Will International Introductions do the right thing or not?

[jay5688]

bcc_1_2

thats exactly what I was able to accomplish with the first trip .  I was able to meet many women on my own terms and if I wanted a break or whatever it was up to me. I like this idea plus I wasn't out a huge amount of money. I also enjoy the ability to set my own schedule for the trip. It does work. The girls are very responsive when you tell them you are coming or are in the city.

Sean apparently Jamie wants us to use the common sense approach. That he talks about with the girls,

we should know that if he says the only service he provides is with his lodging , then I should have known already I could not meet his women on my own ,, LOL

as long as the cupid sites exist and a nice meeting place its not a problem for me to meet women in Barranquilla.

thanks Jay

[Jamie]

1. Bertha.  After we broke up I informed your office that she did have a boyfriend in Bogota.  She told me she did and I relayed this to your office and later on I talked to Tiffany because I was surprised to see her still up on your site.

I was initially told you broke up with her because of her behavior at a night club. I knew nothing of a boyfriend until you wrote to me on January  18, 2005 This is what you wrote:
   
“I guess we are still "good friends"..nothing romantic or anything, but I wanted to let you know that she does have a boyfriend. She's had one since September (a few weeks after I left...I think my suspicions were correct about her) and when I talked to her a few days ago...she still has one. It's some guy she went to college with or something. His name is Claudio...or something to that affect.  38 years old I believe. All this comes from her. She told me herself.  The only reason I am letting you know is because I noticed she still has a profile up. I would hate to see some guy get heartbroken or something by getting all wrapped up in her. I think I know her pretty well and... well...you know my opinion of her as a girlfriend or what ever. Last time i talked to her she said she wanted off...I told her to call and tell someone, don't know why she hasn't. ”

I responded the same day and said, “As for Bertha she just called us now asking to be removed.”

If guys came to Colombia with the intention to only meet women without boyfriends there would be a limited number of women for them to meet. Most unmarried women have one or more boyfriends very much like the Colombian guys do. Most Colombian women think you are there boyfriend after only 2 or 3 dates. Now brace yourself so you don’t fall out of your chair: We do not remove girls that have boyfriends. It is not unusual for girls to give us their boyfriend’s phone numbers as a back up numbers to contact them. We are only concerned if the girl is in a serious, committed relationship. If she tells us she is not and is still looking we don’t care or keep taps of who she may be sleeping with during the meantime.  Just as we don’t keep taps of who the man is frivolously involved with during his search. I was talking yesterday to two good-looking 23 and 24 year old clients who were meeting good looking women and I told them assume all these good looking girl you are meeting have boyfriends. Clients that use our primary services and chat with me get the real scoop of what’s going on and how best to deal with it.

I believed she may have been taken off for a time, because I informed Bertha she was still up there... but was later informed some weeks later by Tiffany that she was back up.

Unfortunately there is nothing in her file regarding her comings and goings. We are more detailed about this now but I have no evidence she was ever taken off for a short time and based on the information I was aware of at the time she would not have been.

Tiffany informed me that she was corresponding with a guy and this guy had bought her a plane ticket.  He sent her the money or the ticket (I forget which) so she could meet him in barranquilla because she now lived in Bogota and then proceeded to tell the guy after she had the ticket or money in hand that she couldn't make it because she had to work.  This, I know for a fact, was a lie.

I am aware of no lies from Bertha. She was always free to tell us she wanted to be off the website and when she did she was removed. I have no indications that she tried to take advantage of anyone and from my read of her she did not appear to be that type of person. You would have a better read if you think she is or is not. If I knew the guys name I could look up any correspondence that took place that we were involved with. But at this time I do not know the timelines or the details of what any particular guy may have been doing with Bertha. In general I would not suggest men to buy tickets for girls to come and meet them unless they had been corresponding and knew each other.

She was still on your website after this due to the fact that you had a....soft spot in your heart for her, I would think.  She had a boyfriend when she made her last trip to see me.  I knew it, Tiffany knew it.

Well that conversation was between you and Tiffany and you did not let me know. I reviewed all the emails you have sent me and the only reference to her having a boyfriend was the email I posted above dated 1/18/2006 approximately 5 months after your last visit. I am not sure why you would visit her if you knew she had a boyfriend and I am not sure why she would be with you if that boyfriend was that important to her. Above you stated she had a boyfriend a few weeks after you left and here you say she had one before you visited?

But yet, you continued to keep her on your website until I called her and told her she had to tell your office to take her off.

Yes and this happened January 18,2006. Before this date you told me nothing on this matter as your email references. You are giving me notice for the first time.

This was a known liar, but yet was not promptly yanked off the site, especially after taking that guy for about $200, which was the price of the plane ticket at that time.  I know for a fact she wasn't off your site shortly after this because I remember talking to Tiffany about "why does Jamie still have her on there after she screwed this guy?"

But until Jan 18, 2006 why didn’t you say anything to me? I am not aware of the lies. I would need to have more info regarding what may or may not have taken place regarding any plane tickets and to what extent if any we were involved. All this information shared between you and Tiffany was not documented in her file nor relayed to me. If I had know that she had a boyfriend the process would have been to call her to find out the extent of the relationship and if she wanted to be removed from the website. This boyfriend could not have been that important for her to be taking a trip to see you and to be communicating with other men after you broke up. I had no favoritism regarding Bertha. She modeled for us, which I appreciated, her sister from last we heard had married a client and I was not getting any complaints from anyone regarding her behavior.

If Colombian women are basically all born, habitual liars as you (in a roundabout way) say....your saying this didn't raise a Godzilla size red flag for you?  Come on dude...don't tell me that.

I never said they were born that way. I have dozens of emails from you and I do not see one where you stated she is liar but you do say she is a “good friend” You brought this up to me one time on January 18, 2008. If Tiffany thought she was such a bad person she never took the time to talk to me about this nor did you. She was never labeled to me as a liar, a deceiver or bad by anyone. If someone wanted to make the point that out of the 7000 plus girls that have been with the agency that some should have been removed quicker or handled in a different manner I am sure that is the case. In this case you are going back three plus years and I can only go by what little we have documented. Something does seems very wrong that if she did have a boyfriend why was she not contacted by the office to clarity what the situation was, maybe she was and her explanation was accepted but nothing is documented that we did. So was our process perfect with Bertha, no. But it does not change the fact that we are very diligent and have a sound system in place for removing women.

2.  Now this is about 2004 I'm talking about, but girl #2 was I think related to Karina.  (I think I spelled your wife's name right.)  It may have been her sister (I'm not sure).  Hot looking girl, brunette, I'm thinking about 20, 21 or 22 perhaps...very professional looking.  Looks like she came from a nice family.   I'm not sure, but  my first trip or perhaps before my first trip I told Tiffany that she was one of the first girls I wrote and I didn't even get back a response.  Tiffany's response was..."yeah, I know.  She never responds to anyone".  That's pretty close to word for word.  Tiffany may have been exaggerating but the point is...Tiffany also said she didn't know why you had her on there.  My interpretation...ringer.  That's the only one I ever thought was one on your site, but I believed she was a ringer nonetheless.  Whether she was extremely picky, holding out for a millionaire or whatever...but if she had a habit of not responding to e-mails then, going by your standards you set...she should have been yanked because she was wasting people's time.

if you had concerns about this I don’t know why you did not speak to me about it at the time. I could have showed you evidence when you were here that your believe was wrong. When most very good looking girls first join the agency they tend to be open to a larger variety of guys. As they start getting more attention they become more and more selective. The very best good looking women often attract men around their age and they realize they don’t have to go for an older man when they have good looking 25 year olds pursuing them. They recognize their worth and adjust there requirements. The girl you are referring to was 19. You wrote to her 12/7/2003 and she declined to respond to you on 12/13/2003. I see where another guy wrote to her on 12/3/2003 and she wrote him a letter on 12/08/2003. I also see that of the first 15 girls you wrote 14 of them responded to you. This one girl didn’t. It seems bizarre with such a high success rate you would bring up what you think is a potential ringer from five years ago. This girl was not a ringer. She met one of our clients in 2005 who she married and she now lives in Florida with him. I am sure he is glad she was not “yanked”.

3.  Based on what Jay told me, and I hope he forgives me, he informed you of a girl whose e-mail he bought and he said he wrote you saying that he was told by her that she was seeing someone, but she told you she wasn't and your response was...according to Jay, "maybe she wasn't interested."  and you wouldn't give him another address based on what she told you.  I don't know if he still has the email she sent him or if it's a lie...but if he does have an email of this girl telling him this then this would be another example of not pulling a girl from your site for not being forthcoming.

When a guy tells us a girl is telling him she has a boyfriend we will call the girl to find out what’s going on. In the vast majority of cases the girl will say she does not have a boyfriend but said she did so as not to hurt the guy’s feelings. In this case the girl stated in her reply to Jay we can only be friends now because I am writing someone who will be visiting me for the second time. When we talked to her she said she was only corresponding with the guy and they were not committed. She had also been accepting invitations from us to meet men. We take information the guy gives us and we take information the girl gives us and we utilize our experience to make a decision. We know as I have stated here the women are not going be direct and what they said before may not be accurate. This is not another example of anything but the amount of involvement and work we put in that no other agency or dating site would ever to.

You've yanked girls for less, like some girl saying she thought you ran a "white slave ring" to someone and in all fairness I believe you've yanked ALOT of them...but I personally know of two girls from my own experiences who should have been yanked for good valid reasons, but wasn't.  If Jay is telling the truth about his mishap, then that is at least 3 examples.   Again, out of fairness, I did have a letter I didn't get a response to (It may have even been girl #2) and you gave me another selection.
Read into this what you will...but I know what I know.

And now you know more. As I showed those are not 3 examples where we would have removed the woman and I stand by those decisions. The only cloudy one was Bertha where more should have been done. You were 14 out of 15 Scott that’s being fair.

I remember you remarking to me, personally, that your tired of many of the girls not showing up for appointments.  If you have girls writing to someone and making plans to meet them and not showing...how many chances do they get?

It depends on the situation it could just be one time if we feel it was flagrant, typically it’s two times but there could be exceptions to that. If the guy is on his own we don’t get involved beyond documenting this in the girls file if we are told  by the man. Most guys who use our introductions upon our recommendation don’t write to the girl beforehand.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The he-said, she-said thing:  Well....my first trip down in 2004 I think.  Maybe 2005.  I forget.  It was in May.  Tiffany had been translating telephone calls for me for mainly Katey and one or two other girls. Tiffany and I became friends.  Wrote you and said I wanted Tiffany to be my translator, you said no problem.  Got there and Tiffany had something to do the first day or two I was there and I had some blond named Maria...Bethany...or something, I forget.  She was from Miami.  Nice girl.  Then I had Tiffany for a day I think, maybe not, then I had that skinny girl with braces.  I forget her name.  She was nice too.  I told her that it wasn't anything personal, but I wanted Tiffany when she became available.  This skinny girl with braces told me that she over heard you saying that you didn't want Tiffany with me.  This struck me as odd and she didn't know why you said it, but I asked you about it and you denied it and then the next day....I had Tiffany.  Told Tiffany about it and she believed that was something you would say and then Tiffany told me you fired the girl. You told me later on that you fired the girl because you couldn't have your staff telling clients stuff like that.  Tiffany and I talked alot, became good friends and I could hypothesize about why you'd say it, but I won't.  The point is...from the few times I've been around you I believe the girl.  What reason would she have for telling me that?  I can't think of one.  I knew Tiffany was one of, if not the best, worker you had...maybe you didn't want her out of the office and didn't want to tell me.  I don't know, don't care.

   
I am not sure what girl you are referring to that I fired, but if I did fired someone it certainly would be for good cause. Most businesses would fire employees for divulging information not meant for certain parties. I don’t recollect any of this that you are saying but if I tell you I am going to do something I do it period. I am not pleased that you would make such an accusation when you have evidence that this is not true. You stated:

Wrote you and said I wanted Tiffany to be my translator, you said no problem.”

 

On Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 12:56 PM you wrote: “I am definitely going to want Tifanny as my translator while I am there please.”

Two hour later I replied:

“Thanks
I will see what I can do regarding Tifanny because she is actually my assistance and runs the office. I have some very likeable and better translators than Tifanny which I use for the introductions. Every guy here leaves very satisfied with the girls that work with them and feel they have made a new friend. Maybe we can use Tifanny with Kety. But I will see what I can do.
Jamie”

How you interpret this as “no problem” is beyond me. You have or had this email and you should me more diligent about the facts.

I said all that to say this....I believe you say things, not knowing others will find out and then you change the story a little bit.  Not calling you a liar, but I believe you try to save face the wrong way sometimes.  That's just my opinion.  I don't have to know people all that well to figure some people out in a hurry.

Well you’re wrong if I make a mistake I am not going to explode by facing up to it. I only hope that you will do the same.  I will respond to the second half of your post tomorrow. The Spanish email I posted as being send in Nov. was actually sent Sept 2.

[bcc_1_2]

bcc_1_2, If I were you I would watch my words and not expose and call people names without hearing both sides of the story. I have no idea and really don't care if you have been here or used I.I. but you sure do not know me. You bluntly come out and name me  as the ¨employee he terminated¨ after all the a strong accusations posted by Jamie.

Hey Jamie said he terminated an employee that posted here. You are an interpeter from BAQ right? I just put 2 and 2 together. I didn't call you any names and I'm not telling either side of the story. All that is between you and your former employer. I just pointed out something that looked to be obvious.

What ever issues you have with your former employer have nothing to do with me. You just seemed like the obvious person Jamie was referring too. All I did was state the obvious. Whatever issues you have are your issues. Not mine. I've never been told to be careful when stating the obvious before. I've always felt something was fishy back with your first post on this board. I knew I was missing something. Now I know.

[bcc_1_2]

bcc_1_2

thats exactly what I was able to accomplish with the first trip .  I was able to meet many women on my own terms and if I wanted a break or whatever it was up to me.

For that I am happy for you man! It's all about meeting the right girl. That's why I never get too worked up about anything myself. You hit the various websites. You hit the town... you don't throw a bunch of cash into a blackhole and you have fun... and hopefully find a serious relationship.

  congrats!

[bcc_1_2]

As for Jamie's comments on the boyfriend factor. I kinda agree with him. It can be a great way for a girl to let a guy know she's not wanting to date him. It also could just be flat out true. Crap let me come clean I've got a "special friend" I spend a little time with here in my hometown. We young guys call it friends with benefits. Some of these girls must have a boyfriend they aren't happy with or at least casually date a little. How could an agency owner keep up with that. And how does he decide who to let stay with the agency and who to pull? Tough call sometimes I would suspect. My only concern would be what it says on Jamie's website. He should probably change the part of the website that discusses selling addresses. It should state that you need to stay at his pad and use his interpeters. He does that and I'd say he's in the clear.

[Kiltboy1]

Well if Jamie is genuine about telling the truth(and I do not think he is), then he should use his quote about Colombianas  that he just admitted here about having boyfriends and just put that on his website so all the potential clients can make an informed decision based on THE TRUTH  . Can anyone tell me how many guys would really pay the big $$$$$$$$$ if they knew upfront what he has already gone on record saying what is normal for the women in his agency NONE  ! He has a nice bullpin , but if guys just go with an open mind, they can save the $ 1495 and really meet real women instead of ALREADY HAVE 2 BOYFRIEND WOMEN.


UFF

[sean126]

Findalatina,

Not taking BCC's side, but I think your making a little too much of what he asked.  Actually, I don't think anyone noticed or cared if it was you or not.  Now they might notice.  I don't think he did anything wrong.  If it was or wasn't you then feel free to state it was or wasn't you. 

I think you and BCC secretly have a crush on each other.   Want me to arrange an intro?  LOLOLOLOLOL.  Just joking, don't kill me.

[bcc_1_2]

I think you and BCC secretly have a crush on each other.   Want me to arrange an intro?  LOLOLOLOLOL.  Just joking, don't kill me.

Hahaha. How did you know I was a "Taming of the Shrew" William Shakespeare type guy? I do like em feisty.

[sean126]

Jamie,

Basically I'm hearing..."Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah."  That's it in a nut shell. 

For the sake of brevity....I stand by every single word I wrote. 

Bertha and the other girl should have been pulled.  Was it a big deal to me?  No.  Is it now? no.  Why didn't I say anything to you then?  It wasn't a big deal then or now. 

The guy got screwed, Bertha took the guy for a plane ticket, you believed Bertha when she said she had to work.  This is not "ill" behavior in your opinion?  To me and probably many others...that would be a big red flag.  Rumor was, from more than one of your staff and including Bertha was that you had a crush on her.  Rumor was, you always believed her.  Didn't ask about past incidents, so I can't say what "always believed her" means.  Rumor was and probably still is...you get a little tooooo close to some of these girls.  Not that it's a bad thing, it's your life, marriage or whatever...but on a professional level---doesn't look good, I'll put it that way.  Especially when these girls are up on your website.

Point is and was....you have favorites and your professional standards for pulling or not pulling profiles is not as professional, unmoving or as good as you'd like others to believe.  Every single person from your staff that I've talked to or rather have gossiped to me about you when unsolicited can't be lying, unless....Yes, that's it..it's a conspiracy.  It all makes sense now.  Geeze!  

Does this have anything to do with screwing Jay...not too much.  I was just correcting a statement you made and I quote:

"You might have met someone special from International Introductions because we take great effort to maintain and monitor a valid database of reachable, sincere women."  and also here...."When ill behavior is exposed the woman is removed."   

So women with one or more boyfriends that no one informs your male clients about (not even you) who, by the way, are shelling out sometimes thousands of dollars to meet said "sincere" women...these types are sincere?  You should clarify this on your website as well as you did on this forum.  Given that you pride yourself on honesty and professionalism.   THAT was my point.  It's a load of BS.   Is that a huge deal...well I didn't think enough of it to mention my feelings or incidents before and I probably should have...but I didn't, but now in light of the royal screwing Jay has gotten and your obvious way of trying to dodge, sidetrack and do your "splitting every little minute hair" routine is a little too much at this point.

If you can't remember who you fired or why you fired them...I don't know what to tell you.  I stand by my word.  I didn't want to bring all this to the open forum, but I wanted to keep it in private...as I have stated before. 

As far as the 3 examples...you didn't show diddly.  I stand by my opinion and my statements.  Do I need documentation?  No.  If you have no idea what's going on in your agency...that's for you to work out with your staff.  A more pleasant and approachable personality would help these women want to interact with you more than they absolutely need to.

I was making a side point...but the main point is that you gave Jay a royal screwing with that letter and I believe that if everyone is saying the exact same thing for no obvious reason then I give that a little more credibility. 

Your starting to sound like another infamous agency owner who won't own up to his mistakes with all this..."I didn't know", "I can't remember", "oh, let me split this hair down the the smallest atom and examine every little inch of it and if I find out I'm wrong...well, I'll just lay it at someone else's feet even if it's the client" and not to mention all the "Blah..Blah..Blah.." BS your giving.  Your letter (I believe) purposely screwed anyone who didn't want to use your translators or pay you to arrange the meetings.  No if's, and's or but's. 

If your as Professional as you claim to be, then you need to do the "Professional" thing and give Jay back his money he spent on the emails.  Whether you think your in the wrong or not.  For me, your letter clearly shows what you was really trying to do and it seemed to work. 

Believe me when I tell you without malice that your personal reputation simply can not be tarnished by what I say.  If you think you can put a muzzle on your staff...think again.  People may not tell you what they hear...but don't fool yourself dude.  If I may be honest...you treat your staff extremely rude, you screw around with girls on your website toooo much, your tooo greedy and your personality sucks.  Many people know this already...so don't be shocked to know it's out there.  I mean...every single person says the exact same thing.  Why did I give you rave reviews if this is how I think you are?  Simple...my loyalty was with what I thought your agency stood for.  The good appeared to outweigh the bad.  But now...your greed has gotten simply out of control.  It's one thing to be greedy...it's quite another to "set up" your clients to get milked without informing them beforehand.  That's the only thing I'm having a problem with.

If you have no intentions on giving Jay back his money, then just cut this debate real short and say so and spare us the "blah, blah, blah" BS.  The more you talk and try to wiggle your way out of that royal screwing you gave Jay the more that line is getting blurry between you and that other infamous agency owner who was brutally bashed a few times on here who doesn't like to admit he screwed up. 

Is the money Jay gave you for those emails REALLY this important to you?  Or is your client base, repeat business, word of mouth, your agency's reputation and the reputation of your self proclaimed "professionalism" worth more?  For a suave business man like yourself, that should be a no brain-er.

People can think I'm an idiot or a** hole all day long and it doesn't affect me.  I'm not the one with an agency.  Your the one arguing/debating with an idiotic a**hole.  I can afford to say..."it's the principle of the thing", many times it's not worth the owner of a business to say that to a client.

[sean126]

Jamie,

I've tried to answer each of your original questions to the best of my recollection and ability.  The only question I have, that just requires a yes or no answer is....Are you going to give Jay back his money he paid you for the emails of the girls who canceled their meetings with him?  Not to hard.  It's direct and too the point. 



   

[rpcv]

Well if Jamie is genuine about telling the truth(and I do not think he is), then he should use his quote about Colombianas  that he just admitted here about having boyfriends and just put that on his website so all the potential clients can make an informed decision based on THE TRUTH  . Can anyone tell me how many guys would really pay the big $$$$$$$$$ if they knew upfront what he has already gone on record saying what is normal for the women in his agency NONE  ! He has a nice bullpin , but if guys just go with an open mind, they can save the $ 1495 and really meet real women instead of ALREADY HAVE 2 BOYFRIEND WOMEN.

I can understand your point to a certain extent KB in that I doubt many Gringos would pay $$ to meet ladies if they had prior knowledge the ladies had boyfriends. I know I certainly would not do it. I never minded that the women in agencies were meeting other Gringos though and why should I? I had other dates as well and to me, that is the primary reason agencies exist. However, they believed I was single and I believed the same about them likewise. If I had told them I was already involved with another Colombian lady, I am sure they would have not been pleased.

I am somewhat shocked Jaime mentioned women having boyfriends/being on the site here but this is not clearly stated on his website. Although, in his defense he does mention this: “Discovering each woman´s content and character is a communication process best found through regular letter writing, telephone conversations and time together. We therefore leave the screening up to you, unless you request us to be involved”

Still if client asks about specific ladies in my opinion he should be given accurate information. An alternative is to pay good $ to a reliable translator and just forgo agencies altogether…
 

[soltero]

I can understand and expect attractive women to not be kept wrapped in plastic. Having spent time in Colombia, I don't expect the women to have been kept in a box waiting for me to arrive. Much is being made over the women having boyfriends when I doubt seriously that if they had real boyfriends, their boyfriends would allow them to be seeing other guys. If they are dating, that is to be expected, and even if they happen to be sleeping with a guy or two, it would be extremely naive for anyone to expect that these women are "Barbie Dolls" waiting forlornly in their wrappings for some random gringo to show up while disregarding any guy they happen to be around and see everyday. Some things have to be common sense and one would have to have a certain amount of common sense to make it from day to day.

[rpcv]

Your starting to sound like another infamous agency owner who won't own up to his mistakes with all this..."I didn't know", "I can't remember", "oh, let me split this hair down the the smallest atom and examine every little inch of it and if I find out I'm wrong...well, I'll just lay it at someone else's feet even if it's the client" and not to mention all the "Blah..Blah..Blah.." BS your giving.   If you have no intentions on giving Jay back his money, then just cut this debate real short and say so and spare us the "blah, blah, blah" BS.  The more you talk and try to wiggle your way out of that royal screwing you gave Jay the more that line is getting blurry between you and that other infamous agency owner who was brutally bashed a few times on here who doesn't like to admit he screwed up. 

Sean126: I agree on all the above and this is starting to sound like an old thread on here about the responsibility of the agency owner vs. client. As you might recall from a previous exchange I had with him that coincidently relates to this thread;

Quote: RPCV
To me that is misrepresentation. I am not talking about whether the ladies are interested in him after reading his profile/etc; just the basic fact that the ladies are even available as the agency owner presented on his website

Jaime: “It does not mater if it’s misrepresentation you are still responsible for determining this. Some people fall for fraud others don’t. Those that don’t fall for fraud made the appropriate decisions those that were taken did not.”

However, let’s give Jaime the benefit of doubt. He has stated before that ,

I am saying that I try to satisfy the client and I am saying if you choose a bad agency you are at fault for that choice.

So let’s see if this is actually true. A formal apology and $ back to Jay would be the professional thing to do...

[sean126]

To all of the posters, members, readers and staff:

I understand my credibility as an impartial moderator may be called into question on this thread.  I totally understand that if someone has not read the entire story.  I understand the story is quite wordy and some just breeze through it to get a general idea of what's going on.

However, let me point out a few things so every person fully understands:

1.  I have publicly said 2 or 3 times that I wanted to take this privately and I still stand by that.  Jamie has stated he has nothing to hide.  So...here we are.

2.  I am not attacking Jamie.  Those of you who have been here a while know I am blunt and I say what I think.  Those of you who actually pay attention to my methods know that almost always I say and mention things that illustrate a bigger point.  Almost everything I say is calculating.

3.  I made a few short statements contradicting Jamie's first reply on this thread.  He asked me to elaborate on what I meant, I didn't volunteer it.  I even suggested that I elaborate in private and he declined.  So....I clarified what I meant.  He rebutted, I clarified again. 

4.  I have stated and asked repeatedly if he plans to give Jay his money back, due to the letter/letters he sent out to the women.  Jamie's only response was a question of "what did I do wrong?"  I answered his question.

5.  Mark Anthony was being bashed sometimes out of the clear blue.  People would start threads for no reason at times hoping to start a riot.  People, if I remember correctly, was even reverting to calling MA names and going off on different tangents.   It seemed like once a month or once a week at times people would have a "let's bash Mark Anthony" party, for no apparent reason.  I am just answering the questions Jamie asked of me and I'm still waiting on Jamie's answer to my question. If Jamie says "no, I am not returning Jay's money.  It's his fault he fell for my fraudulent plan" then that will be the end of it. If Jamie continues to evade and play word games and not answer my question...then yes. I will let it go.

6.  Jamie, at least in my opinion, is known to be a shrewd, calculating, intelligent businessman.  He is definitely not an idiot.  I believe given this fact...Jamie knew exactly what he was doing when he sent those letters out and now he is trying to play innocent.  Collateral damage was a calculating move on his part and I truly believe, based on Jamie's business personality, that this is what he was actually counting on.  He could claim "misinterpretation" of the letter and come out clean.  Based on Jamie's business personality...I believe that he was counting on this and it would be easy to play us for a fool.  Collateral damage was, in my opinion, the main strike he was going for.  Jamie is known by people on here and from some clients for "playing with words".   I'm not falling for that song and dance. 

Am I taking this personal?  I can understand if it appears that way.  Short answer....yes.  Why?  I've been heaping praise on his agency and overlooking things I probably should have brought to his attention long ago but didn't.  I cannot overlook what I think is a calculating move, based on Jamie's calculating, shrewd and intelligent business personality to "milk" unsuspecting men out of money and then have the alibi of "misinterpretation" of the letter/letters.  It is not misinterpretation if that is what someone plans to happen.  I am highly offended that someone could take praise as a mode to allow them to do whatever they want hoping no one will notice.  I played a part in that and that is one of the reasons why I take this personal.  the other reason is...What he did is simply not right and there is no other way to see it, given his business personality.  That is an elaborate way to get more money out of someone and to me...that is the same as stealing.  Theft by deception and I also think he is deceiving all of us by his talk of "professionalism".   

The "other" infamous Agency owner lives in his own little dream world and while he may have good intentions, at least when he started out....is no where near the calculating, intelligent and shrewd business level Jamie is at.  Jamie has no excuse and a client falling for a fraudulent agency is no excuse either for milking clients.         

I hope this has cleared up the appearance of being unfair to those who was told to "let it go" about Mark Anthony and I hope it clearly shows my intentions and involvement in this thread.    It bears repeating...I was the one who suggested taking this privately.  Jamie declined.

I invite anyone who has any questions regarding my fairness and credibility on this matter to shoot me a private pm.  I will more than happy to answer your pm.     

[william3rd]

To all of the posters, members, readers and staff:

6.  Jamie, at least in my opinion, is known to be a shrewd, calculating, intelligent businessman.  BETTER ADD VINDICTIVE TO THE DESCRIPTION


 Collateral damage was, in my opinion, the main strike he was going for.  Jamie is known by people on here and from some clients for "playing with words".   I'm not falling for that song and dance. 

.  I cannot overlook what I think is a calculating move, based on Jamie's calculating, shrewd and intelligent business personality to "milk" unsuspecting men out of money and then have the alibi of "misinterpretation" of the letter/letters.  It is not misinterpretation if that is what someone plans to happen. 

 the other reason is...What he did is simply not right and there is no other way to see it, given his business personality.  That is an elaborate way to get more money out of someone and to me...that is the same as stealing.  Theft by deception and I also think he is deceiving all of us by his talk of "professionalism".   LARCENY BY TRICK?


The "other" infamous Agency owner lives in his own little dream world and while he may have good intentions, at least when he started out....is no where near the calculating, intelligent and shrewd business level Jamie is at. HOWEVER, I HAVE SEEN BOOKING AGENTS FOR PROSTITUTES THAT ARE LESS VINDICTIVE AND LESS CONTROLLING
 Jamie has no excuse and a client falling for a fraudulent agency is no excuse either for milking clients.      MAYBE HE STARTED SHARING MEDICATIONS   

I hope this has cleared up the appearance of being unfair to those who was told to "let it go" about Mark Anthony and I hope it clearly shows my intentions and involvement in this thread.    It bears repeating...I was the one who suggested taking this privately.  Jamie declined.

I invite anyone who has any questions regarding my fairness and credibility on this matter to shoot me a private pm.  I will more than happy to answer your pm.  FAIR AND BALANCED REPORTING- WELCOME TO SEAN NEWS!!!   

You guys are taking this stuff way too seriously. Saint Jamie would just as soon stick in yo (expletive deleted) as look at you. It is a slimy business with slimy operators. Being the largest or nicest (expletive deleted) in the bowl doesnt change it. Take it for what it is, pay your Ben Franklins, and hope that you luck out.

[sean126]

Sir Willy,

Your right.  I've said my peace.  If Jamie wants to give an answer about the refund..fine.  If not..that's fine too.  At this point there's nothing he can say that could make this right.  You shouldn't have to shame, brow beat, ect...someone into doing the right, professional thing if your reputation as an honest, reputable and professional company means anything to you.  New people who ask about his agency or Barranquilla will definitely be forewarned.

I'm done debating with him.

[Looking4Wife]

I can understand and expect attractive women to not be kept wrapped in plastic. Having spent time in Colombia, I don't expect the women to have been kept in a box waiting for me to arrive.

But Soltero, isn't that what ordering a "Mail Order Bride" is all about? 

[Jamie]

1 you ask me why I did not call you .. which would be no problem that part is correct. Heck for that matter you knew so much about me and where I was staying and what I was doing you could have contacted me and told me about the email you just happened to send for the second time in the middle of my trip. LOL . since you are so customer related.

I did not know you were here until after we emailed our notice and received one or two calls regarding you. At the same time we knew of no problems you may have been facing because this was never brought to our attention by you or anyone else. You have emailed me many times and you always got an immediate response. You could have emailed me about this also but you didn’t. A small effort on your part could have alleviated any delays you may have been facing. Instead you want to blame me for sending an email referencing parties that had stolen our database. What I don’t understand is if this email went out in the middle of your stay how could it have affected you even if we specifically said ,don’t meet Jay? Not many girls would have seen it immediately. Wouldn’t you have all ready met the women you were planning to meet prior to this email? Wouldn’t you have all ready been in regular communications with these women with a comfort zone built prior to your visit? There had to be some prior communications for the women to feel secure in giving you there phone numbers.

I have had two other not so pleasent conversations with you in the email. The attitude you portrayed when I questioned you about the girls and addresses was not very good , both times. It was, thats tough and thats business sorry. So based on this I chose not to ruin the time I was having and to not waste the valuable time I had left in Colombia to pursue a few bucks.

Email number one: "Jay we just talked to her and she said she is only communicating with a guy and does not have a boyfriend and she is also accepting invitation to meet men. The other two girls check there emails regularly."

Email number two: "It is fairly common when a girl is not interested to say they have a boyfriend."

That’s all I said, to the point responding to your questions. What you did not like was the answer. I don’t provide answers that will make everyone happy and I understand if a client is not happy he may go elsewhere. I do what I think is right and I expect you to do what you think is right in response. I will have clients that will not always be in agreement with me and I accept that.

I have even discussed using your agency"s full service with no lodging and you pretty much slammed me on this.

I did no slam you I told you, “Jay we don’t do introductions for those not using our lodging if you want something in the city you can stay at our office/house.” That is our listed service. Am I expected to accommodate everyone’s request counter to how I designate my business?  How should I have said no to your request Jay without you considering it a slam?

I ask you would you, have called yourself with a history like this knowing you only had so much time in Barranquilla .

I would not have put myself in your position. But if I thought I was being personal harmed as you did I certainly would have called to find out what was going on.

You could have easily fixed the other two issues we had but, you did not, so your track record with me has been less than desireable.

Yes that’s true I could always give the client more than what the service they purchased offers but I don’t. I do what is fair based on the agreed services.

2 Ok since you stared throwing around opinions I have one. IMOP I think the only clients you have, in your eyes is the guys who spend the maximum you charge for your full service and never question you.

Everyone questions me and no one more so than the guys that use our Personal Introductions. I treat all my clients fairly.

3 About the girls Common sense dictates nothing, apparently when dealing with you on any issue, its like dealing with a lawyer or politician .. when you say the girls need to have common sense WOW.

I did not say this you need to read better. I said, "Common sense dictates that your email is being sold on any dating site whether it is directly, through a membership or from advertisement revenues."
Which is different than saying the girls need to have common sense. I guess you feel common sense does not dictate this? Can you tell me how any girl beneifts by being told we sell her email address? From the girls perspective would anything change if her email address was given away for free instead? Do you feel we should tell her how much we sell it for? Where do you draw the line in terms of what we should and should not tell her? Do you think another guy could possibly have a different view of what should or should not be said? Do you see how there can be no end to this?

You are one of the best I have seen at clouding the only problem I had. I am not concerned how you run your business and if you do not disclose to these girls your intentions of selling their information or showing their photos to the world thats between you and them. I just honestly thought it was funny, they had no idea it was happening.

Yes and I thought it was funny you wouldn’t ask them how could they not know it was happening. I gave you the answer with the questions maybe it will come to you a second time:
"Well did you ask her why do you think the agency was taking photos of you? Where did you think those photos were going to go? How was a guy from another country like me going to be able to meet or write you without being able to see such information and how did you think I was going to see it? Did the agency email you any information regarding your photos? Well guess what we do. We tell them how to view their photos on the website. Your translator would have known all this. Having “no clue” is sometimes being clueless."

4 Now, I am so misinformed, thats another way to take away my reputation as being a competant honest poster and shift things to your corner <hence more clouding > .

If you find straight talk cloudy that’s you. You were the one posting with out providing all the details. There is no reference from me that you are not an honest poster and I don’t smirch your reputation or say you are misinformed anywhere quote me if you feel otherwise.

I  know when in any situation, you receive the same information from 3 different people at different times, it makes a good case in my mind, sure some facts may not be exactly the same in your lawyer terms but ,

What words or phrase am I using that you feel are lawyer terms please quote me? And exactly what information am I disputing coming from 3 different people?

  I was there in the middle of this and am not providing second hand information.

I never said you were providing second hand information obviously your information is first hand as is mind.

  So no more clouding the issues with telling us how hard it is to run a business and how tough things are for you.

I am beginning to think “clouding” is your favorite word.

  Any business I have been involved with including my current business is tough, so you will not gain sympathy from me on these problems you have in your business. I am sure any poster we have that has run or is running a business can fill page after page of trouble and problems.

You missed my point. I was not complaining about my problems and I was certainly not seeking sympathy from someone who rewards someone I fire for doing me wrong. You indicated you learned a lot about how Colombia operates and I provide you and others more about how Colombia operates. In return you feel this is clouding issues up. 

5 If you had a theft and you know this person why not send them to jail.
I know thats what would happen if I tried to steal something in a store in Colombia or anywhere for that matter. I know in "business" thats what we do.

Because it’s not that easy in Colombia. I would tell you why but I am guessing you would think that was just more cloud cover.

Also why are you using the same blanket effect, you used in your email to the women, tell us and everyone the persons name and put them in jail. Instead of naming this person you want everyone to believe things and you never come out and say them. More lawyer/politician wording so tell us.

Why would I provide information that is of no value to the receiver? Telling the girls Joe Blow stole my data what good does that do? Joe Blow is not the one calling or ever coming in contact with the girls. Telling the board Joe Blow did it. How does that help in any way? No one likely knows who he is and if they did nothing changes. You tell me how I gain from stating his name?

So tell when dealing with you, do we have use the common sense the girls are supposed to use or should we call our lawyer to interpret all the wording you are using.

I guess I was wrong, “lawyer” seems to be your favorite word. What words or sentences don’t you understand? I am not using any legal terminology or roundabout words. Why don’t you quote exactly what you feel is lawyer talk? Quote me and tell me why you think what was quoted lacks common sense, is legalistic or cloudy and I will try to do better.

I really think you do not like anyone in Barranquilla meeting girls without your permission and your hand in their pocket. IMOP. But thats my common sense talking .

My hand was not in your pocket and you didn’t have to ask me permission for anything so maybe your experience should do the talking instead.

wait let me call my lawyer to see how to respond to your clouding all the many issues (1) .

Your two favorite words again. I would be more than happy to clarify anything you feel was not clear. Take one issue and tell me how I was clouding this up and not providing an understandable response for you?

The email you stand behind is not good for anyone who purchased addresses from you and hope to meet the women on your site without your agency being involved. Based on this the only service anyone could get from you while in BQ would be if they are in your lodging.

That is not true otherwise you would not have met the women you did at the hotel you stayed at.

This is the email that was sent out Nov. 25. Can you quote what sentence or sentences in this email you felt hinder your meeting? And is it untrue?

Greetings from International Introductions

Beware of anyone who introduces themselves as a client or part of International Introductions, or says that they have bought our website, or that they used to work here.
Unfortunately thieves and dishonest former translators have access to our database and they are calling women to meet strange men they have no information about.

The translators at International Introductions help and represent you in a fair way. Translators who don’t work at International Introductions only represent the gentleman. They won’t care for your well being.

Keep in mind that International Introductions only introduces you to gentlemen whose profile you have seen and indicated to be interested in meeting before hand.

International Introductions doesn’t give out your phone number or address to anybody. If a stranger contacts you, you must not communicate with them.

International Introductions has been helping women from Barranquilla find sincere men for over 6 years. For your safety and well being you must not associate with any translator who is contacting you in a dishonest way or saying they’re someone they’re not.

The only phone numbers we will be calling you from are
xxxxxxx

You may save these number in your phone’s contacts so you can know when it’s us calling you.

The only E-mails you will be getting or messages through are o@international-introductions.com y a@international-introductions.com

If you have any questions or concerns about a suspicious phone call or E-mail you might get, please call us at 368 3065. We apologize for any inconvenience this situation might have caused you.

Copy of Spanish version sent out 11/25/08

Un saludo de International Introductions.
Ten cuidado con cualquiera que se presente como cliente o parte de International Introductions, o diciendo que han comprado la pagina de International Introductions, o que antes trabajaban en International Introductions. Desafortunadamente ladrones y ex traductoras deshonestas tienen acceso a parte de nuestra base de datos y están llamando a chicas para conocer a hombres externos sobre quienes no tienen información.

Las traductoras de International Introductions te ayudan y representan justamente. Las traductoras que no trabajan para International Introductions solo representan al caballero. Ellas no protegerán tu bienestar.

Entiende que International Introductions solo hace reuniones en nuestra oficina, nunca en un hotel.

International Introductions solo te presenta caballeros de los cuales tú has visto su perfil y has aceptado conocer con anticipación.

International Introductions no le da tu número de teléfono ni tu dirección a nadie. Si te contactan extraños simplemente no debes comunicarte con ellos.

International Introductions ha estado ayudando a las mujeres de Barranquilla por más de 6 años a encontrar a hombres sinceros. Para tu seguridad y beneficio tu no debes comunicarte ni asociarte con ninguna traductora o traductor que te este contactando de una manera deshonesta o diciendo ser quien no son.

Los únicos números telefónicos que deben llamarte son:
xxxxxx

Puedes guardar esos números en tu celular para que nos identifiques cuando te llamemos.

Los únicos correos de los cuales debes recibir nuestros mensajes son: o@international-introductions.com y a@international-introductions.com

Si tienes alguna pregunta o preocupación acerca de cualquier correo que recibas o llamadas sospechosas, por favor contáctanos al: 368 3065. Nos disculpamos por cualquier inconveniente que esta situación te haya podido causar.

[Jamie]

Sure is nice that the girls can rely on DAD to protect them down there at the agency. ?

William the girls are our customers is that ok with you? Could you give me some specifics why you feel that the women are being overly protected in a father like way, as you say? Please provide the exact quotes from the letter that brings you to this conclusion.

Now who protects the customers?

Well it appears you feel such protection for the women is wrong and if applied to the men would not that also be wrong? Do you have any basis for believing the men are not being protected?

That whole letter thing stinks and smells like severe control issues. Just my opinion.

Would you pull the actual sentences from the letters that makes you feel there is severe controlling taking place. The actual quotes and why? I am sure you don’t want your opinions to be baseless so I looked forward to you answering my questions.

[Jamie]

You have to use his accommodations to use his service. Jamie has stated that to no end .

Wrong, you need to use our accommodations to use only our introduction services.

It is his business and he can do as he pleases, but if there is anybody out that that has the desire and means to open a competing agency in Barranquilla and run it with the client in mind, Jamie would be looking at some help from the Bailout to pay for his BEACH HOUSE .  : .

There are many competing agencies (less than when we first opened) in Barranquilla and none of them have any lodging so you are wrong again.

I find this really in bad taste,

So a private business making a determination of what services they want to provide and how they want to provide such service is distasteful. Some people find any profit seeking company as distasteful are you in that camp?

but he goes after guys that are clueless most of the time.

Every time someone says this, and I suspect you have said this more than once, they refuse to list who these clueless guys are. I don’t believe they are clueless, but I can’t get you to name these guy.  I have past clients that post here why do you refuse to tell us which ones are clueless?

I thought he was an ok guy until he made people use his accommodations,

Yes, I could see where that would make a guy go from good to bad. Clients have been required to use our accommodations for over 3 years so my good stage most have been pretty short.

What a joke, but he is the only guy in Town, so he gets to make the rules,  A PITTY 

The market makes the rules not me. It appears that you feel you should be making the rules: You can’t package accommodations with you introductions. Why does it get you so upset in a competitive industry how I align my business? You are not a client or a potential client but some how you feel you know better than I do how I should stay in business. You don’t think maybe that’s a joke? When we first started in Barranquilla there were over a dozen agencies maybe there is 5 or 6 now. I am not the only guy in town and never have been. I don’t know where you come up with your facts. Please tell us so we can stay away from there.

[Jamie]

All I can say is wow, this is very disturbing to hear. If a person pays for an initial contact and then cannot meet a lady without using the agency translator, that sounds lame to me. I do not know of another agency in Colombia (and I know of at least 5) that have this policy.  Will the next requirement be to eat at "authorized" restaurants?

We do not require anyone to use our translators. This is not stated anywhere on our website or anywhere on this thread by me.

[bcc_1_2]

Jamie,

I've tried to answer each of your original questions to the best of my recollection and ability.  The only question I have, that just requires a yes or no answer is....Are you going to give Jay back his money he paid you for the emails of the girls who canceled their meetings with him?  Not to hard.  It's direct and too the point. 

Not that I don't enjoy the back and forth banter. But this is in reality what the thread is all about. Why continue with the back and forth and ignore the elephant in the room? When newbies or interested parties read this thread in the future to determine what agency to pick... this is question they will likely be focused on. So.....

[Jamie]

My only concern would be what it says on Jamie's website. He should probably change the part of the website that discusses selling addresses. It should state that you need to stay at his pad and use his interpeters. He does that and I'd say he's in the clear.

It is not stated because it is not required.

[william3rd]

William the girls are our customers is that ok with you? Could you give me some specifics why you feel that the women are being overly protected in a father like way, as you say? Please provide the exact quotes from the letter that brings you to this conclusion.
 Well it appears you feel such protection for the women is wrong and if applied to the men would not that also be wrong? Do you have any basis for believing the men are not being protected?
 Would you pull the actual sentences from the letters that makes you feel there is severe controlling taking place. The actual quotes and why? I am sure you don’t want your opinions to be baseless so I looked forward to you answering my questions.

Are you IMBRA COMPLIANT, DAD? Doesnt look like it. So you better raise your profile if you are going to continuing caring for these lost souls. Sooner or later, the consulates will be out enforcing. . . .

As for as spending any time answering your stuff, I choose not to participate in wordsmithing. You screwed the guy- and your letter to your "stable" shrieks control issues to the heavens.

[bcc_1_2]

Are you IMBRA COMPLIANT, DAD? Doesnt look like it. So you better raise your profile if you are going to continuing caring for these lost souls. Sooner or later, the consulates will be out enforcing. . . .

As for as spending any time answering your stuff, I choose not to participate in wordsmithing. You screwed the guy- and your letter to your "stable" shrieks control issues to the heavens.

The only remaining question is will the customer get a refund.