Health concerns in China

[Capstone]

It doesn't matter if she's from a farm or the city, few Asian kids get doted on or have their every whim catered to, like most American girls.

Unfortunately this is becoming less and less true in China. The advent of the One Child policy has given rise to the Little Emperor/Empress syndrome in much of the Chinese youth. Parents and especially grandparents are more commonly giving into the whims of kids today. Case in point, my fiancee's nephew is a nice kid but he is definitely spoiled rotten since he is the only child and the first grandchild - he pretty much gets whatever he wants and is not well disciplined. This is becoming more and more common especially in urban areas were exceptions to the One Child policy are rarely given.   

[bcc_1_2]

You are making a mistake assigning typical "gimme right now" AW traits to traditional Asian women.

Since JM is a divorce attorney I think he is just likely seeing the worst of the worst. I even remember him talking about helping a young lady who was from the philippines originally get a divorce. So maybe his thoughts just stem from seeing the train wrecks.

Despite our best intentions things can get messed up. At least in my state I liked what JM said about having the wife work part time. What bugs me (and I know I'm not the only person that sees this), is a woman who stays home (never works) and has kids... then scores big time with alimony and child support.

If I can have it set up so I can at least (worst case scenario) avoid any alimony 10 or 15 years down the road I'd feel better.

[jm21-2]

Still divorce in Asia, though a lot less than the US...

I'm taking this as more of an adventure than a wife hunt, but it seems like traditional Chinese girls do not really do casual dating. Gotta meet the parents, get their approval, etc., and I think if you came off as not serious you'd be condemned as a player. Not be serious about marrying right away, but have honorable intentions and all that.

I think especially this girl takes marriage as a very serious obligation and doesn't flirt around at all, and I did bump up my travel plans so we could meet. I think she's great so far and I don't want to slight her or anything, but at the same time I haven't dated any girls from Asia really and so wondering if I should investigate the field more before getting too serious. I dunno, just sort of thinking out loud here. I mean, when comparing Chinese girls to the girls I've known here in the US, it doesn't take a lot to look like a great catch, lol.

She definitely spoils her niece...

And yes, I tend to worry too much and over-think things.

Yes BCC, I see the train wrecks...and if you have kids and she wasn't working you're almost certainly going to be a weekend dad here in WA. Not to mention she'd probably get alimony, child support, and for me, a share of my practice and retirement accounts, as well as half of any property acquired during marriage. If she was working you can probably work out a joint custody deal, no alimony, little or no child support, and she's contributed a lot more to the community property. My gut instinct is that I'd like a wife who stays at home with the kids, but dealing with family law cases that just seems like a horrible idea to me with how the law works here.

[Capstone]

I'm taking this as more of an adventure than a wife hunt

Given your age and the fact that you have never traveled to Asia before, I definitely think this is the right attitude to take. I absolutely love China and Chinese culture but I will be the first to admit that it is not for everyone - I know that several of my friends would not like it at all. So I think that by taking the attitude that this is more of an exploratory trip is a very smart move. Someone may love Chinese movies, food (or at least what they think is Chinese food), literature, etc but not until they actually get their boots on the ground will they know what the Chinese people & culture are actually like. Who knows you may get there and decide that it is not for you or you may have an absolutely great experience, the girl turns out to be even more than you expected thereby reaffirming your initial suspicions that Chinese culture is right for you.

Go have a great time and don't worry too much about marriage, etc - if all that is meant to be with the girl then it will happen, if not then no big deal because you will have found out if you actually like China and you will have had an awesome vacation while doing so.

 

[bcc_1_2]

I'm taking this as more of an adventure than a wife hunt, but it seems like traditional Chinese girls do not really do casual dating.

This is exactly what I was thinking. I do have a female friend who is from hong kong, and maybe city girls in Hong Kong or even Shanghai you might be able to "date" western style (play the field or whatever)... but where you are going it wasn't sounding to me like that is an option. 

I also thought the flight was a little pricey. If I drive a ways I can get a non stop to Shanghai from the midwest at under 800 bucks with tax. Just think it sucks you have to pay so much.

I will say part of me wonders if a trip to Santiago, Chile or even Peru might be something to look into if you'd like to find a culture where you can get a lot of dates and play the field.

[Capstone]

I also thought the flight was a little pricey. If I drive a ways I can get a non stop to Shanghai from the midwest at under 800 bucks with tax. Just think it sucks you have to pay so much.

I actually think that he got a pretty damn good deal on his airfare, especially considering the fact that he is not flying into one of the big 3 Chinese cities as his final destination. If you can get a roundtrip to Shanghai in July on a flight that doesn't originate from the West Coast and for less than $800, please point me in that direction because I have never been able to get an airfare that low in the middle of summer - winter/fall/spring yes but not in the summer.

[Ray]

The malaria regimen can be pretty rough on your system. A lot of guys got pretty sick with the hershey-squirts and gut problems. You only need the malaria prophylaxis if you’re traveling in a malaria area. Check with the CDC website.

To protect your plumbing, take a bunch of Pepto Bismol Chewable tabs and take two before any meal. Worked great for me!

I remember in Hong Kong they always recommended that we not eat any raw vegetables or salads, but everything cooked was OK, including the stir-fried giant roaches…yum, yum!

Ray

[bcc_1_2]

I actually think that he got a pretty damn good deal on his airfare, especially considering the fact that he is not flying into one of the big 3 Chinese cities as his final destination. If you can get a roundtrip to Shanghai in July on a flight that doesn't originate from the West Coast and for less than $800, please point me in that direction because I have never been able to get an airfare that low in the middle of summer - winter/fall/spring yes but not in the summer.

I did a search on vayama and one out of chicago (it stopped in LA... left on a monday in july) cost a little over 800. I have noticed the rates from omaha to honduras and costa rica have gone up so maybe they have elsewhere too. But if you are open with your dates and check all the major websites, vayama, and mobissimo I bet you find something under 800 (tax included). I can't remember which city in the midwest has a non stop to Shanghai... but to my knowledge there is one.

I like traveling and pricing flights in general and am always looking for the best deal. You can go direct all the way to moscow from chicago for example for a lot less than the price to Shanghai which annoys the heck out of me. Of course its the lodging in Moscow that will kill your budget.

If the dates of your trip are a little more confined I know some people that work with a LOCAL travel agent and end up thinking they got a better deal on the flight and hotel than they could find on their own.

[jm21-2]

This is exactly what I was thinking. I do have a female friend who is from hong kong, and maybe city girls in Hong Kong or even Shanghai you might be able to "date" western style (play the field or whatever)... but where you are going it wasn't sounding to me like that is an option. 

I also thought the flight was a little pricey. If I drive a ways I can get a non stop to Shanghai from the midwest at under 800 bucks with tax. Just think it sucks you have to pay so much.

I will say part of me wonders if a trip to Santiago, Chile or even Peru might be something to look into if you'd like to find a culture where you can get a lot of dates and play the field.

I think in HK or Shanghai, probably Beijing and some other cities too, the dating is a bit looser. But ya, this girl was even concerned that I didn't ask my parents permission to meet her, haha.

Where you getting your ticket prices from? This was the cheapest flight I could find after checking probably 2 dozen sites and only because it has multiple stops and a big layover in Tokyo. Other flights to Qingdao were $1300+. Even for Seattle to Shanghai the cheapest I'm seeing is around $840. It seems like HK has the cheapest flights.

I don't really want to date a ton of girls, but was thinking maybe I should have at least talked with a few dozen girls on a dating site or something then narrowed it down. But on the other hand, this girl is very smart, not a flirt, speaks good english, is interested in a lot of the things I am, pretty independent but very strong family values, loves kids, atheist, good looking, good job, good education, very hard working and ambitious....I haven't met a whole lot of girls like that.

[bcc_1_2]

JM I just did a search on vayama where you fly out July 8th and come back July 15th out of Seattle to Shanghai. It cost $760. My thought was if you check all the regular sites, hit up the discounter sites, and even talk to a travel agent maybe you could get it down under $700.

I think what time of day you check the prices matters too. 6 AM EST (shortly after) is when I see the best prices.

You also could try naming your own price on priceline. For destinations that fly the nonstops to the location you want that can be a heck of a deal.

[bcc_1_2]

ok I've played around with some searches and yes rates are up. The best I could do for San Pedro Sula was mid to upper $400s when I've been able to get $325 to $375 earlier. I bet when I start pricing it again in august and sept I'll get better rates again. Maybe the rates are little higher at 5pm CST on a friday too.

Well JM you could fly to San Pedro Sula for under $700. You could fly to Costa Rica for low 600s. you could fly to Chile for $700. You can fly to Manila for low $800s.Whoa Bangkok was expensive mid 800s rising to close to 1k fast.

Rates are not good right now. The economy must not suck enough to hook us up with decent prices.  

[jm21-2]

I usually use bookingbuddy and hit up basically all the search engines it links to. Part of me thinks that in the time it takes me to save $100 of an already low price, I could have billed $100, haha. I've got to plan at least a few weeks ahead and somewhat confined schedule as well. About 90% of my court hearings are scheduled by Friday, held on Friday after, with responses filed the Thursday before the hearing, so if I leave on Saturday and come back on a tues/wed then I'm pretty safe and 10-11 days vacation, especially if I file a notice of unavailability. With the price of tickets to China and flight time I think anything under 9 days or so would be a pain in the butt.

[bcc_1_2]

I personally need to disengage from work so I guess I never thought of the time spent saving money that way. Then I never spent too long looking for flights either. Generally I'd just wake up early before my run that day and do some pricing or booking online. The amount of time you want to take makes sense too. For me (especially if I can get the $325 rate) a quick morning trip is not such a big deal.

What I am wondering (or a little concerned about) is if you don't meet girls from multiple cities (even multiple countries or multiple cultures) will you be going through the "what if" stage when you are considering settling down?

I was just talking about my g/f in Honduras to a friend considering getting engaged. Hey Mike... what if you got the chance to date outside your own home town. Now Mike has the what ifs... haha.

[Capstone]

JM I just did a search on vayama where you fly out July 8th and come back July 15th out of Seattle to Shanghai. It cost $760. My thought was if you check all the regular sites, hit up the discounter sites, and even talk to a travel agent maybe you could get it down under $700.

I think what time of day you check the prices matters too. 6 AM EST (shortly after) is when I see the best prices.

You also could try naming your own price on priceline. For destinations that fly the nonstops to the location you want that can be a heck of a deal.

You have to understand though that actually booking a trip to Asia like this really isn't feasible and certainly wouldn't be worth the money spent. For example, the trip that you describe above essentially amounts to a 5 day trip. When you fly to Asia you always lose a day because you cross the International Date line  - so if you left on the 8th, you would actually arrive the night of the 9th. I have come across discounters like Vayama in the past put I can never find an itinerary which realistically fits my schedule. Fares/schedules like this may work for the backpacker/college student set but for most of us who have a specific timeframe as far as getting away from work goes, it just really does not work out.

[jm21-2]

What I am wondering (or a little concerned about) is if you don't meet girls from multiple cities (even multiple countries or multiple cultures) will you be going through the "what if" stage when you are considering settling down?

I was just talking about my g/f in Honduras to a friend considering getting engaged. Hey Mike... what if you got the chance to date outside your own home town. Now Mike has the what ifs... haha.

Yes, that's basically what I was trying to get across earlier. The what ifs. Of course there will always be what ifs and you have to make a decision at some point. I prefer long, stable relationships, so I don't really care about dating around a lot, but any girl I settle down with has to be pretty dang amazing in my estimation. Of course the problem being that compared to the typical girl where I live, pretty dang amazing is relatively easy to acquire, so then there's meeting more girls from other countries and changing what kind of girl you are comparing your potential mate to. Not comparing her to AWs, but to other girls in her country and to girls from other countries you are interested in.

[bcc_1_2]

JM I always hate sounding so negative because you may well have a great girl across the Pacific waiting for you. But what I am really thinking is you want to go on this adventure and really continue to get your feet wet and figure out who that amazing girl is for you AND the girl on the other side of the Pacific and her parents are thinking courtship and marriage.

Again my brain which is full of horrible thoughts is wondering if you should just meet "friends" in a big city like Shanghai, etc and go from there? Go on that adventure... to China, Thailand, or even latin america and figure out who Miss Amazing is.

In the recent past I've been to Mexico (no not that recent! haha), Costa Rica, Honduras, and Colombia. I'm not dealing with a bunch of what ifs at the moment anyways. 

[jm21-2]

JM I always hate sounding so negative because you may well have a great girl across the Pacific waiting for you. But what I am really thinking is you want to go on this adventure and really continue to get your feet wet and figure out who that amazing girl is for you AND the girl on the other side of the Pacific and her parents are thinking courtship and marriage.

Again my brain which is full of horrible thoughts is wondering if you should just meet "friends" in a big city like Shanghai, etc and go from there? Go on that adventure... to China, Thailand, or even latin america and figure out who Miss Amazing is.

In the recent past I've been to Mexico (no not that recent! haha), Costa Rica, Honduras, and Colombia. I'm not dealing with a bunch of what ifs at the moment anyways. 

No, you have a good point. I have been trying to figure out exactly how serious she is for a while now, haha. It is a very different culture and dating rules. For example, she's said she can't say whether she likes me or not until we've spent a lot of time in person, but at the same time wants me to meet her parents. I've PM'd capstone a bit about this and his experience has been that Chinese girls won't typically date a guy unless the parents have given their consent. It was a little difficult for me to understand at first but I think I'm getting it a bit.

[piglett]

But what I am really thinking is you want to go on this adventure and really continue to get your feet wet and figure out who that amazing girl is for you AND the girl on the other side of the Pacific and her parents are thinking courtship and marriage.

i guess you will know a lot more once you have met this lady in person.
Of course you may be so astounded by the way this girl treats you as compared to the way the typical AW would that you don't even know your right from your left till you get back to the states.

all i can say is take it slow you're still a young man so you have plenty of time to make sure that she is "the one"

piglett

[bcc_1_2]

No, you have a good point. I have been trying to figure out exactly how serious she is for a while now, haha. It is a very different culture and dating rules.

Well I am definiately far from an expert but I do have a friend from hong kong who met a guy from the USA online and they are currently married and just had a kid actually.

She always used to say come back with me to China. She wanted to introduce me to the single girls that are her friends and in her family. The distinct impression I got was that some of the "big city Hong Kong" girls date, but for the most part it is what you have been pointing out.

Even for her talking to this guy online she was very serious about him before they ever met. The rhetoric and seriousness expressed online wasn't necessarily reflective of how serious she actually was and the high expectations placed on this guy in his late 20s going out to meet this girl in her mid 20s and get the parent's permission to date. My understanding is they all met at her grandfather's house.

So just based on what I've heard you are in for quickly meeting a lot of relatives and then they'll decide if you should be courting this girl. And courting seems to mean a pretty fast course to marriage. But hey this is just me conveying the knowledge passed on to me from my friend's personal experience (so it is really only how it went down for her).

[jm21-2]

BCC,

Yes, I think she's probably a lot more serious than what she lets on. I'm not going to be a one week wonder though..just not my style. On the other hand, if I meet her, she's very high quality, we get along together great, etc., I'm not going to ditch her because I haven't dated enough Chinese girls.

Are your friend and her husband happy?

[bcc_1_2]

Are your friend and her husband happy?

Oh no question they are. I was 17 when I first started working with her while going to school. Her husband is a chinese american and the dating pool in a mid size midwest town is small (if you are looking for someone chinese). So he hit the net. At first they would chat online in english because they didn't know they both spoke fluent cantonese.

Her accent was really heavy at first, but going to such a diverse high school I had no trouble understanding what she was saying... and I was the only one  .

She has a strong work ethic and worked hard to get a promotion. As a teen it was just interesting learning all about this international dating process, but looking back the guy clearly hit the jackpot.

She does like shoes and clothes and all that but she is cost conscious. They were living in an apartment and she wanted a home so they saved up and bought one. They both just happen to be two nice people. If I was comparing them to friends with AW wives it is really a sad comparision.

I doubt either of them read the message board but some of their friends might so I'll send a more personal comment to your PM.

[Capstone]

I've PM'd capstone a bit about this and his experience has been that Chinese girls won't typically date a guy unless the parents have given their consent. It was a little difficult for me to understand at first but I think I'm getting it a bit.

I guess that I should clarify this a bit. It isn't that Chinese girls don't date casually because many (especially those who live in the cities) do. But it is totally just that - casual. They do not take the guys that they are casually dating home to meet the parents. Anyone who they consider to be a long term prospect or potential boyfriend will need to be vetted by the parents. That is why I definitely think that it is a good sign that you girl has already said that she wants you to meet her parents - it shows that she does have interest in you.

As far as you guys comparing Hong Kong girls to Mainland Chinese girls, you guys might as well be comparing apples to oranges. Although Hong Kong is now technically under Chinese control it is still a very different & distinct country - different government, currency, language and customs. Girls in Hong Kong grew up under a totally different set of circumstances and way of life than did girls in China and as such their current way of life and how they live life is much different. They of course share many of the same similarities but also have many differences.

[Ray]

When you fly to Asia you always lose a day because you cross the International Date line  - so if you left on the 8th, you would actually arrive the night of the 9th.

 

Yes, BUT…

Don’t forget that on your return trip, you get that day back, so you aren’t losing anything because of the time difference. That’s why you can depart from Asia and arrive on the west coast 15 minutes later (on the clock) because a day is repeated when you cross the date line going East.

When you transit the Pacific on a ship, you actually repeat an hour every day or so going west, then lose a whole day when you cross the Date Line. On one trip, I lost my birthday. But, because of Navy tradition , I (and one other shipmate) had an “Un-Birthday Party”. Steak and lobster dinner with a special cake for anyone losing a birthday because of the date line. It all works out… 

Ray

[Jeff S]

If I was comparing them to friends with AW wives it is really a sad comparision.

I think all of us with Asian gfs and wives would agree wholeheartedly with that.

[TurboSS]

Please post pictures when you go!!

I am kind of in the same boat as you.  I have been talking to a chinese girl almost everyday since April on skype (with webcam)  She is so different from any AW i ever dated.  This girl is so conservative.  However,  we both agree that if I were to come to China in the near future it would be to spend lots of time together see if we match up well and start considering marriage.  She is worried because she is 28 and not married yet.  Apparently thats really old in China to be single.  I still have the what ifs just like you though.  It sucks.  This girl is really awesome and i wish i could just push any what ifs out of my head

I have been to China before just to visit a friend.  I didnt get any shots when i went there.  He warned me that most americans get the runs when they get to china because they adjust their diet.  Somehow i was lucky and this didnt happen to me at all.  I have no idea why.  Maybe because i was less adventerous with the food.  I am a real picky eater.  Also dont drink tap water unless you boil it first.