we can get Andy Rooney from '60 Minute's TV Fame, to pipe in here! I just love his rants which typically start with 'Do you ever notice...__________________________________________?'

[Viking]

And, to be perfectly frank, I think that the feminist movement HAS had a large role in creating this problem.

It is not a problem for the girls, and it is not a problem for the bad guys. It is only a problem for the good guys. When women are more financially secure and independent I guess they are more attracted to exciting "bad boys" than to stable good guys.

[AsphaltVoyager]

Hi Asphalt,

I was just curious about something you said.

You said your Filipina lady is divorced. Was she married to a Filipino national? How and where were they divorced, since there is virtually no legal divorce in the Philippines?

Thanks,

Ray

Hi, Ray, well, actually it was an annulment. But, to me they're one and the same. It's been 1.5 years ago now. And yes, he was (is) Cebuano. His loss is certainly my gain.

[z_k_g]

If you're not an abusive, asocial, alcoholic, un/under-employed sociopath, you just aren't interesting enough to get their attention.

Agreed!!

[AsphaltVoyager]

It is not a problem for the girls, and it is not a problem for the bad guys. It is only a problem for the good guys. When women are more financially secure and independent I guess they are more attracted to exciting "bad boys" than to stable good guys.

You could be right about that, but you'd think that when it's matters of the heart we're talking about those women would know better than to trust one of the bad boys to take good care of it.

I think one more thing that greatly contributed to this situation is the decaying moral values in our country. Once sex sprang from the bedroom to the living room out of our TV sets and onto billboards along the highways, it was alllllll over but the cryin. Now we've got women who are actively seeking the title of cougar, as though that's really something to be proud of. 

[Ray]

Hi, Ray, well, actually it was an annulment. But, to me they're one and the same. It's been 1.5 years ago now. And yes, he was (is) Cebuano. His loss is certainly my gain.

Yes, for purposes of immigrant/fiancée visas, an annulment is as good as a divorce.

I don’t know if this applies in your case, but for anyone else out there contemplating marriage to a Filipina with a divorce/annulment, I STRONGLY recommend that you get CERTIFIED NSO copies of annulment documentation in the form of a CENONAR, before you get too deeply involved.

Tell her that you need NSO copies on security paper of any annulment, along with applicable court documents.

I know of too many guys who got all the way through the process, up to the visa interview in Manila, only to find out that their true love was still legally married.

Have you already visited her in the Philippines?

Ray

[AsphaltVoyager]

Thanks for that bit of information, Ray. It will help avoid a pitfall I don't need to deal with. No, we are going to meet in Bangkok at the end of October, then again in RP in April. To say that I can't wait is a gross understatement.  

Now.... what's a CENONAR and NSO? *DOH!*
*LOL*

[AsphaltVoyager]

Just finished talking with my sweetheart and she tells me that CENOMAR is "Certificate of No Marriage". The NSO is some kind of government office. She is evidently up to snuff with what she'll need. *Whew!* thank goodness. *LOL*

She still have an obligation to the school she teaches at through this year, however, and plans to honor it while completing her thesis so she can obtain her Masters prior to coming here. I really admire her work ethic as well as her .... well, ethics. Her commitment to her job and to me and our future together give me great confidence in our successful future.

Of course, it doesn't hurt a bit that she's not even a little bit hard to look at, either. *hee heee* 

[robert angel]

>>>What's a CENONAR? <<<

Isn't it that the natural well, spanning 60 meters in diameter and reaching a depth of 22 meters, used by the Mayans as a sacrificial pit for virgins in Chichen Itza, Yucatan Mexico? I vaguely remember almost jumping in there on a dare...

Those crafty Filipinos, recreating an existing tourist attraction!

[Ray]

The NSO, or National Statistics Office, is like a national repository of vital statistic data like birth, marriage, and death certificates.

The CENOMAR or Certificate Of No Marriage is a record check to see if an individual has been married and if the marriage has been annulled, or a death certificate entered for the spouse, essentially determining if the person is legally free to marry.

When a lady applies for a fiancée or spouse visa, the US Embassy in Manila often will order a CENOMAR from the NSO before approving a visa. For your case, or any other situation where the lady may possibly have been married, it would be wise to obtain the NSO documents well in advance of filing a petition. I would get original certified NSO copies of her birth, marriage, and annulment documents because those will likely be required by the US Embassy anyway down the line. Also, ask for a RECENT baptismal certificate if applicable.

A note on Philippine annulments. An annulment is very expensive and sometimes takes years to obtain through the court system. Most Filipinos don’t have the financial means to pursue a legal annulment, or even a legal separation, so they just sort of go their separate ways and make a new life with someone else.

A whole bunch of foreign men have been devastated when her visa was disapproved because the records showed that she was still legally married. That’s why anyone who meets up with a Filipina lady who says that she is divorced, has an annulment, or even widowed, should be very skeptical and ask for proper documentation. "Trust, but verify".

Is she living in Thailand now, or are you both just traveling there to meet?

Ray

[Howard]

Asphalt,

Yeah I've noticed it, but I have found that it is not exclusive to American women.  I see it just as clearly in American men.  Obvously, we are more concerned with the women since that is who we are trying to connect with, but don't kid yourself, American women are only the product of American men.  For every bad boy seeking feminist out there, there is a balding guy with a beer belly in his thirties looking for a 21 year old supermodel.

We, as a society, have shifted our focus from traditional values to physical beauty and material gain.  This is an American problem, not something that pertains exclusively to one gender or another.

I am the product of a single mother.  I know what a POS my biological father is.  I also know many good American women.  A few of them raised me

I have a 25 year old cousin who is very attractive, thin, athletic, intelligent, college educated, responsible, compassionate, etc...  She is everything anyone could ask for and she can't find a "good guy" relatively close to her age to settle down with to save her life.  She is human after all, but the fact that she can't find a dude worth marrying proves there is just as much wrong with American men as there is with our women.

Congrats on finding a keeper!  I wish you the best of luck in your journey

Keep the Faith!

H

[robert angel]

Hey Ray,

Do you think in the case where a Kano is filing a CR-1 visa to bring her to the USA, both never been married before their RP wedding--and they have all that documented--the trip, stay, wedding etc., she's got a good job over there as a nurse--no red flags--do you think that the guy should really go to the RP for the Manila interview 'just in case'?

I know that we'd hate to tell him not to sweat it and save a couple grand, then have it 'go south'--what do you think?

Probably not a simple 'cut and dry' question.....

Thanks,

Rob

[Ray]

Hey Ray,

Do you think in the case where a Kano is filing a CR-1 visa to bring her to the USA, both never been married before their RP wedding--and they have all that documented--the trip, stay, wedding etc., she's got a good job over there as a nurse--no red flags--do you think that the guy should really go to the RP for the Manila interview 'just in case'?

I know that we'd hate to tell him not to sweat it and save a couple grand, then have it 'go south'--what do you think?

Probably not a simple 'cut and dry' question.....

Thanks,

Rob

From my experience over the years, I don’t think it is necessary or even highly desirable in the vast majority of cases for the petitioner to be at the interview in Manila.

However, it does show support and commitment, and strengthens the evidence of a valid relationship IMO, so it definitely can’t hurt to be there.

In Manila, some interviewers would rather that the petitioner not be present while others welcome them as a participant. Some guys were actually allowed into the interview room but were instructed to sit there and be quiet while the lady was interviewed.

In my personal opinion, if a guy is strapped financially or has limited time off from work to make the interview, or to accompany her on the trip over to the USA, I think the vacation time would be much better spent to take at least a couple of weeks off when she arrives here. Picking her up at the airport and then leaving her to go back to work within the next few days is a bad idea. Be there for her 24/7 during the first 2-3 weeks after arrival if at all humanly possible!

Ray

[AsphaltVoyager]

Ray, it is our plan to meet in Bangkok, but she lives in Cebu now. Later, we'll meet again in Cebu. That's the plan, at least.

[AsphaltVoyager]

For every bad boy seeking feminist out there, there is a balding guy with a beer belly in his thirties looking for a 21 year old supermodel.

Balding?? In his THIRTIES?? *LOL* That is a pretty rare thing, Howard. Late 40s, 50s maybe, but 30s? Pretty unusual.

We, as a society, have shifted our focus from traditional values to physical beauty and material gain.  This is an American problem, not something that pertains exclusively to one gender or another.

True. Unfortunately.

I have a 25 year old cousin who is very attractive, thin, athletic, intelligent, college educated, responsible, compassionate, etc...  She is everything anyone could ask for and she can't find a "good guy" relatively close to her age to settle down with to save her life.  She is human after all, but the fact that she can't find a dude worth marrying proves there is just as much wrong with American men as there is with our women.

I am uncertain how you define "good guy", to be honest as well as whether her definition and yours are the same. What she might be looking for is someone who is totally hot as well as seeking to be in a committed relationship who has a decent job and education with a future ahead of him. Those things would, I suppose (since I'm not a woman) make him a catch. However, perhaps she is setting her sights too high as far as how he has to look, too. As I said before, "good guys" are hardly on most U. S. women's radar when it comes to who they want to date. The GOOD ones usually aren't that great looking. There are a few exceptions, of course. But, in general, a totally hot guy knows he can pick and choose for years before having to decide if he wants to settle on one woman. Until he begins reaching that age where he's not quite so hot any longer does he have to actually develop a decent personality or sensitivity for a woman's feelings and give her respect. So, if she wants to have her cake and eat it, too, then yeah... she's going to have a bit of a problem. I'm not saying that all the less good-looking guys are necessarily good, but her chances are going to be one heck of a lot higher that he will be.

[Jeff S]

You're demonstrating a clear knowledge of Gen X American women A/V, but that knowledge is next to useless once you hop on a plane and cross the international date line. It's a different world over there, and unfortunately for some of the younger guys here, the merciless training you've received here in both the media and real life spills over onto people like Howard's sister in-law.  Sorry but it's nearly impossible for me to grasp the concept of one person being out of another's league - especially when it relates to looks.