So I met a girl.. And I am going to Thailand to meet her.

[Celtic_Jorge]

Okay folks,

It has been awhile since I posted my introduction in Icebreakers.  Well, I only used Thai Love Links for a short amount of time, and in no time, I was pretty overwhelmed with all of the women who wanted to talk to me.  I talked to about 10 girls for about two days, just to you know, get to know what kind of women were looking for farang on the internet.  Some seemed to be very professional and educated older women who just never married, some seemed to be very pretty but just quite a bit too young for me (e.g. 18 years old), some seemed to be after ANY farang, some seemed like total scams.

Eventually, I started talking to a nice young girl, about 20 years old, only five years younger than I am.  She seemed different.  She was very sweet, seemed very smart, and very interested in me, but not too trusting at first.  She came right out and told me that she came from a somewhat poor family.  She lived with only her mother and her brother in a small room.  Because she has to work so much, she doesn't go to school.  I didn't mind that.  She is VERY attractive.  She thinks her slightly dark skin is unattractive because it is "too dark, and I told her that I found her skin to be beautiful.  =)  Anyway, physically, and as far as her personality is concerned, from what I have found talking to her over the past few weeks, she really is perfect for me in every way..

The only thing is, she lives in a town in the South of Thailand, that is, well, known for its bars and bar girls and the whole thing.  However, she doesn't look like a bargirl at all, and she seems totally honest about what she does for a living.  She works a menial job there in town, but a "good" job, not a bargirl type of job, if you know what I mean.  I don't know.  For some reason I think I really trust her.  It's like I am already falling in love.

So, like many Thai women do, from what I have read on the forums, she soon started talking about her desire to marry me, and getting engaged.  I put on my profile that I wanted to find someone to marry, so this didn't surprise me too much.  The plan is for me to visit there for about about a week and a half in September, before I have to go to my Job towards the end of the month.  She said that when I get off the plane, she is going to take me to her town, where I am supposed to meet her family.  We're supposed to talk about the engagement after a few real dates, and if we still want to do it, we're going to get engaged there in Thailand after I discuss more of the details with her family, and then she is going to get the k1 visa to come to the USA to marry me.

I don't know.  I am super excited about the whole thing.  Everything SEEMS so legit to me.  We talk on the phone, we talk on the webcam (in a decent manner, mind you).  I have seen pictures of her whole family.  No red flags whatsoever have really gone up, aside from when I sent her a VERY VERY VERY small amount of money to get her passport made just so that when we apply for her visa in September after our engagement, it won't be delayed.  I told her that I can't spend any more money on her until I get to Thailand for our engagement, and she seemed fine with this.  I know you're not supposed to send money, but the amount was so small that it was no skin off my back, and like I said, she was perfectly FINE with me saying I won't send anymore until we meet in person.. And she hasn't asked for more.. So, I think its okay.

 She really is super cute, even my mother has started to like her.  We talk on the phone, send each other SMS, talk on MSN allllll the time.  I feel happier just having the virtual presence of a "girlfriend" in my life than I was before.  So, that's what has been happening with me lately.  I was just wondering if anyone here had any pointers as to what I should do between now and my trip, and any advice for my trip in general.  And yes I will post the trip report from my trip in three months.

Cheers,
Celtic Jorge

[jm21-2]

Slow down boy!

1. Don't decide to get engaged before meeting in person.
2. If it's humanly possible, take at least two trips before deciding to marry.

Why?

Because people on the internet are often different in person. You talk a lot about her looks but she will probably look at least somewhat (and possibly a lot) different in person. At least you've seen her over webcam.

Also, girls change when they are in a relationship. She may have some horrible habits as a girlfriend that you never would have suspected when talking with her as an online friend. Certainly happened to me with the first girl I met....

Anyways. You're young and have got plenty of time so there's no need to rush.

[robert angel]

>>>Slow down boy!<<

WELL SAID--(if too nicely)

It's hard to back down now and it's hard to find out someone's true ways in a week and a half. Sounds like a guy blinded by beauty first and really, really wanting everything else to fall in place.

I'd suggest at least, a LONG engagement and a couple trips. I know it's not what you want to hear and we're not here to spoil people's dreams, but more like to prevent potential nightmares.....Good luck young man!

[Jeff S]

Sounds fine so far Jorge. I'm guessing Phuket? That's OK there are real people not just hookers and con men. As jm said - I'd suggest slowing down. You don't know anything about her yet really, aside what you two let on in internet chat sessions, and she really is only 20.

My cousin married a girl from a very poor family in Thailand and couldn't be happier.

- Jeff

[whitey]

Yes, slow down!!!

I met my girl online too.  We exchanged email, chats, video chats for 9 months before I was able to meet her in person.  I was probably half in love before I met her, and I was fortunate that she was even better in person than I could have imagined.

Still, I've gone to see her another 6 times since then over the last 1.5 years, and we'll be married on my next trip.

I know that not everyone can travel that often (I had some vacation time built up that is long gone now, and some savings), but you should at least see her a couple times!

Good luck ... Whiitey

[Celtic_Jorge]

To clarify, I basically can't travel at all. I  am for all practical purposes a slave to my employer.  I can't even leave town over the weekends, because I get called back in. I am sort of an emergency worker, so to speak. I am finishing some training this summer, and I go back to my job in September. I don't get 7 days holiday until I have worked 12 months consecutively.  I am just taking advantage of some time I have between when I leave the Institute, and when I go back to my job in September.

Once she gets to the United States on her k1 visa. we have 90 days to make up our mind about marriage or not,
Also, it can take 4-12 months for her to get the k1 visa, which we can't apply for until the end of September anyway.  So realistically, we are looking at maybe a year or more after September when we actually get married anyhow, however some of that of course being spent in the United States, while she's here on her K-1 visa.  So it's not like this wedding, if it does happen, will happen very quickly.

[bcc_1_2]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJflu7z4QyI (why didn't ray beat me to this, perfect opportunity for him)

This whole thread is really quite frightening. Pass on your "future wife's" profile to me. I'll set up a fake profile and offer her 4000 baht for boom boom. Seriously you've talked to a young girl from a mongering mecca online a few times and are planning to get engaged and start the k1 process right away. She could be a great girl working an honest job... or she could [snip] for money, do drugs, have stds/aids/hep b, etc

Because your place of employment treats you like [snip] and because you've fallen for your chat buddy you aren't thinking straight.

Your circumstances suck but it is up to you to change them rather than compound them. If international relationships are important to you then you go after a job that gives you time off work until you get it.

Or you may need to save up a little bit and take a teaching job for awhile in Thailand. China/Korea/ Taiwan would pay better. Regardless I'm not sure if your head is in the clouds or buried in the sand. Either way... correct that.

[Celtic_Jorge]

Most union jobs in this country won't give you 7 days off after 12 months.  For a working class guy, borderline uneducated guy, I am doing alright.

To be honest man, the most I am going to lose from this is $6000.  I've done the math.  Chump change.  I'll make that money back inside two months work.

If it doesn't work out, honestly, so what?  I'll have a good time in the sun in Thailand.  There are at least 3 000 000 000 more women in the world, and I most likely have somewhere between 40-45 years left to live.  I'll try again and find someone else.

[bcc_1_2]

To be honest man, the most I am going to lose from this is $6000.  I've done the math.  Chump change.  I'll make that money back inside two months work.

Child support, alimony, loss of your sanity. You might want to talk to some divorced guys in your union... hell some divorced guys on here.

6k... yea right. 

[Celtic_Jorge]

Alimony?  My friend's a lawyer.  We'll set up a prenup.  If it remains a problem after that, we'll fix it together.

Child support?  I am not a dead beat dad.  If I have a kid, its my kid.  It doesnt matter what the relationship with the lady is.

[bcc_1_2]

Alimony?  My friend's a lawyer.  We'll set up a prenup.  If it remains a problem after that, we'll fix it together.

Is he an immigration attorney as well? Your standard prenup doesn't work with international relationships. Take it from someone that's been through it.... you'll pay for her to get her own attorney to advise her... and of course the prenup needs to also be in her native language, and yea her attorney should speak it as well. There is other [snip] too. It is complicated, expensive... and you act like this is all easy and cheap. And even after all that it is far from a guarantee that it will hold up.

Plus unless you are worth a lot now... it is pointless. Are your protecting an inheritance, business, etc? Otherwise its the money you will earn during the marriage she'll be taking. Plus of course those monthly checks for spousal support so she can continue her lifestyle while she is [snip]ing some other dude.

Child support?  I am not a dead beat dad.  If I have a kid, its my kid.  It doesnt matter what the relationship with the lady is.

International relationships tend to add variables to this. There is a guy on this forum who just knocked up a woman he doesn't want to marry anymore. Another guy has been in the news because he just finally got his kid back from Brazil after his now dead ex wife left the country with the kid. This is complicated stuff.... not to be rushed through all on one trip because your circumstances dictate it.

[Celtic_Jorge]

I'll at least have some kind of idea what kind of woman she is after she lives in the states for 3 months with me.

You seem to be missing that whole point.

The k1 visa does not say anywhere that I have to marry her.  Marriage is an OPTION during those 90 days.

I'm sure that I can hire a translation service for any prenups, too.

[z_k_g]

Celtic,

Are you serious?

Read Heruamen's post!  And for a real interesting perspective read Piglet's getting married posts!  Learn from these guys!!  (The jury is still out on Piglet, we are following his Philippine adventure at present.)

You are financially responsible for this young lady even if you don't get married to her when she comes here.  The US gov could care less about a prenup!  She leaves you, you still pay!

Take the advice here, make two trips, get to know her first!

Zulu

[bcc_1_2]

You seem to be missing that whole point.

Man you really haven't thought this through. A relationship involves two people. Marriage is a requirement for her in 90 days to stay in the country legally.

Look at it from the circumstances of a young thai woman. How would she be treated upon you tossing her back across the pacific? She'd never live it down and lose tons of face in her village, town and with her family and friends. This isn't a 90 day trial period. Go read what a K1 is. You don't get unlimited shots at this either.

http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/types/types_2994.html

Can't wait for you to make your trip, talk about marriage with a woman you barely know, and of course learn about sin sod.  I bet they start you out at over $6,000 alone just on that.

[Celtic_Jorge]

Man you really haven't thought this through. A relationship involves two people. Marriage is a requirement for her in 90 days to stay in the country legally.

Look at it from the circumstances of a young thai woman. How would she be treated upon you tossing her back across the pacific? She'd never live it down and lose tons of face in her village, town and with her family and friends. This isn't a 90 day trial period. Go read what a K1 is. You don't get unlimited shots at this either.

Yes.  I know that I am legally responsible for her for 90 days.  But I DO NOT HAVE TO MARRY HER IF THINGS GO BAD FOR ANY REASON.  You think I don't know what a k1 visa is?
You are forgetting I have been through this before with my last Thai fiancée.
I know what sinsod is.  And I know what I am willing to pay, and not more than that.  I am going to explain my conditions, that she is uneducated, not terribly wealthy, that frankly I am not much more educated than she is, etc, and I am setting my amount (VERY SMALL).  Which, by the way, is only for CEREMONIAL PURPOSES.  And that's even if they bring it up.

If I am anything, I am not the kind of guy you can push around.  Anyway, this isn't really helping me.  Not bothering with this forum anymore.

[Celtic_Jorge]

I know more about this than you may think.  And I do care how she may feel if for any reason our relationship falls through, having to go back home, etc.  But if she lied to me about anything, don't you think it's within my right to call off any engagement?

Also if you're being short with me because we support different fitba clubs, grow up bcc.  I don't care what side of Glasgow you're from mate.

Anyway, like I said, this thread is getting pointless, and might as well be closed because I'm through with it.

[z_k_g]

I know more about this than you may think.  And I do care how she may feel if for any reason our relationship falls through, having to go back home, etc.  But if she lied to me about anything, don't you think it's within my right to call off any engagement?

Also if you're being short with me because we support different fitba clubs, grow up bcc.  I don't care what side of Glasgow you're from mate.

Anyway, like I said, this thread is getting pointless, and might as well be closed because I'm through with it.

You got a pretty thin skin!

What do you want, everyone's approval?

Stick with the program and learn!  

This forum can be a pretty harsh enema sometimes, but you will always feel good after its all over, :-)

Zulu

[bcc_1_2]

Wow, I read through a couple posts full of obvious red flags... point them out... and get told to grow up.

The more red flags you ignore the lower your chance of success. Celtic_Jorge you aren't the only one that reads these threads. Had you not posted in the middle of the night (CST) I'm sure multiple others would have pointed out your flawed understanding of a k1. Seriously flawed... but I remember thinking the pressure was off with a K1 when I was first reading about it a few years ago. I was wrong... so are you. I learned... will you?

We'll see.

[william3rd]

Okay folks,

It has been awhile since I posted my introduction in Icebreakers.  Well, I only used Thai Love Links for a short amount of time, and in no time, I was pretty overwhelmed with all of the women who wanted to talk to me.  I talked to about 10 girls for about two days, just to you know, get to know what kind of women were looking for farang on the internet.  Some seemed to be very professional and educated older women who just never married, some seemed to be very pretty but just quite a bit too young for me (e.g. 18 years old), some seemed to be after ANY farang, some seemed like total scams.

Eventually, I started talking to a nice young girl, about 20 years old, only five years younger than I am.  She seemed different.  She was very sweet, seemed very smart, and very interested in me, but not too trusting at first.  She came right out and told me that she came from a somewhat poor family.  She lived with only her mother and her brother in a small room.  Because she has to work so much, she doesn't go to school.  I didn't mind that.  She is VERY attractive.  She thinks her slightly dark skin is unattractive because it is "too dark, and I told her that I found her skin to be beautiful.  =)  Anyway, physically, and as far as her personality is concerned, from what I have found talking to her over the past few weeks, she really is perfect for me in every way..

The only thing is, she lives in a town in the South of Thailand, that is, well, known for its bars and bar girls and the whole thing.  However, she doesn't look like a bargirl at all, and she seems totally honest about what she does for a living.  She works a menial job there in town, but a "good" job, not a bargirl type of job, if you know what I mean.  I don't know.  For some reason I think I really trust her.  It's like I am already falling in love.

So, like many Thai women do, from what I have read on the forums, she soon started talking about her desire to marry me, and getting engaged.  I put on my profile that I wanted to find someone to marry, so this didn't surprise me too much.  The plan is for me to visit there for about about a week and a half in September, before I have to go to my Job towards the end of the month.  She said that when I get off the plane, she is going to take me to her town, where I am supposed to meet her family.  We're supposed to talk about the engagement after a few real dates, and if we still want to do it, we're going to get engaged there in Thailand after I discuss more of the details with her family, and then she is going to get the k1 visa to come to the USA to marry me.

I don't know.  I am super excited about the whole thing.  Everything SEEMS so legit to me.  We talk on the phone, we talk on the webcam (in a decent manner, mind you).  I have seen pictures of her whole family.  No red flags whatsoever have really gone up, aside from when I sent her a VERY VERY VERY small amount of money to get her passport made just so that when we apply for her visa in September after our engagement, it won't be delayed.  I told her that I can't spend any more money on her until I get to Thailand for our engagement, and she seemed fine with this.  I know you're not supposed to send money, but the amount was so small that it was no skin off my back, and like I said, she was perfectly FINE with me saying I won't send anymore until we meet in person.. And she hasn't asked for more.. So, I think its okay.

 She really is super cute, even my mother has started to like her.  We talk on the phone, send each other SMS, talk on MSN allllll the time.  I feel happier just having the virtual presence of a "girlfriend" in my life than I was before.  So, that's what has been happening with me lately.  I was just wondering if anyone here had any pointers as to what I should do between now and my trip, and any advice for my trip in general.  And yes I will post the trip report from my trip in three months.

Cheers,
Celtic Jorge

Glad you found someone of interest. I met my wife on Thai love Links. We fell in love over webcams and the like. We already knew our feelings before I visited the first time. I have no prenup. I own our house in Thailand through a series of leases that allow me to kick her out. She refused to sign a sublease that would prevent me from kicking her out. She knows that will never happen

Reading Heruaman is only good for looking at the type of irresponsibility that some of these american clowns exhibit when they get loose in the candy store overseas. Some guys should never be allowed out without a babysitter.

You are going in the right direction. See how it all goes in September.  One caution- if she has any bargirl friends, you should revisit this relationship. Lower income girls who speak good English need to be quizzed on how they learned the language. If she paid for lessons, OK. A former boyfriend, perhaps. English lessons are cheap but all things are relative. When my wife was in English school many of the girls in the class had multiple US/AUS/Brit boyfriends. BTW- we are not the first choice as husband's over there. We are not "the prize" so to speak.

Good hunting and I hope it all plays out for you.

[fathertime]

Celtic Jorge,

Have fun live your life the way you want. Separate the useful information from the worthless cynicism.  Given your circumstances, you do what you think you need to do.  Usually a person doesn’t get too many shots at these visas and it is quite possible a woman will change into something else after you marry her, but on the other hand, maybe she will turn out to be an angel for you.  If you have the stomach to take your chances in the manner you are describing, then do what you feel you must do.  It sounds like you are meeting her, so stay as long as you can and try to get to know her in person and on the computer….as you have already experienced, you have options so another factor might be that you need to sow a few more seeds before settling in with one babe…but only you would really know that one.

good luck!
Fathertime!

[robert angel]

Jorge,

There's some good advice here, just try and take it in the good spirit that most of it is intended. I can't help but wonder why you don't want to reconnect with the Thai girlfriend you mentioned in your initial post. Sounds like you were pretty tight and that she was a nice gal.

I generally dislike having to play  "I Spy" but to be perfectly honest, I once had two profiles on one site and it was amazing the difference in what I thought a person was and the reality sometimes. Having another guy 'approach' a prospective mate might seem like dirty pool, but early in the game at least, I think it's fair game and more common than some might think.

I think you can to a large extent measure someone by the company they keep and their family and I wouldn't discount previous advice in this regard.

Hey--are you from Ireland? I've spent some time over there and it could be argued that some of the prettiest women in world come from there--but Galway in particular. I've been up and down that lovely island nation and it's great.

[jm21-2]

If you guys come off as using the 90 day period as a trial at her interview, she may have problems getting the visa.

Being honest, if I were in your position I would take a similar risk. Actually, depending on what work my GF finds in AUS I might be in a very similar position. But we've already met twice and she's the one dragging her feet, not me. If things don't work out with the current GF I may just go with more of an arranged/blind marriage and just roll the dice.

That being said, BCC is right that it's probably a lot more money than you think it will be. I have handled a few divorces with foreign spouses and they get messy fast. Especially if kids are involved.

[z_k_g]

I hope Jorge is still reading the posts!!

[Capstone]

Jorge,

Don't take everyone's input as criticism - most guys have given out some very sound advice here based upon their own similar experiences.

Just step back and take a look at the situation for a moment - A guy wants to get engaged/married to someone who he has never actually met before after chatting with her online after only about 2 weeks.

My personal take on that sort of situation echoes what most others have already said - Slow down a bit and actually take a trip in person before making the decision to dive in head first. I am not (and neither is anyone else as far as I can see) trying to be critical of your situation but rather am trying to offer a bit of sound advice. I do wish you the best of luck no matter which way you decide to go.

[Bob_S]

And I do care how she may feel if for any reason our relationship falls through, having to go back home, etc.  But if she lied to me about anything, don't you think it's within my right to call off any engagement?

You are absolutely right, if she does deceive you in some critical way, you must dump her.  Though she may not necessarily want to go home.  Therein lies one of your risks.

Let me go back and say, I'm not going to jump all over you or try to discourage you.  You say you've been through this before with another fiancée, so you know how it can all go south.  Let your experience guide you.  You may meet her in person and discover some horrible or even simply annoying thing about her that drives you up a wall, and you can't imagine the next 50 years with her.  But there are a lot of green flags, too.  You are close to the same age, roughly in the same stage of life, you are a working class dude, and she's a simple girl from a working class family (though Western level of working class standard of living is much higher than SE Asia working class).  It definitely looks like a good match on the surface and worth pursuing to see where it goes.  Just a heads-up on some things you should be aware of.

Pre-nups may not be worth the paper they're written on.  In the event of divorce, it is ultimately left up to the discretion of a judge.  And if she plays the "I'm a poor little ignorant immigrant girl and that bad man MADE me sign it and I didn't know what it was...", the judge could just throw it out, even if you paid extra to have it translated.

Depending on the level of poverty she is coming from, she may not want to return home.  Life in the West, even with a meager job as an illegal alien visa over-stay in a shared apartment with reliable plumbing and electricity is still better than her home village.  That could make you financially responsible for her even if you don't marry.  Plus, as some guys pursuing Russian girls have learned the hard way, a woman can be a vicious animal when cornered.  If she is threatened with deportation because you two failed to marry, she can claim you abused her, run to a battered women's shelter, then be eligible to self-petition to stay and adjust her status, leech off the public dole, and make you pay back the government for any welfare she collects (rare, but it does happen).  Now, Russian girls can be cunning that way.  But Thai girls?  Maybe yours is too sweet and innocent to know how much power she has to screw with you if things don't work out.  But you never know.

That's why guys here are pleading and badgering you to take it slow, take your time to really get to know her even if it means delaying marriage to this girl for a year when you can make a return trip.  You both are young and there really is no rush.  But we pray for your success that it all turns out all right whatever you choose to do.